Papa Lazaru 0 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around.... SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards... Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point.... 16123[/snapback] If we went up we just wouldn't have ended up with Keegan and everything that happened. I know what you're saying, but without that game things would be alot dfferent! 16128[/snapback] OK PL, I get where you're coming from with that but then we could say that about many games.... What if we'd won at Anfield and Ewood Park in 1996? What if we'd beaten Partizan Belgrade in the CL qualifier?? I think the present outcome would have been very different had we done so! 16129[/snapback] I spend most of my days desperately trying not to think what would have happened if we'd won at Ewood or Anfield as we would have had the title and probably went on to win many more trophies. In fact if we'd had one, just one tiny bit of luck in the home game wehn we battered manu the title was ours, but NUFC and good luck are not meant to be in the same sentence when it matters! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia 0 Posted August 22, 2005 Share Posted August 22, 2005 In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around.... SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards... Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point.... 16123[/snapback] If we went up we just wouldn't have ended up with Keegan and everything that happened. I know what you're saying, but without that game things would be alot dfferent! 16128[/snapback] OK PL, I get where you're coming from with that but then we could say that about many games.... What if we'd won at Anfield and Ewood Park in 1996? What if we'd beaten Partizan Belgrade in the CL qualifier?? I think the present outcome would have been very different had we done so! 16129[/snapback] In fact if we'd had one, just one tiny bit of luck in the home game wehn we battered manu the title was ours, but NUFC and good luck are not meant to be in the same sentence when it matters! 16132[/snapback] That game was heartbraking. I was only a bairn listening to it on the radio but even I knew that we were going to let the title slip away when Cantona scored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 43841 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 From NUFC.com's match report (sounds like they've got it spot on to me. I can't understand anyone wishing for us to get beat): Since the days when I stood under the Scoreboard on the Gallowgate, those around me have never been happier when they're truly miserable and a late Parker goal would have ruined their misery. There are also those who see a succession of bad results as the quickest way to rid us of our current management. That's taking nose-cutting and face-spiting to a ridiculous degree. This correspondent never wanted Souness anywhere near this club but a change of manager as the transfer window is about to close would be suicidal. Where did it get us last season? 14th. For those looking at this week's Premiership fixtures hoping for a home win at the Reebok, shame on you. This club desperately needs to win some football matches. Quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9652 Posted August 23, 2005 Author Share Posted August 23, 2005 Just for the record. I didn't say that I'm hoping for a defeat, it's just that I'm not really hoping for a win either. At least not as much as I used to hope. It just feals very indifferent at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 43841 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Just for the record. I didn't say that I'm hoping for a defeat, it's just that I'm not really hoping for a win either. At least not as much as I used to hope. It just feals very indifferent at the moment. 16204[/snapback] Don't you think you might feel less indifferent if we did win though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9652 Posted August 23, 2005 Author Share Posted August 23, 2005 Just for the record. I didn't say that I'm hoping for a defeat, it's just that I'm not really hoping for a win either. At least not as much as I used to hope. It just feals very indifferent at the moment. 16204[/snapback] Don't you think you might feel less indifferent if we did win though? 16229[/snapback] Probably, hopefully or whatever. At the moment there are so many ifs that I don't know anything anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 20938 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 From NUFC.com's match report (sounds like they've got it spot on to me. I can't understand anyone wishing for us to get beat): Since the days when I stood under the Scoreboard on the Gallowgate, those around me have never been happier when they're truly miserable and a late Parker goal would have ruined their misery. There are also those who see a succession of bad results as the quickest way to rid us of our current management. That's taking nose-cutting and face-spiting to a ridiculous degree. This correspondent never wanted Souness anywhere near this club but a change of manager as the transfer window is about to close would be suicidal. Where did it get us last season? 14th. For those looking at this week's Premiership fixtures hoping for a home win at the Reebok, shame on you. This club desperately needs to win some football matches. Quickly. 16200[/snapback] You see, I disagree with that. What you perhaps don't understand is that I am convinced we will get relegated with Souness, so want him out as quick as possible. It was Souness that got us to 14th - the right appointment wouldn't have, simple as that. The worst case scenario is that we scrape a few points here and there, enough for Souness to keep his job, but not enough to avoid the drop. On a similar note, if we are going to lose against Manu (surely a dead cert), then we may as well lose spectacularly. I want to start enjoying football again, I want to have hope again. That will never happen with Souness, we've got to get a new start, and the sooner, the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 20938 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Just for the record. I didn't say that I'm hoping for a defeat, it's just that I'm not really hoping for a win either. At least not as much as I used to hope. It just feals very indifferent at the moment. 16204[/snapback] Don't you think you might feel less indifferent if we did win though? 16229[/snapback] Probably, hopefully or whatever. At the moment there are so many ifs that I don't know anything anymore. 16235[/snapback] I have a horrible feeling of ambivalence about our matches now, the same feeling as I had with Gullit in his last days. It's not a nice feeling, but he had to go. As soon as Robson came there was a great feeling of relief, and once more you could truly support the team again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Just for the record. I didn't say that I'm hoping for a defeat, it's just that I'm not really hoping for a win either. At least not as much as I used to hope. It just feals very indifferent at the moment. 16204[/snapback] Don't you think you might feel less indifferent if we did win though? 16229[/snapback] Probably, hopefully or whatever. At the moment there are so many ifs that I don't know anything anymore. 16235[/snapback] I have a horrible feeling of ambivalence about our matches now, the same feeling as I had with Gullit in his last days. It's not a nice feeling, but he had to go. As soon as Robson came there was a great feeling of relief, and once more you could truly support the team again. 16241[/snapback] The main difference between then and now is the fact that a new manager would be serverely restricted by the transfer window being closed. I think that is the main thrust of the argument on .com. I also feel that now, like then, relegation is unlikely because there are simply worse teams around. Mediocrity is a virtual certainty though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9652 Posted August 23, 2005 Author Share Posted August 23, 2005 The main difference between then and now is the fact that a new manager would be serverely restricted by the transfer window being closed. I think that is the main thrust of the argument on .com. I also feel that now, like then, relegation is unlikely because there are simply worse teams around. Mediocrity is a virtual certainty though. 16247[/snapback] Just two games into the season and I already have written off the season. Of course somebody new coming in won't be able to work wonders, though I think with installing some kind of tactics there still could be get something out of the team. Ideally I would like to see a high profile figure giving the job right now that in contrast comes in with a bonus. But I would also willing to see a interim solution until the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Don't worry Isegrim, we'll have something to fight for this season - our premier league status. Up until Saturday I've been the eternal optimist, thinking Souness might still turn it around, even then thinking Luque might make all the difference on Wednesday. Freddy and Souness are making an unholy mess of this club and for those who think there are far worse teams below us - we played one of the worst at Fortress St James' on Saturday and we showed no signs of being better than them. If we get no new players in by next Wednesday we will struggle. Didn't Freddy say that Souness was his last try as chairman? I know he's a lying bastard but if we could dig out that quote and start a petitiion sent both to his office and Sky, we could make things very awkward for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 (edited) In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around.... SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards... Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point.... 16123[/snapback] If we went up we just wouldn't have ended up with Keegan and everything that happened. I know what you're saying, but without that game things would be alot dfferent! 16128[/snapback] OK PL, I get where you're coming from with that but then we could say that about many games.... What if we'd won at Anfield and Ewood Park in 1996? What if we'd beaten Partizan Belgrade in the CL qualifier?? I think the present outcome would have been very different had we done so! 16129[/snapback] All turning points in the clubs history. The home game with manu in 96 as well. If we had won any of that game or the other two, we would have gone on and the club now would be totally different to what it is. I honestly think that Keegan would have gone on to build a real Shankly type dynasty at Newcastle. None of us want to lose but it's true that we have had 2 major defeats by the mackems, ie 1990 and the 2-1 thing, and they both triggered off a change of fortunes for the better. I think that the 1990 defeat was the end of the old McKeag era anyway which triggered the change. Wonder what the mackems would say if they could choose between beating us and triggering a change or losing to us to keep us down alongside them ? Edited August 23, 2005 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 (edited) Aye I hope we get stuffed off bolton and Man U. Shite in the short term, but potentially better in the long run. 16081[/snapback] Absolute crud IMO. I cannot ever hope that we get beat cos it 'would be a good thing in the long run' Can you honestly say you'd sit there and watch us play hoping we'll be beaten? 16087[/snapback] True, but I can honestly say that most of our wins in the last 6 months or so have been met with mixed feelings by me...sort of delaying the execution .... Edited August 23, 2005 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 Turning points........ a decently run club doesn't have turning points - they suffer the occasional embarrasement but they are resilient enough to bounce back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 23, 2005 Share Posted August 23, 2005 (edited) Turning points........ a decently run club doesn't have turning points - they suffer the occasional embarrasement but they are resilient enough to bounce back 16282[/snapback] Yes and No. You can't say the club during the Keegan was badly run Rob, we were a proper football club then, all the top players wanted to play for us. This was Newcastle United living up to what we should be all the time. ManU had a turning point when they beat Oldham and saved Ferguson the sack. Liverpool had one when they lost to Bristol City and sacked Souness, they had another after that 4-4 game with Everton, and the Hyssell and Hillsborough disasters had big effects on their fortunes too. I see your point, after Keegan we appointed the wrong people....but then again shouldn't have gone PLC anyway... I go with the ones here that take the view a few good results, keeping Souness in the job, then being relegated is a disaster. Because I can see it happening and think we should take the steps to avoid it. We would all look back then and say we should have got rid of Souness in August. Edited August 23, 2005 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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