Euro 24

[Kid Dynamite 7169]

Moaning about a lack of press against the Danes is fucking ludicrous given Gordon and Bowen have the highest pressing stats in the league. Likewise moaning about a lack of attacking intent when Palmer, Watkins and Gordon have more goals/assists this season than most of our starting XI.

 

Foden is the new Scholes. Being shoved out wide to accommodate Bellingham/Rice (Lampard/Gerrard) in the middle. He's desperate to play his best XI players and has round pegs in square holes all over the shop.

 

Go 442, play Watkins alongside Kane (or Foden just behind him) Gordon on the wing, Rice and Bellingham in CM with Rice sitting. Then make like for like subs with Palmer, Bowen, Mainoo, Toney coming on in the last 20-30mins to increase the pressure.

[toonotl 3107]

Instead of murdering football, perhaps Southgate might consider a messianic mission to save football that will muster up a Pavlonian response from the repressed collective psyche of the unwashed masses of the "Great" British public. *O Brittania!* Just a suggestion from one disinterested by-stander.  

[Guest MrRaspberryJam]

11 minutes ago, Kid Dynamite said:

Foden is the new Scholes. Being shoved out wide to accommodate Bellingham/Rice (Lampard/Gerrard) in the middle. He's desperate to play his best XI players and has round pegs in square holes all over the shop.

 

I read a piece on this in The Athletic the other day. 

 

Apparently by Euro 2004 a lot of fans wanted Scholes dropped from the XI because he never replicated his Man Utd form at international level. He was also picked out wide for England because he had done so quite a bit for Man Utd. Sven also wanted to play a diamond in midfield so he could have Scholes, Lampard and Gerrard in the middle but the squad talked him out of it.

[Dazzler 10369]

10 hours ago, Kid Dynamite said:

We do. He's called Declan Rice. Play him in front of the back 4 if you must and allow  the rest of the players to actually have a go at the teams who are MUCH WORSE THAN US!

Aye, but Southgate means a natural replacement to play beside Rice because he has to have two holding players in his midfield. I doubt we'll ever see a game where it's just Rice sat in front of the defence for as long as Southgate is manager.

[Guest MrRaspberryJam]

1 minute ago, Dazzler said:

Aye, but Southgate means a natural replacement to play beside Rice because he has to have two holding players in his midfield. I doubt we'll ever see a game where it's just Rice sat in front of the defence for as long as Southgate is manager.

 

He could play Rice and his Uncle Benn alongside him.

[Gemmill 46024]

17 minutes ago, toonotl said:

Instead of murdering football, perhaps Southgate might consider a messianic mission to save football that will muster up a Pavlonian response from the repressed collective psyche of the unwashed masses of the "Great" British public. *O Brittania!* Just a suggestion from one disinterested by-stander.  

 

 

[toonotl 3107]

To be sincere for a moment, like Gloomy suggested (amongst others, I think) it does seem the simple solution to play Bellingham beside Rice, play Foden at 10, since he's determined to play there anyway given his propensity to drift inside, and then play Gordon on the left, a player who plays with exactly what the starting XI lacks, i.e., a simple directness in attack that determines to make opposition defenders life a living hell for 90 minutes.

 

It doesn't seem likely though on present evidence that Southgate is interested in taking that approach.

[wykikitoon 20713]

4 minutes ago, toonotl said:

To be sincere for a moment, like Gloomy suggested (amongst others, I think) it does seem the simple solution to play Bellingham beside Rice, play Foden at 10, since he's determined to play there anyway given his propensity to drift inside, and then play Gordon on the left, a player who plays with exactly what the starting XI lacks, i.e., a simple directness in attack that determines to make opposition defenders life a living hell for 90 minutes.

 

It doesn't seem likely though on present evidence that Southgate is interested in taking that approach.

This has been suggested by pundits and fans alike up and down the country.  But it's not going to happen.  Look at TAA number, he's been given 8.  That says everything you need to know from Southgate.  He will continue to play the lad there even if he scores 5 own goals in defiance. 

 

[Dazzler 10369]

55 minutes ago, wykikitoon said:

You know what's needed? 

 

Games that don't have anything riding on them where you can test different players and formations. Games where you can rest large parts of your main team and try and blood in new players. 

 

You know, in a friendly atmosphere sort of a way? Maybe against lesser ranked teams like so that the pressure isn't high. 

 

Maybe someone should put that to Safegate. 

Like the entire international league or whatever the fuck it's called. Where he could have experimented, brought new players through, tried to tweak things tactically to get the best out of the players he had at his disposal - rather than going with his shite tactics and making players play to it despite it going against everything they are good at.

 

The most baffling thing to me is that he's looking for a natural replacement for Phillips. If that was the case then surely Longstaff should have been in the squad as he's quite clearly a similar kind of player, albeit a lot better than Phillips these days - and like Phillips, has no real business being a part of the national squad.

[Dazzler 10369]

10 minutes ago, wykikitoon said:

This has been suggested by pundits and fans alike up and down the country.  But it's not going to happen.  Look at TAA number, he's been given 8.  That says everything you need to know from Southgate.  He will continue to play the lad there even if he scores 5 own goals in defiance. 

 

Aye, it's not an experiment he's picked him as a midfielder - despite evidence supporting the fact he's dogshit in midfield, other than the odd champagne pass he's woeful. He's Shelvey with a better hairline.

[Holden McGroin 6783]

I think you could pick apart every player from last night. They were all individually terrible. Even Bellingham.

 

Kane and Rice seem to be getting targeted the most from what I’ve seen.
 

Gareth has fucked his squad selection imo. Taking Shaw with no left sided defender in the squad was a huge error. Trippier is shocking out there offensively. Not his fault of course because he isn’t a left back. Chilwell, Hall and Mitchell are all better LBs than Trips. 
 

 I also reckon it’s the wrong time to select Eze. He isn’t ready. Surely Grealish or even Rashford was a better choice than him. 
 

I could go on but when you look at the midfield or Rodri, Fabian Ruiz and Pedri…they are light years ahead of ours. I’d seriously consider Wharton if he sticks with two 6s. Gallagher is bang average. Mainoo is completely over rated. He might be decent one day but I’ve seen him get over run every game he has played.

[Dazzler 10369]

3 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said:

I think you could pick apart every player from last night. They were all individually terrible. Even Bellingham.

 

Kane and Rice seem to be getting targeted the most from what I’ve seen.
 

Gareth has fucked his squad selection imo. Taking Shaw with no left sided defender in the squad was a huge error. Trippier is shocking out there offensively. Not his fault of course because he isn’t a left back. Chilwell, Hall and Mitchell are all better LBs than Trips. 
 

 I also reckon it’s the wrong time to select Eze. He isn’t ready. Surely Grealish or even Rashford was a better choice than him. 
 

I could go on but when you look at the midfield or Rodri, Fabian Ruiz and Pedri…they are light years ahead of ours. I’d seriously consider Wharton if he sticks with two 6s. Gallagher is bang average. Mainoo is completely over rated. He might be decent one day but I’ve seen him get over run every game he has played.

Mainoo has a whiff of Willock about him. He's in a similar mould in that he's pacey and drives forward with the ball (at least from what I have seen). He should be a great sub to bring on to stretch a tired midfield and get us up the pitch. But Southgate would want him to sit deep beside Rice.

[Holden McGroin 6783]

Don't get me wrong, I think the best option is to play Bellingham (8) alongside Rice (6) with Foden (10) in front. However, I don't even think two 6s is horrific. Both should be pushing up with the play and making runs, that should also the allow the fullbacks to be really high (although absolutely pointless in Trippiers case). A problem is whoever we play at 6 doesn't have any world class distribution skills. Rice is a good screener and drives forward well (I think G.Nev was saying this as well) but he can't receive and distribute a ball like a Rodri or Bruno G. Wharton is our best bet for that.

 

 

[Kid Dynamite 7169]

41 minutes ago, Dazzler said:

Like the entire international league or whatever the fuck it's called. Where he could have experimented, brought new players through, tried to tweak things tactically to get the best out of the players he had at his disposal - rather than going with his shite tactics and making players play to it despite it going against everything they are good at.

 

Exactly, Southgate only dropped his favourites and brought in the likes of Mainoo, Gordon, Eze, Wharton a few weeks before the tournament. He clearly doesn't trust them enough to start games. What a waste of the last 2 years worth of internationals 

[Rayvin 5295]

The early subbing of TAA must be the end of that nonsense now. It hasn't worked at all.

 

Otherwise I agree with what everyone is saying and to be honest, it feels like these sentiments are being said everywhere. The thing that gets me then is why Southgate is so immune to it.

 

He should have put Gordon on over Eze who offered very little IMO. Watkins was a big improvement on Kane but even with him on and the side better balanced, I still didn't think things clicked.

 

I hope he changes it up for Slovenia.

[Gemmill 46024]

The sole left back in the squad, Luke Shaw, is still not training with his teammates. 

 

He might be just about recovered by the time England get dumped out. 

[RobinRobin 11550]

2 hours ago, Dazzler said:

for as long as Southgate is manager.

Just another couple of games 🙂 

[Rayvin 5295]

15 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

The sole left back in the squad, Luke Shaw, is still not training with his teammates. 

 

He might be just about recovered by the time England get dumped out. 

 

This is the other thing, why has he only brought a single left back to start with? Even if the other options are not quite up to the same "high" standards are the rest of the team, surely someone who is used to playing the position is better than forcing it on Tripps who is defending well enough but otherwise is quite invisible. Did he ever explain that?

[Dazzler 10369]

13 minutes ago, RobinRobin said:

Just another couple of games 🙂 

I really don't think he's going anywhere tbh. Especially now Ten Slag is staying on at Man Utd.

[Gemmill 46024]

Just now, Rayvin said:

 

This is the other thing, why has he only brought a single left back to start with? Even if the other options are not quite up to the same "high" standards are the rest of the team, surely someone who is used to playing the position is better than forcing it on Tripps who is defending well enough but otherwise is quite invisible. Did he ever explain that?

 

It's ridiculous. Shaw has been out for 4 months. He was still injured when Southgate selected him as the only LB in the squad. 

 

If your first choice LB is injured, you find the next best English LB and you pick them. That's Chilwell, also injured, so on to the next. It's not ideal, but picking a lad who will be rehabbing for at least the first 3 games of a 7 game tournament is insane. 

 

I know Chilwell was second choice and was injured too, but you go to your third choice, you don't take a fucked first choice. 

 

You do mad shit like this with a Messi or a Ronaldo, where the psychological impact of not taking them is worse than them being there injured. You don't do it with a Luke Shaw. 

[Howmanheyman 33829]

I'm not saying Southgate is the problem but his £500m or so midfield were dominated by someone who died three years ago but even more damning struggles to start games for Man United. 

[OTF 7485]

It's so ridiculous that he's still in charge, at this point he's morphing into a Steve Bruce who knows when to keep his mouth shut (both in the media and in the fridge/kebab shop etc).

[The Fish 10963]

9 minutes ago, OTF said:

It's so ridiculous that he's still in charge, at this point he's morphing into a Steve Bruce who knows when to keep his mouth shut (both in the media and in the fridge/kebab shop etc).

 

Did mention to a mate that that performance felt very Brucey.

[LongTimeAdmirer 1285]

Southgate played most of the usuals in the Iceland game, except Foden at 10, HC on the left, and Palmer on the right. England looked terrible and lost 1-0. I guess he saw everything he wanted to see from that game.

 

 

 

 

[MMXXVIII 1295]

It was a long time ago and many substances have passed since, but as I remember it, pressure from the red top media got Gazza in the team in Italia '90. Rice with Bellingham, Foden just ahead and Gordon on the left may seem like the obvious thing to do, but this lot boast of not listening to 'outside noise' so I fully expect this bullshit to carry on like the band on the Titanic.