Combined XIs

[The Fish 10849]

16 hours ago, Gemmill said:

I'm waiting to see the Fish construct a midfield that includes Ginola, Robert and Ben Arfa. 

If we were picking a team based on vibes, I'd have them and Asprilla up front, Albert and Schar at the back, Ritchie and Dyer at fullback, maybe Shelvey and Cabaye in the middle.

[The Fish 10849]

10 hours ago, Dougle said:

Combined squads of the various eras may be kinda more relevant, it's hardly like you play eleven over a season.

Well do your own fucking thread then. GOD!!

[Craig 6682]

16 hours ago, spongebob toonpants said:

I dunno. Keegan with unlimited money.....

 

Different eras but between 93 & 96 we pretty much had the equivalent of 'unlimited money'.

Hindsight is a wonderful commodity - at the time I found Keegan faultless, but then the comparators were McFaul, Smith & Ardiles so it wasn't that difficult. He had two significant shortcomings for me though:

1. All-out attack philosophy / limited focus on defence.

2. Disbanding of the reserve team / academy

 

On point 1, the style of football was truly magical to watch and without a second's hesitation I wouldn't want to change what we had, but despite coming so close,  it was never likely to win a title. He knew it was a shortcoming as well hence his decision to appoint a defensive coach. Just a shame he chose Lawrenson. You look at the defenders we had during his time, nearly all of them were attack-minded.

On the second point, it was a different era and the focus back then was entirely on your first team. The promised land was, as it is now, the Champions League but until 1997 the only way you were getting there was by winning the league and to aim for that, he focused exclusively on the first team. These days the focus is on every aspect of a club - training, fitness, facilities, youth setup, nutrition, etc. Wenger brought that approach to Arsenal and the rest of us had to follow suit - we were on a back foot because of the decision Keegan made. I understand why he did it though.

As others have said he had some wonderful strengths - particularly his passion, his understanding of the people on the terraces, and the ability to motivate and attract players. 

Howe's strength is with regards to tactics / training; Keegan's was man-management so they are difficult to compare. Howe edges it for me though.

[Howmanheyman 33113]

I think it's hard to compare as they really were different era's, had Eddie been around then would he have the knowledge and tools he does now? I'd very much doubt it. KK's an old man now and happily retired but I still think he was cutting edge for his time here, Europe was sitting up and taking notice of NUFC, not just here, the old mag I think it was had a few cuttings taken from Spain and France at the time and we were news like maybe Ajax's academy for example might be news here. Eddie would absolutely storm it if you beamed him back into a early 90s football club with his 2020s experience and know how. Keegan didn't have that. Even SBR acknowledges how much his European experience after England helped him become an even better manager as did Eddie acknowledge his time going around Europe helped him in between jobs. KK just walked off a six year golfing retirement in Spain and had to handle players he probably had never heard of and then grow the club with a few internal battles with the board when it was needed. I recall Terry Butcher spending a similar amount as KK did the season after we stormed it and nearly getting themselves relegated to the third. He's very much a man of his time and took inspiration from Shankley but put his own stamp on it. Obviously not pointing any fingers at anyone on here but I can't stand the revisionist bollocks that gets spouted about him these days by daft little cunts whose only real knowledge seems to be sky punting the love it video or showing him slumped over the anfield hoarding with Tyler's voice actually loving it himself as he no doubt was stroking himself. The bloke deserves far, far more respect than he gets nationally imo.

[Craig 6682]

Totally agree with that, especially about the revisionist nonsense. For me the 'love it' and 'advertising hoarding' moments were a sign of something good in KK - his unbridled passion. He wasn't just the manager, he was a fan also and it hurt him more those cunts care to appreciate. 

The stuff that really grinds my gears are those who have issue with him walking away in 2008 and then suing the club for constructive dismissal. And I'm talk about people supposedly within our fanbase who called him a bottler and only interested in the money. He had my full support on the day for walking out and he retains that full support to this day.  

Edited December 29, 2022 by Craig

[OTF 7295]

17 hours ago, ewerk said:

In defence of Keegan it was a different time for managers. The game has moved on massively in terms of tactics and the sort of work that goes on behind the scenes. Keegan wouldn’t last five minutes these days, Howe has learnt his craft completely differently to any manager in the 90’s.

 

It's almost like this entire thread is entirely pointless.....

[The Fish 10849]

1 hour ago, OTF said:

 

It's almost like this entire thread is entirely pointless.....

Unlike the other ones.

[Rosco 759]

8 hours ago, Craig said:

 

Different eras but between 93 & 96 we pretty much had the equivalent of 'unlimited money'.

Hindsight is a wonderful commodity - at the time I found Keegan faultless, but then the comparators were McFaul, Smith & Ardiles so it wasn't that difficult. He had two significant shortcomings for me though:

1. All-out attack philosophy / limited focus on defence.

2. Disbanding of the reserve team / academy

 

On point 1, the style of football was truly magical to watch and without a second's hesitation I wouldn't want to change what we had, but despite coming so close,  it was never likely to win a title. He knew it was a shortcoming as well hence his decision to appoint a defensive coach. Just a shame he chose Lawrenson. You look at the defenders we had during his time, nearly all of them were attack-minded.

On the second point, it was a different era and the focus back then was entirely on your first team. The promised land was, as it is now, the Champions League but until 1997 the only way you were getting there was by winning the league and to aim for that, he focused exclusively on the first team. These days the focus is on every aspect of a club - training, fitness, facilities, youth setup, nutrition, etc. Wenger brought that approach to Arsenal and the rest of us had to follow suit - we were on a back foot because of the decision Keegan made. I understand why he did it though.

As others have said he had some wonderful strengths - particularly his passion, his understanding of the people on the terraces, and the ability to motivate and attract players. 

Howe's strength is with regards to tactics / training; Keegan's was man-management so they are difficult to compare. Howe edges it for me though.

 

 

If i remember rightly the reserves back then had to play a certain number of games at clubs home ground and Keegan said no as the pitch was shite compared to now so they couldnt compete in the Pontins Reserve League

 

I wouldnt have it any other way with his all out attack policy......absoulutly fantastic to watch ,I loved it when he played Shearer/Ferdinand/Asprilla/Ginola/Beardsley in a European 2nd leg tie after we won the away 1st leg comfortbaly

 

If he was 20 years younger and with all the resources Howe has I'm sure he'd do better than his first stint here  the one thing I love about the guy is if he doesnt like it he walked away.Some might call it bottling it but he left us the first time around / left the England job when he could have hung around like certain mangers waiting for the big pay off, I had no problem with him suing the fat cockney cunt for a few million quid

 

If we could mix a bit of Keegan magic with the old head of Robson & Eddie Howe's new style ........it would be the perfect manager

Edited December 29, 2022 by Rosco

[MMXXVIII 1293]

Pope

Trippier

Woodgate

Botman

Beresford

Batty

Lee

Bruno

Beardsley

Shearer

Robert

 

Got bored during the WC so watched season reviews 2001/02 & 2002/03 and I was surprised by how many goals against Shay Given should have saved; kept thinking nee way would Pope have let that in.

 

The rest pretty much pick themselves in the 4-3-3 Howe employs, apart from Robert - I almost picked Bellamy instead. Ginola was an entertaining but ineffective luxury far too often, especially during the title run-in.

[Alex 35059]

The situation wasn’t the same but I think Keegan was a better manager 2nd time round. Or rather potentially better as he was so much more experienced and not as naive. The 4-3-3 he came up with was genuinely innovative when no one else was really playing that way. Chelsea had done it under Mourinho but the wingers were more midfielders who helped their fullbacks out. Viduka through the middle with Owen in a sort of withdrawn inside right role and Martins wide left was three actual forwards. The way he handled the Owen situation too when loads was being made of comments about KK from his autobiography, ie making him captain and getting a tune out of a player short of confidence after losing his pace. Not to mention his realising the potential of Modric 

[Holden McGroin 6581]

Aye, Owen played well in that little pocket.

 

On Goalies. I think the standard of goalkeeping has come on so much these days.  If you look back at PL years (eg) 92/93 a big percentage of goals conceded are GK howlers or shots that current GKs would have saved easily these days.

[Craig 6682]

Disagree totally about Robert > Ginola. Although neither of them were the best I've seen in a black and white shirt. His best years were behind him when he came to us but Kevin Sheedy easily eclipses the lot of them. Absolutely magical player. 

[Holden McGroin 6581]

I'll have whatever Craig has been sniffing.

[Alex 35059]

Scott Sellars is a bit underrated / forgotten about. Lovely footballer 

[Holden McGroin 6581]

7 minutes ago, Alex said:

Scott Sellars is a bit underrated / forgotten about. Lovely footballer 

 

Aye. Very underrated. Wand of a left foot but lacked a bit pace.