Pope: "Muhammad has brought only evil and inhuman things".

[Happy Face 29]

It's all goping to kick off...

 

A statement from the Vatican has failed to quell criticism of Pope Benedict XVI from Muslim leaders, after he made a speech about the concept of holy war.

Speaking in Germany, the Pope quoted a 14th Century Christian emperor who said Muhammad had brought the world only "evil and inhuman" things.

 

Pakistan's parliament passed a resolution on Friday criticising the Pope for making "derogatory" comments.

 

The Vatican said the Pope had not intended to offend Muslims.

 

"It is clear that the Holy Father's intention is to cultivate a position of respect and dialogue towards other religions and cultures, and that clearly includes Islam," said chief Vatican spokesman Federico Lombardi in a statement.

 

But in spite of the statement, the pontiff returned to Rome to face a barrage of criticism, reports the BBC's David Willey in Rome.

 

The head of the Muslim Brotherhood said the Pope's remarks "aroused the anger of the whole Islamic world".

 

Violence and faith

 

In his speech at Regensburg University, the German-born Pope explored the historical and philosophical differences between Islam and Christianity, and the relationship between violence and faith.

 

Stressing that they were not his own words, he quoted Emperor Manual II Paleologos of the Byzantine Empire, the Orthodox Christian empire which had its capital in what is now the Turkish city of Istanbul.

 

The emperor's words were, he said: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

 

Benedict said "I quote" twice to stress the words were not his and added that violence was "incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul".

 

'Angry and hurt'

 

Pakistan's parliament passed a resolution demanding that the Pope retract his remarks "in the interest of harmony between religions".

 

"The derogatory remarks of the Pope about the philosophy of jihad and Prophet Mohammed have injured sentiments across the Muslim world and pose the danger of spreading acrimony among the religions," the AFP news agency quoted the resolution by the country's national assembly as saying.

 

Meanwhile, the "hostile" remarks drew a demand for an apology from a top religious official in Turkey - where the Pope is due in November on his first papal visit to a Muslim country.

 

Ali Bardakoglu recalled atrocities committed by Roman Catholic Crusaders against Orthodox Christians and Jews, as well as Muslims, in the Middle Ages.

 

In Egypt, Muslim Brotherhood head Mohammed Mahdi Akef said the Pope's words "do not express correct understanding of Islam and are merely wrong and distorted beliefs being repeated in the West".

 

In a statement, he was "astonished that such remarks come from someone who sits on top of the Catholic church which has its influence on the public opinion in the West".

 

Sheikh Youssef al-Qardawi, a prominent Muslim cleric in Qatar, rejected the Pope's comments, in remarks reported by Reuters.

 

"Muslims have the right to be angry and hurt by these comments from the highest cleric in Christianity," Mr Qardawi reportedly said.

 

"We ask the Pope to apologise to the Muslim nation for insulting its religion, its Prophet and its beliefs."

 

The 57-nation Organisation of the Islamic Conference also said it regretted the Pope's remarks, and news agencies reported a furious reaction on Islamic websites.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5347876.stm

 

 

EDIT: Sorry Rob, I know this is your job. Your output has significantly dropped though.

Edited September 15, 2006 by Happy Face

[Meenzer 15347]

http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/play_uk.php?id=1627593

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3788]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

[Renton 21048]

From an admittedly limited knowledge base, I'd have to say that this seems about right to me. If you want to make direct comparisons between Jesus and Mohammed for instance, Jesus comes across as a far more credible "better" person. Mind, the God of the old testament they both share is obviously a tyrannical sadist.

 

No doubt some muslims will now go on to prove how peaceful their religion is by having a violent demonstration against the Catholic church.

[Renton 21048]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Mohammed an incredibly rich land lord who disappeared into a cave for 3 days, claiming he had met the angel Gabriel. Yeah, right.

 

Islam has always been spread by the sword but then so has christianity.

[Gemmill 44107]

From an admittedly limited knowledge base, I'd have to say that this seems about right to me. If you want to make direct comparisons between Jesus and Mohammed for instance, Jesus comes across as a far more credible "better" person. Mind, the God of the old testament they both share is obviously a tyrannical sadist.

 

No doubt some muslims will now go on to prove how peaceful their religion is by having a violent demonstration against the Catholic church.

 

Suicide bombings in Vatican City to prove that Mohammed is a man of peace tbh.

[ChezGiven 0]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3788]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Mohammed an incredibly rich land lord who disappeared into a cave for 3 days, claiming he had met the angel Gabriel. Yeah, right.

 

Islam has always been spread by the sword but then so has christianity.

 

 

Actually there is no historical records of Mohammed of the time he was around (There is a good word to describe that but I have forgotten it). All writings about Mohammed come from around at least 100 years after his death. So people can't say he was this or that with any degree of certainty.

[Monster 0]

I must say it's nice of the former Hitler Youth member who is head of the church that aided top Nazi's to escape trial in 1945 in exchange for a huge pile of treasure pludered from across Europe and currently residing in Swiss banks to tell us all how evil Mohammed was eh?

 

Every religion is just based on lies and half-truths and every one of them have gone to war to protect their slice of the pie, so Benny the Jew-gasser is half right. But it's not just Mohammed that's evil.......

[spongebob toonpants 3902]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

 

 

I choose to base my reaction on my established dislike of the Pope, and condemn this statement as not only stupid but also unhelpful and dangerous. In fact the last thing we need.

 

Before people go all Leazes on me I hate all organised religion equally, they are all the problem

[spongebob toonpants 3902]

I must say it's nice of the former Hitler Youth member who is head of the church that aided top Nazi's to escape trial in 1945 in exchange for a huge pile of treasure pludered from across Europe and currently residing in Swiss banks to tell us all how evil Mohammed was eh?

 

Every religion is just based on lies and half-truths and every one of them have gone to war to protect their slice of the pie, so Benny the Jew-gasser is half right. But it's not just Mohammed that's evil.......

 

 

Very nicely put

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3788]

I must say it's nice of the former Hitler Youth member who is head of the church that aided top Nazi's to escape trial in 1945 in exchange for a huge pile of treasure pludered from across Europe and currently residing in Swiss banks to tell us all how evil Mohammed was eh?

 

Every religion is just based on lies and half-truths and every one of them have gone to war to protect their slice of the pie, so Benny the Jew-gasser is half right. But it's not just Mohammed that's evil.......

 

 

Amen to that.

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius

Edited September 15, 2006 by Kevin Carr's Gloves

[Toonpack 9110]

http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/play_uk.php?id=1627593

 

 

Nice one Meenzer

[ChezGiven 0]

There are definitely sections of the Qu'ran that incite violence

 

The bible is just as bad.

 

Difference being that one of the religions has had its 'age of enlightenment', the other hasnt.

[Rob W 0]

I must say it's nice of the former Hitler Youth member who is head of the church that aided top Nazi's to escape trial in 1945 in exchange for a huge pile of treasure pludered from across Europe and currently residing in Swiss banks to tell us all how evil Mohammed was eh?

 

Every religion is just based on lies and half-truths and every one of them have gone to war to protect their slice of the pie, so Benny the Jew-gasser is half right. But it's not just Mohammed that's evil.......

 

 

Very nicely put

 

 

Took the words right out of my mouth.........................

[Gemmill 44107]

Benny the jew-gasser.

[Renton 21048]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

 

 

I choose to base my reaction on my established dislike of the Pope, and condemn this statement as not only stupid but also unhelpful and dangerous. In fact the last thing we need.

 

Before people go all Leazes on me I hate all organised religion equally, they are all the problem

 

I might be biased, and in fact I am, but I actually do find islam a particularly reprehensible faith and dislike the socieities it has created immensely. The worst aspect of it is the fact that you cannot crticise it without having a fatwa put on you, but I find it wrong on so many levels. It basically belongs in the dark ages, if there even.

 

Other faiths have their problems but none have led to so many problems as islam imo.

[Guest alex]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Mohammed an incredibly rich land lord who disappeared into a cave for 3 days, claiming he had met the angel Gabriel. Yeah, right.

 

Islam has always been spread by the sword but then so has christianity.

 

 

Actually there is no historical records of Mohammed of the time he was around (There is a good word to describe that but I have forgotten it). All writings about Mohammed come from around at least 100 years after his death. So people can't say he was this or that with any degree of certainty.

Regarding the writing of the Koran though, iirc, it is supposed to be transcribed directly from the orations Mohammed gave in Mecca which came directly from the word of God he received via the Angel Gabriel (Djebril {sp?} in Arabic). The truth of it, therefore is supposed to be that it is the direct word of God/Allah. As for Mohammed's wealth. I believe it was his first wife (Kadiga iirc) that his wealth came from (I think she was a rich widow).

[Renton 21048]

There are definitely sections of the Qu'ran that incite violence

 

The bible is just as bad.

 

Difference being that one of the religions has had its 'age of enlightenment', the other hasnt.

 

Agreed.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3788]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Mohammed an incredibly rich land lord who disappeared into a cave for 3 days, claiming he had met the angel Gabriel. Yeah, right.

 

Islam has always been spread by the sword but then so has christianity.

 

 

Actually there is no historical records of Mohammed of the time he was around (There is a good word to describe that but I have forgotten it). All writings about Mohammed come from around at least 100 years after his death. So people can't say he was this or that with any degree of certainty.

Regarding the writing of the Koran though, iirc, it is supposed to be transcribed directly from the orations Mohammed gave in Mecca which came directly from the word of God he received via the Angel Gabriel (Djebril {sp?} in Arabic). The truth of it, therefore is supposed to be that it is the direct word of God/Allah. As for Mohammed's wealth. I believe it was his first wife (Kadiga iirc) that his wealth came from (I think she was a rich widow).

 

 

Yeah she was. The first word of the q'uran is Read Mohammed said he couldn't and the angel gave him the power to do so. This proved it was the word of god. Of course we only have his word for that. He was a respected moderator between factions before this and was 40 when he got given the word. So I find it hard to believe he couldn't Read. I believe he wanted to unite the poorer people unhappy at the time. Which he did. The Arabs wanted their own Messiah and that is what he gave them.

[Guest alex]

I must say it's nice of the former Hitler Youth member who is head of the church that aided top Nazi's to escape trial in 1945 in exchange for a huge pile of treasure pludered from across Europe and currently residing in Swiss banks to tell us all how evil Mohammed was eh?

 

Every religion is just based on lies and half-truths and every one of them have gone to war to protect their slice of the pie, so Benny the Jew-gasser is half right. But it's not just Mohammed that's evil.......

Aye, and while you can debate the 'truth' or otherwise of what he said until you are blue in the face the comments are terribly unhelpful in terms of relationships between both Catholicism and Islam and in general in the current climate in the world.

[Guest alex]

So did Mohammed tell people to spread the faith with the sword?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Mohammed an incredibly rich land lord who disappeared into a cave for 3 days, claiming he had met the angel Gabriel. Yeah, right.

 

Islam has always been spread by the sword but then so has christianity.

 

 

Actually there is no historical records of Mohammed of the time he was around (There is a good word to describe that but I have forgotten it). All writings about Mohammed come from around at least 100 years after his death. So people can't say he was this or that with any degree of certainty.

Regarding the writing of the Koran though, iirc, it is supposed to be transcribed directly from the orations Mohammed gave in Mecca which came directly from the word of God he received via the Angel Gabriel (Djebril {sp?} in Arabic). The truth of it, therefore is supposed to be that it is the direct word of God/Allah. As for Mohammed's wealth. I believe it was his first wife (Kadiga iirc) that his wealth came from (I think she was a rich widow).

 

 

Yeah she was. The first word of the q'uran is Read Mohammed said he couldn't and the angel gave him the power to do so. This proved it was the word of god. Of course we only have his word for that. He was a respected moderator between factions before this and was 40 when he got given the word. So I find it hard to believe he couldn't Read. I believe he wanted to unite the poorer people unhappy at the time. Which he did. The Arabs wanted their own Messiah and that is what he gave them.

Possible he couldn't read though, I think (in general) only scribes could. I think the Arabic storytelling tradition was (and perhaps still is in some places) based on passing tales from generation to generation rather than writing them down. Similar to traditional Indian music in that respect I think.

[spongebob toonpants 3902]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

 

 

I choose to base my reaction on my established dislike of the Pope, and condemn this statement as not only stupid but also unhelpful and dangerous. In fact the last thing we need.

 

Before people go all Leazes on me I hate all organised religion equally, they are all the problem

 

I might be biased, and in fact I am, but I actually do find islam a particularly reprehensible faith and dislike the socieities it has created immensely. The worst aspect of it is the fact that you cannot crticise it without having a fatwa put on you, but I find it wrong on so many levels. It basically belongs in the dark ages, if there even.

 

Other faiths have their problems but none have led to so many problems as islam imo.

 

 

All as bad as each other. All as wrong as each other All evil

[Guest alex]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

 

 

I choose to base my reaction on my established dislike of the Pope, and condemn this statement as not only stupid but also unhelpful and dangerous. In fact the last thing we need.

 

Before people go all Leazes on me I hate all organised religion equally, they are all the problem

 

I might be biased, and in fact I am, but I actually do find islam a particularly reprehensible faith and dislike the socieities it has created immensely. The worst aspect of it is the fact that you cannot crticise it without having a fatwa put on you, but I find it wrong on so many levels. It basically belongs in the dark ages, if there even.

 

Other faiths have their problems but none have led to so many problems as islam imo.

 

 

All as bad as each other. All as wrong as each other All evil

I agree with SB there. I think you are on very dangerous ground once you start saying one is worse than the other. I also think it's inaccurate as Christianity has a very bloody past and you could make a very strong argument that even today you have the example of the very worrying influence the religious right in America has over that countries foreign policy.

[ChezGiven 0]

You'd need to see a transcript of the speech to judge it.

 

 

I choose to base my reaction on my established dislike of the Pope, and condemn this statement as not only stupid but also unhelpful and dangerous. In fact the last thing we need.

 

Before people go all Leazes on me I hate all organised religion equally, they are all the problem

 

I might be biased, and in fact I am, but I actually do find islam a particularly reprehensible faith and dislike the socieities it has created immensely. The worst aspect of it is the fact that you cannot crticise it without having a fatwa put on you, but I find it wrong on so many levels. It basically belongs in the dark ages, if there even.

 

Other faiths have their problems but none have led to so many problems as islam imo.

 

 

All as bad as each other. All as wrong as each other All evil

I agree with SB there. I think you are on very dangerous ground once you start saying one is worse than the other. I also think it's inaccurate as Christianity has a very bloody past and you could make a very strong argument that even today you have the example of the very worrying influence the religious right in America has over that countries foreign policy.

 

Thats a very good point alex. The religious right in america is arguably behind the very bloody and violent US foreign policy.