Isegrim 9917 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 9/10 just because it proves that our fans are as fickle as all others 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 22243 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 2 minutes ago, Isegrim said: 9/10 just because it proves that our fans are as fickle as all others mate, complaining they we haven’t signed anyone that improves the first team is not being fickle. The investment since the takeover has been superb and consistent - credit where it’s due - but this is a Mike Ashley window as things stands. Why pretend otherwise? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 31280 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 5 minutes ago, Isegrim said: 1/10 just because it proves that our fans expect competency FYp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35687 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 4 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said: mate, complaining they we haven’t signed anyone that improves the first team is not being fickle. The investment since the takeover has been superb and consistent - credit where it’s due - but this is a Mike Ashley window as things stands. Why pretend otherwise? Howay, man. We’d have sold players we’d never have signed if you’re going down that rabbit hole. That as not saying criticism isn’t valuable d. But the Ashley comparison? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 22243 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Alex said: Howay, man. We’d have sold players we’d never have signed if you’re going down that rabbit hole. That as not saying criticism isn’t valuable d. But the Ashley comparison? Okay. Perhaps the Ashley comparison was overblown because we haven’t sold one of our star players at the eleventh hour. But we haven’t signed anyone that improves the first team. I’m not saying the ambition has gone but if this is still the case after the window closes, something has gone seriously wrong. The “project” which until now has been all positive is in risk of being derailed. If you don’t buy players that improve the team, you go backwards. And you risk losing the likes of Bruno, Isak and Gordon, who are all good enough to play in the champions league if your ambition can’t keep up with theirs. Isak was livid with Longstaff against Bournemouth the other day for not playing him in. They need and deserve better players around them and if they don’t get them they will start agitating to move. Edited August 29 by Dr Gloom 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9917 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 11 minutes ago, ewerk said: FYp Rather mlfed my post. We should just have thrown money at Will Grigg for the sake of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 31280 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 6 minutes ago, Isegrim said: Rather mlfed my post. We should just have thrown money at Will Grigg for the sake of it Because the alternative was spending next to nothing? That’s how well run clubs operate is it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35687 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 12 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said: Okay. Perhaps the Ashley comparison was overblown because we haven’t sold one of our star players at the eleventh hour. But we haven’t signed anyone that improves the first team. I’m not saying the ambition has gone but if this is still the case after the window closes, something has gone seriously wrong. The “project” which until now has been all positive is in risk of being derailed. If you don’t buy players that improve the team, you go backwards. And you risk losing the likes of Bruno, Isak and Gordon, who are all good enough to play in the champions league if your ambition can’t keep up with theirs. Isak was livid with Longstaff against Bournemouth the other day for not playing him in. The need deserve better players around them and if they don’t get them they will start agitating to move. I’m pissed and at a wedding so I’m not going to try and get into the minutiae. And I agree in large part about this particular window, mate. Just thought it was worth highlighting the Ashley comparison was unfair. Although understandable because it is so much a part of recent past and has tainted our view of the way the club operates. I could go on but the disco is so fucking abysmal I might advocate the extermination of humanity or the early onset of the heat death of the universe if I continue 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9917 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 5 minutes ago, ewerk said: Because the alternative was spending next to nothing? That’s how well run clubs operate is it? I don’t think that there has been any intent to spend nothing like under fat Mike. But we seem not want to spend money on players we don’t really want and can’t spend money on the players we want as other club refuse to do deals on the terms we consider reasonable. The window could have been better obvious but I am really not sure how much of this is really our fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4869 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 6 minutes ago, Isegrim said: But we seem not want to spend money on players we don’t really want and can’t spend money on the players we want as other club refuse to do deals on the terms we consider reasonable. I mean with all respect, that’s just waffle and pretty much the same criteria for most clubs. If we want to compete with the elite, we have to do so much better than we have this window. It should not even be up for discussion that as things stand, with 24 hours to go, our starting 11 has not been strengthened. The teams we are trying to compete against have strengthened. That does not bode well for the season and could lead to an exodus of talent going forward and even jeopardise EH’s standing with PFP. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9917 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said: I mean with all respect, that’s just waffle and pretty much the same criteria for most clubs. If we want to compete with the elite, we have to do so much better than we have this window. It should not even be up for discussion that as things stand, with 24 hours to go, our starting 11 has not been strengthened. The teams we are trying to compete against have strengthened. That does not bode well for the season and could lead to an exodus of talent going forward and even jeopardise EH’s standing with PFP. We have tried to strengthen by well overpaying for a player but even that hasn’t worked in a field of supply and demand. Seriously, I never considered a lot of people to be as simplistic as they seem to be. Edited August 29 by Isegrim 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35687 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 Steps megamix now ffs 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonotl 3146 Posted August 29 Share Posted August 29 I think it's perfectly fair and reasonable to say that it is not acceptable for our department of people involved in sourcing transfers to only identify one target to improve the first team for the transfer window, especially when that target doesn't seem to be for sale. We can talk about availability until the cows come home. We can talk about other good players going to other clubs too. We can talk about who wants to come here and who doesn't. We can talk about wages, ambition and a million other factors. It's all guesswork on our part for the most part. And it's fun (most of the time) and very low stakes all of the time. It seems like it is possible that the market wasn't favourable for the transfers to materialise the way anyone wanted them to materialise. However, it is the job of certain people to allow for such an occurrence and have plans to mitigate it. If we want to talk about simplistic then having a single solitary transfer target to improve the first team for the entire window. That's simplistic. It's also naive. It's setting yourself up to be exploited by a selling club that knows they have you on the hook. And for people to determine that these things are the case as a necessary precondition of market availability also seems simplistic. It's possible. But not necessarily so and so questions should be asked. It seems naive to suggest that nobody should challenge the approach taken by the people in charge at the club to suggest that it could've been possible to find another way and absolutely should have been possible given the resources and expertise at the club. From my perspective, the argument that the people at the club know best means that in most circumstances where things could have gone better that they should have known better. They're experts in their field. I agree with that. We have hired some impressive operators. That makes failure less conceivable but it doesn't make it more excusable. They could have done something different. And in a results based business it may well turn out that they should've done something different. And for that they deserve criticism. I don't agree to the automatic determination that the top brass have a monopoly on making correct decisions in a business so overwhelmed with risk and uncertainty. It's a risk to sign a player that there may be questions over. It's a risk to sign Guehi at an inflated transfer fee. And it's a risk to sign nobody at all. There's nothing necessarily wise about keeping our powder dry nor is there anything necessarily imprudent about buying a player that wasn't our first choice. This is all conjecture and opinions for the most part and beyond that it's sheer blind luck. I find it pretty useless to accuse each other of a lack of foresight in a situation where there is limited foresight for everyone. At the end of the day, I'm thankful for the complainers on the board because for the most part they drive the conversation. Otherwise we'd all be sitting around watching the ivory tower dwelling so-called accountants debate probabilities around League Cup draws every day. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinRobin 11666 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 3 hours ago, toonotl said: I think it's perfectly fair and reasonable to say that it is not acceptable for our department of people involved in sourcing transfers to only identify one target to improve the first team for the transfer window, especially when that target doesn't seem to be for sale. We can talk about availability until the cows come home. We can talk about other good players going to other clubs too. We can talk about who wants to come here and who doesn't. We can talk about wages, ambition and a million other factors. It's all guesswork on our part for the most part. And it's fun (most of the time) and very low stakes all of the time. It seems like it is possible that the market wasn't favourable for the transfers to materialise the way anyone wanted them to materialise. However, it is the job of certain people to allow for such an occurrence and have plans to mitigate it. If we want to talk about simplistic then having a single solitary transfer target to improve the first team for the entire window. That's simplistic. It's also naive. It's setting yourself up to be exploited by a selling club that knows they have you on the hook. And for people to determine that these things are the case as a necessary precondition of market availability also seems simplistic. It's possible. But not necessarily so and so questions should be asked. It seems naive to suggest that nobody should challenge the approach taken by the people in charge at the club to suggest that it could've been possible to find another way and absolutely should have been possible given the resources and expertise at the club. From my perspective, the argument that the people at the club know best means that in most circumstances where things could have gone better that they should have known better. They're experts in their field. I agree with that. We have hired some impressive operators. That makes failure less conceivable but it doesn't make it more excusable. They could have done something different. And in a results based business it may well turn out that they should've done something different. And for that they deserve criticism. I don't agree to the automatic determination that the top brass have a monopoly on making correct decisions in a business so overwhelmed with risk and uncertainty. It's a risk to sign a player that there may be questions over. It's a risk to sign Guehi at an inflated transfer fee. And it's a risk to sign nobody at all. There's nothing necessarily wise about keeping our powder dry nor is there anything necessarily imprudent about buying a player that wasn't our first choice. This is all conjecture and opinions for the most part and beyond that it's sheer blind luck. I find it pretty useless to accuse each other of a lack of foresight in a situation where there is limited foresight for everyone. At the end of the day, I'm thankful for the complainers on the board because for the most part they drive the conversation. Otherwise we'd all be sitting around watching the ivory tower dwelling so-called accountants debate probabilities around League Cup draws every day. Are we certain that there was only one target? Clearly that lad who went to Chelsea was first cab off the rank, but that didn't work. Seems Palace were prepared to discuss a move, but pissed us around. Other than that, another couple of options have signed new contracts or agreed to go elsewhere. Not saying you are wrong about the rest of it, but I don't think that, at any stage, there has only been one target. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinRobin 11666 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 5 hours ago, Alex said: I’m pissed and at a wedding so I’m not going to try and get into the minutiae. And I agree in large part about this particular window, mate. Just thought it was worth highlighting the Ashley comparison was unfair. Although understandable because it is so much a part of recent past and has tainted our view of the way the club operates. I could go on but the disco is so fucking abysmal I might advocate the extermination of humanity or the early onset of the heat death of the universe if I continue Is it wedding season already? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeAdmirer 1288 Posted August 30 Author Share Posted August 30 Our players trippier and chook started talking in the media about how they would love to with guehi at Newcastle all the way back in June. That may pissed crystal off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 46365 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 6 hours ago, toonotl said: I think it's perfectly fair and reasonable to say that it is not acceptable for our department of people involved in sourcing transfers to only identify one target to improve the first team for the transfer window, especially when that target doesn't seem to be for sale. We can talk about availability until the cows come home. We can talk about other good players going to other clubs too. We can talk about who wants to come here and who doesn't. We can talk about wages, ambition and a million other factors. It's all guesswork on our part for the most part. And it's fun (most of the time) and very low stakes all of the time. It seems like it is possible that the market wasn't favourable for the transfers to materialise the way anyone wanted them to materialise. However, it is the job of certain people to allow for such an occurrence and have plans to mitigate it. If we want to talk about simplistic then having a single solitary transfer target to improve the first team for the entire window. That's simplistic. It's also naive. It's setting yourself up to be exploited by a selling club that knows they have you on the hook. And for people to determine that these things are the case as a necessary precondition of market availability also seems simplistic. It's possible. But not necessarily so and so questions should be asked. It seems naive to suggest that nobody should challenge the approach taken by the people in charge at the club to suggest that it could've been possible to find another way and absolutely should have been possible given the resources and expertise at the club. From my perspective, the argument that the people at the club know best means that in most circumstances where things could have gone better that they should have known better. They're experts in their field. I agree with that. We have hired some impressive operators. That makes failure less conceivable but it doesn't make it more excusable. They could have done something different. And in a results based business it may well turn out that they should've done something different. And for that they deserve criticism. I don't agree to the automatic determination that the top brass have a monopoly on making correct decisions in a business so overwhelmed with risk and uncertainty. It's a risk to sign a player that there may be questions over. It's a risk to sign Guehi at an inflated transfer fee. And it's a risk to sign nobody at all. There's nothing necessarily wise about keeping our powder dry nor is there anything necessarily imprudent about buying a player that wasn't our first choice. This is all conjecture and opinions for the most part and beyond that it's sheer blind luck. I find it pretty useless to accuse each other of a lack of foresight in a situation where there is limited foresight for everyone. At the end of the day, I'm thankful for the complainers on the board because for the most part they drive the conversation. Otherwise we'd all be sitting around watching the ivory tower dwelling so-called accountants debate probabilities around League Cup draws every day. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonpack 10102 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 8 hours ago, Dr Gloom said: mate, complaining they we haven’t signed anyone that improves the first team is not being fickle. The investment since the takeover has been superb and consistent - credit where it’s due - but this is a Mike Ashley window as things stands. Why pretend otherwise? Utter garbage, we didn’t sell everyone who was saleable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrokendoll 9510 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 9/10 solely down to the blatant corruption of forking out £20m for forests 3rd choice keeper who they'd paid £6m for a season or so before. we showed you masters. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonpack 10102 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 Just now, thebrokendoll said: 9/10 solely down to the blatant corruption of forking out £20m for forests 3rd choice keeper who they'd paid £6m for a season or so before. we showed you masters. We didn’t though, did we. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrokendoll 9510 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 58 minutes ago, Toonpack said: We didn’t though, did we. you think masters isn't scared of us then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonpack 10102 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 52 minutes ago, thebrokendoll said: you think masters isn't scared of us then? We didn’t “fork out” £20 million on a keeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15755 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 10 hours ago, Alex said: Steps megamix now ffs Crikey, CT rebounded quickly 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaser 1279 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 14hrs of excitement to come...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrokendoll 9510 Posted August 30 Share Posted August 30 11 minutes ago, Toonpack said: We didn’t “fork out” £20 million on a keeper. well thank the lord for that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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