Bruno Guimarães

[PaddockLad 17243]

7 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

I feel like I’m the minority here but Bruno was by far the worst player in the team yesterday. I don’t think he’s the biggest problem.
 

He was trying to make things happen. I think the problem is a positional one and the  midfield seems unbalanced. Howe’s idea is Bruno and Tonali rotate as the DM but they’re not disciplined enough, at least not yet. One of them has to be instructed to sit deep and protect the back four. There was far too much space between our defence and midfield for Harrison to exploit. He was able to receive the ball, turn 180 and still have plenty of time to pick his spot for his second. That can’t be allowed to happen again.

 

I think Tonali and Bruno can work together. It looked good against Villa but it hasn’t since. Howe has some work to do and I wonder if we will regret not buying a natural DM. Bruno did well as a DM last season and needs to get back to playing that role properly if Howe decides he’s the one to do it. 
 

Joelinton was the biggest problem in the midfield yesterday because he clearly wasn’t fit and was a passenger for most of the time he was on the pitch. That’s on Howe. Anderson was one of our best players in pre-season and should be in contention. Or Longstaff could have started.
 

I disagree with whoever it was that said Longstaff is a number six though. He doesn’t have the technical ability to play that role in the modern game. He’s not comfortable receiving the ball from the defence while being pressed. Bruno and Tonali can do that. But Longstaff’s first touch isn’t good enough and it would be like putting someone like Hayden in there again. What he is good at is running and pressing from the number 8 position and he would have done better than Joelinton was able to do in that role yesterday.  

What about how shit he was for the last part of last season? The over the top goal celebration v Brighton sums him up. He’d done fuck all for weeks beforehand . 
 

I can see he’s a great player.  Billy Gilmour played him off the park though.  And he’s more interested in his child.  It’s not a balance thing primarily, it’s him being distracted . He needs to concentrate on his game.
 

He’s getting it in the neck from me because he’s very likely  the best player in the squad. I don’t criticise Miggy because he’s plainly at the very peak of his fairly limited powers. One player is making the absolute best of himself and the other is looking at fuckin Mothercare catalogues . Miggy is a new father too. Not sure why people can’t see the difference 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Dr Gloom 21912]

11 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

What about how shit he was for the last part of last season? The over the top goal celebration v Brighton sums him up. He’d done fuck all for weeks beforehand . 
 

I can see he’s a great player.  Billy Gilmour played him off the park though.  And he’s more interested in his child.  It’s not a balance thing primarily, it’s him being distracted . He needs to concentrate on his game.
 

He’s getting it in the neck from me because he’s very likely  the best player in the squad. I don’t criticise Miggy because he’s plainly at the very peak of his fairly limited powers. One player is making the absolute best of himself and the other is looking at fuckin Mothercare catalogues . Miggy is a new father too. Not sure why people can’t see the difference 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

Was he really that shit last season? I think you're judging him harshly because of how brilliant he was when he first arrived. His movement was restricted, I agree with that, because he was playing with an ongoing ankle problem, but he was still consistently one of our best players. 

 

He's still one of the first names on the team sheet, for me, along with Botman and Tripper, even when his form does dip. Most of them underperformed against Brighton, but I don't think Bruno is the biggest problem. I think Howe just needs to make a decision about the shape of his midfield three and instruct Bruno to go back to patrolling the area in front of the back four. Our lack of recruitment in that position means he's still the best option there. Interchanging with Tonali in the more advanced position leaves holes in front of the back four, which the better sides, such as Brighton, will exploit. 

[ohhh_yeah 2964]

1 hour ago, Howmanheyman said:

 

That couldn't happen at NUFC because there'd be an hour's debate about who should have the microphone followed by a fortnight of bitching on twitter. 

 

Or certain people would bring their own mics in so you'd have the likes of Tory boy, Pearson, Wraith and the rest of them facing off at the same time against each other like a latter day run DMC.

 

Minus the adidas Superstar trainers. 

 

[Gemmill 44811]

40 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

What about how shit he was for the last part of last season? The over the top goal celebration v Brighton sums him up. He’d done fuck all for weeks beforehand . 
 

I can see he’s a great player.  Billy Gilmour played him off the park though.  And he’s more interested in his child.  It’s not a balance thing primarily, it’s him being distracted . He needs to concentrate on his game.
 

He’s getting it in the neck from me because he’s very likely  the best player in the squad. I don’t criticise Miggy because he’s plainly at the very peak of his fairly limited powers. One player is making the absolute best of himself and the other is looking at fuckin Mothercare catalogues . Miggy is a new father too. Not sure why people can’t see the difference 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

You'd think he'd played the full 90 carrying his kid in a papoose.

 

[NJS 4378]

I thought at the end of last season he was a bit unsure of his ankle and was bullshitting his way through.

 

I fully expected there to be something about minor surgery in the close season (just like Pope) so when there wasn't I thought either it wasn't a problem after all or maybe it was an excuse for dwindling form. 

 

I'm beginning to lean towards the excuse side of things given his start and it's wearing thin - he needs a kick up the arse imo. 

[sammynb 3355]

1 hour ago, Dr Gloom said:

I disagree. I think he can play as the lead striker

 

You are so wrong about this, to the point you even admitted that once he went to the left wing, he sprang to life against Brighton. Isak will be a lead striker one day, like Henry was but he's a few years off this.

He's looked so isolated the last three games and if you look at the goal Wilson scored against Brighton, Isak would not have scored that, he doesn't bully defenders, he has skill and guile, not brute strength.
 

1 hour ago, Dr Gloom said:

I think Tonali and Bruno can work together. It looked good against Villa but it hasn’t since. Howe has some work to do and I wonder if we will regret not buying a natural DM. Bruno did well as a DM last season and needs to get back to playing that role properly if Howe decides he’s the one to do it.

 

Although I do think you have spotted the problem, just not the solution edit: you actually acknowledge the solution but dismiss it, doh.

For me the last three games Tonali has been "lost" out on the right hand side, almost standing in Miggy's pocket and I feel that is because you can see he and Bruno are trying to take the same space, if we were to move to a left and right 6 of Bruno and Sandro, instead of 3 across the midfield, it would get them off each other's toes.

Put Isak in front of them, with Wilson up top and we should narrow that gap between the mid and attack. I think it would also bring our LW/RW further up the pitch

Edited September 4, 2023 by sammynb

[PaddockLad 17243]

39 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

 

You'd think he'd played the full 90 carrying his kid in a papoose.

 

No good you fanboying him mate, that appears to be Howe’s job  

 

I’ll ask again, would Keane, Viera, Ferguson or Wenger have allowed it? …

[Dr Gloom 21912]

13 minutes ago, sammynb said:

 

You are so wrong about this, to the point you even admitted that once he went to the left wing, he sprang to life against Brighton. Isak will be a lead striker one day, like Henry was but he's a few years off this.

He's looked so isolated the last three games and if you look at the goal Wilson scored against Brighton, Isak would not have scored that, he doesn't bully defenders, he has skill and guile, not brute strength.
 

 

Although I do think you have spotted the problem, just not the solution. For me the last three games Tonali has been "lost" out on the right hand side, almost standing in Miggy's pocket and I feel that is because you can see he and Bruno are trying to take the same space, if we were to move to a left and right 6 of Bruno and Sandro, instead of 3 across the midfield, it would get them off each other's toes.

Put Isak in front of them, with Wilson up top and we should narrow that gap between the mid and attack. I think it would also bring our LW/RW further up the pitch

 

You're wrong if you think Isak has been signed to play as a winger. He has played predominantly throughout his career as a central striker, who occasionally plays out wide rather than the other way around and there's little reason to think it'll be any different at nufc based on the evidence so far.

 

If we want to get wilson back in the starting 11 I like like the idea of Isak playing in the number 10 role just behind him. I don't think Howe is going to do that anytime soon however, given he won't even change shape during a game when we're behind, and the problem is it also means starting our two senior CFs, leaving us no CF option off the bench to change the game.

 

If that was howe's plan I think we would have recruited differently and signed another CF. Howe sees Isak and Wilson competing directly for the one lone CF position, which means one of them will have to start most games on the bench.  

 

I said in an earlier post that a "double pivot" (shoot me now) of Bruno and Tonali could work in a 4-2-3-1, but again I don't see any evidence that it's in Howe's thinking. He seems wedded to the 4-3-3. If we're being hyper critical (and I love Howe) - you could even say he's a little inflexible when it comes to formation. 

Edited September 4, 2023 by Dr Gloom

[Gemmill 44811]

8 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

No good you fanboying him mate, that appears to be Howe’s job  

 

I’ll ask again, would Keane, Viera, Ferguson or Wenger have allowed it? …

 

I honestly think he needs dropped, he hasn't looked right this season and no longer has the excuse of the ankle thing.

 

It might be that Howe thinks that the only way to get him and Tonali to play together is by working on it in training and then putting them in match situations together. Which obviously fucks us when you get a set of opening fixtures like we've had.

 

I'd drop him but I wouldn't be at all surprised if half an hour into the game we're all saying how much we miss him.

[Gemmill 44811]

The baby stuff though. I just think he's massively enamoured with the club and the area, which is lovely, and he's obviously obsessed with his kid as well. I can forgive him it.

 

If I find out he's been breast feeding him at half time, I'll have to have a rethink though. Joelinton needs those calories atm.

[sammynb 3355]

2 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

You're wrong if you think Isak has been signed to play as a winger. He has played predominantly throughout his career as a central striker, who occasionally plays out wide rather than the other way around and there's little reason to think it'll be any different at nufc based on the evidence so far.

 

Where did I say that? I said prior to the Brighton game to fit him and Wilson into Eddie's current system we would need to play him out wide but ... well you can read the rest.

BTW Isak is a CF, Wilson is a striker, two different types of players.

 

And yes you appear to be correct about Howe's inability to change and adapt and this will be to his detriment if he cannot utilise the best players he has into a system that works, not trying to fit square pegs into round holes to suit a constant, rigid formation.

Pep changes shapes all the time and that is why he is a tactical master, if Howe wants to compete at that level, he has to have more than 4-3-3, with inverted wingers, that changes to a 3-4-3 when Trips moves into the midfield.

[Dr Gloom 21912]

2 minutes ago, sammynb said:

 

Where did I say that? I said prior to the Brighton game to fit him and Wilson into Eddie's current system we would need to play him out wide but ... well you can read the rest.

BTW Isak is a CF, Wilson is a striker, two different types of players.

 

And yes you appear to be correct about Howe's inability to change and adapt and this will be to his detriment if he cannot utilise the best players he has into a system that works, not trying to fit square pegs into round holes to suit a constant, rigid formation.

Pep changes shapes all the time and that is why he is a tactical master, if Howe wants to compete at that level, he has to have more than 4-3-3, with inverted wingers, that changes to a 3-4-3 when Trips moves into the midfield.

sorry, I was under the impression you thought Isak should be played out wide with Wilson in the middle. I was just explaining why I don’t think that’s going to happen. Howe flirted with it last season but clearly prefers Isak through the middle for now. 
 

Re: CF/striker. I don’t really know what you’re getting at tbh. There are so many labels in the modern football hipster lexicon that it’s hard to keep up.
 

The way I see it is Wilson is a more traditional number 9 and a great finisher. Isak is a more modern striker because he will roam all over the shop, drop deep and can run at players in a way Wilson can’t - Wilson is a poacher who will tend to play between the width of the penalty box and bully CBs more with his strength. 
 

Two great options to have but I still prefer Isak through the middle with Wilson on the bench at this point. What I would do more often is play them together when we’re chasing the game though tbf to Howe he did try that on Saturday only to sub Isak, weirdly, just as he was getting more involved in the play. 

[PaddockLad 17243]

2 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

The baby stuff though. I just think he's massively enamoured with the club and the area, which is lovely, and he's obviously obsessed with his kid as well. I can forgive him it.

 

If I find out he's been breast feeding him at half time, I'll have to have a rethink though. Joelinton needs those calories atm.

Apart from end of season games it’s not on. And he shouldn’t be having exceptions made for him given the level to which he’s performing, nor should any other cunt either 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Dr Gloom 21912]

13 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

 

I honestly think he needs dropped, he hasn't looked right this season and no longer has the excuse of the ankle thing.

 

It might be that Howe thinks that the only way to get him and Tonali to play together is by working on it in training and then putting them in match situations together. Which obviously fucks us when you get a set of opening fixtures like we've had.

 

I'd drop him but I wouldn't be at all surprised if half an hour into the game we're all saying how much we miss him.

we looked a much, much poorer side when he was out injured last season. Dropping him for the fixtures coming up is a massive call. Though there might be a case for “resting” him against Brentford to save him for the Milan game. We’ve got three massive games after the international break. Two league fixtures we were winning last season book ending a trip to Milan 

[The Fish 10855]

2 hours ago, Dr Gloom said:

I disagree. I think he can play as the lead striker but if you want to start Wilson, he could play just behind him as a number 10, but that requires changing the system to 4-2-3-1 and I think Howe is unlikely to chance from his 4–3-3 that has been so successful. He won’t even tweak the system during a match when we’re chasing the game.

 

However it could solve the conundrum of how to play Bruno and Tonali together, if they’re both instructed to sit deeper as two number sixes in a double pivot.

 

Dear lord, did I just type that? I think I need to take a break from all the football podcasts 

[Dr Gloom 21912]

4 minutes ago, The Fish said:

[The Fish 10855]

He hasn't been bad, per se, just not hitting the heights he managed last season. 

 

Part of it is definitely playing alongside an injured Joelinton and an inexperienced-in-the-Premier League Tonali. But part of it may well be the new born taking it's toll on his attention and energy levels. 

 

I honestly think the system is ok, needs a tweak or two, but it's fine. We just look like a side that's having to face the hardest start in the Premier League and the hardest start by some measure.

 

It's not just the quality of the opposition, but their style of play too. Their styles either nullify our midfield, or circumvent it.

[Dr Gloom 21912]

7 minutes ago, The Fish said:

He hasn't been bad, per se, just not hitting the heights he managed last season. 

 

Part of it is definitely playing alongside an injured Joelinton and an inexperienced-in-the-Premier League Tonali. But part of it may well be the new born taking it's toll on his attention and energy levels. 

 

I honestly think the system is ok, needs a tweak or two, but it's fine. We just look like a side that's having to face the hardest start in the Premier League and the hardest start by some measure.

 

It's not just the quality of the opposition, but their style of play too. Their styles either nullify our midfield, or circumvent it.

 

i think we've done pretty well...until the brighton game. man city was a narrow away defeat to the best side in europe. liverpool, we really should have won. we didn't take our many chances then choked in the last 10 minutes. those things can happen. until then we've looked okay and we've been in games. brighton was the first time i thought we looked flat - lacking our usual intensity, sitting back instead of pressing, midfield and press execution (on the rare occasions we did try to squeeze them) seemed disjointed and the less said about the makeshift defence (and nick pope) the better. 

 

hopefully it was just this season's villa away game where nothing worked. howe is usually pretty good at engineering a response after a poor result or performance. he did exactly that after the villa defeat when we went on to spank spurs. 

[The Fish 10855]

10 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

i think we've done pretty well...until the brighton game. man city was a narrow away defeat to the best side in europe. liverpool, we really should have won. we didn't take our many chances then choked in the last 10 minutes. those things can happen. until then we've looked okay and we've been in games. brighton was the first time i thought we looked flat - lacking our usual intensity, sitting back instead of pressing, midfield and press execution (on the rare occasions we did try to squeeze them) seemed disjointed and the less said about the makeshift defence (and nick pope) the better. 

 

hopefully it was just this season's villa away game where nothing worked. Howe is usually pretty good at engineering a response after a poor result or performance. he did exactly that after the villa defeat when we went on to spank spurs. 

And he's got a fortnight to work on preparing for the Brentford game. 

We took 4pts from these fixtures last season

 

GF4 GA4 PTS 4

GF7 GA7 PTS 3

 

I was angry straight after the game, but a little time and a little cogitation and I'm back to being Zen AF

 

[Kid Dynamite 7025]

2 hours ago, Gemmill said:

 

You'd think he'd played the full 90 carrying his kid in a papoose.

 

Aye, this conspiracy theory about his kid has got a bit out of hand   

[PaddockLad 17243]

5 minutes ago, Kid Dynamite said:

Aye, this conspiracy theory about his kid has got a bit out of hand   

Does your boss let you take your bairn on to the wards then? 

[Kid Dynamite 7025]

2 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

Does your boss let you take your bairn on to the wards then? 

I've brought my bairn into the office before, aye. Not that's got owt to do with anything.
 

Bruno is a bit off form at the minute, but jumping to conclusions that it's entirely down to him being a new dad is 2+2=76 man  

[Howmanheyman 33142]

To be fair to Bruno, wor lass sometimes used to pretend to sleep and not hear our two babies crying for their milk/nappy change as well or just brazenly turn over and say 'Your turn'. 

[The Fish 10855]

6 minutes ago, Kid Dynamite said:

I've brought my bairn into the office before, aye. Not that's got owt to do with anything.
 

Bruno is a bit off form at the minute, but jumping to conclusions that it's entirely down to him being a new dad is 2+2=76 man  

I know I was fucking knackered after ours was born and I definitely wasn't bothered at work.

[PaddockLad 17243]

53 minutes ago, Kid Dynamite said:

I've brought my bairn into the office before, aye. Not that's got owt to do with anything.
 

Bruno is a bit off form at the minute, but jumping to conclusions that it's entirely down to him being a new dad is 2+2=76 man  

Not jumped to any conclusions

 

it’s more like:

 

bairn + going after fans on social media + being a blatant badge kisser + not living up to the image he’s cultivated for himself since he joined the club + piss poor form = trouble

 

Fan boys won’t see this