Renton 21364 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Wasn't Hall a Sunderland fan if anything? More keen on egg chasing tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordieshandy 0 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 (edited) Wasn't Hall a Sunderland fan if anything? More keen on egg chasing tbh. 101820[/snapback] Still the best chairman we've had, with the best foresight. He did pump a canny bit of cash into the Newcastle Gosforth, forming the Falcons, and basically doing the same thing for them as he did for United. Edited February 28, 2006 by geordieshandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21364 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Mind what Hall did have was a quality LM greatly admires but Shepherd seems to be lacking in - foresight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21364 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Wasn't Hall a Sunderland fan if anything? More keen on egg chasing tbh. 101820[/snapback] Still the best chairman we've had, with the best foresight. 101822[/snapback] Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Wasn't Hall a Sunderland fan if anything? More keen on egg chasing tbh. 101820[/snapback] Still the best chairman we've had, with the best foresight. 101822[/snapback] Exactly. 101824[/snapback] Eggsactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 I see Leazes has re-kindled this one over on N-O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44425 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Him and HTL are Freddie and Douglas tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6682 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Him and HTL are Freddie and Douglas tbh. 101829[/snapback] They're certainly obstinate enough to be..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 Wasn't Hall a Sunderland fan if anything? More keen on egg chasing tbh. 101820[/snapback] Still the best chairman we've had, with the best foresight. He did pump a canny bit of cash into the Newcastle Gosforth, forming the Falcons, and basically doing the same thing for them as he did for United. 101822[/snapback] True, and these chairman grow on trees, thats why every club has got one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 (edited) A question related on this theme LM, who do you credit with winning Chelsea the ECWC in 1998? Gullit or Vialli?? 101647[/snapback] Sigh. Question answered many times Craig where I've said "we appointed a trophy winning manager who left a team that went on to win more under somewhere else. Question for you. Because of these wins, would you prefer Ken Bates as a chairman to Shepherd ? BTW, that doesn't answer ANY of my questions above. 101651[/snapback] Forget about bringing up the fact that Gullit became our manager, it's not related to the question I'm asking. Answer the question, who would you say was responsible for winning that Cup? 101654[/snapback] haha...I know what it is, you think it's Bates don't you, as you've already insinuated you think the chairman of a football club is really the manager ? 101658[/snapback] Nothing to do with Bates either - can you please just answer the question? 101663[/snapback] Craig, I've answered the question, the team manager was Vialli, who took over the team from Gullit and largely continued playing Gulllits team. I can't see what you are getting at.... do you think Vialli should be our next manager or something. You see, I ALWAYS think it is the manager who is responsible for the team on the pitch, and the players who are bought and sold, never the chairman or someone else interfering in the managers job. Now, as I don't duck questions, why don't you follow this example, and not before time. 101668[/snapback] So Gullit set the foundations? 101671[/snapback] Thank god someone sees where I'm coming from. Gullit laid the foundations but Vialli reaped the benefit and since then, has been creditted for winning the ECWC with Chelsea. My point is that the situation is the same with NUFC. We are were we are thanks to the work of SJH - it was he who turned this club from the disaster that they were into what they are today. Yet you praise Shepherd for it. OK, put it this way, if Shepherd had taken over at the end on 1991 instead of Hall, do you think we'd have had the same turnaround? I personally don't. I think we'd be talking about him in the same vein as McKeag, Seymour and Westwood. SJH - massive NUFC fan who had the money and footballing sense to do something about the club he loved. FS - local businessman who has seen a venture whereby he can make a mint and at the same time, put his name in the spot-light. 101812[/snapback] Hey Craig, you and Gol aren't Souness and Saunders are you I have never denied Hall laid the foundations, only stating Shepherd has carried it on, and the facts are that I have named all the big city clubs who could well be matching our turnover or getting close enough to matching us on the field, yet you ignore this, so why don't you answer the question. Who is the person running NUFC and keeping us ahead of all these clubs, rather than running us down like the chairman of all these other clubs have done when they were all also riding high ? The bold bit itself is a damning comment, but true, as none of them have bought England players, reached 2 Cup Finals and played in the Champions League. BTW, your acceptance that Gullit laid the foundations for further success at Chelsea surely means you ought to have been happy that Fred appointed a top manager when he appointed him, correct ? Edited February 28, 2006 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6682 Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Fred carried nowt on - we've never been in as good or a better position since he's been at the helm than we were under SJH. And don't play they CL qualification line either. If the rules had been the same since 1993, we'd have qualified more times under Hall than we ever would under Shepherd. He has taken us into decline. And I told you before, Gullit's management of NUFC doesn't come into this discussion. For the record, the Gullit appointment mystified me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 (edited) Fred carried nowt on - we've never been in as good or a better position since he's been at the helm than we were under SJH. And don't play they CL qualification line either. If the rules had been the same since 1993, we'd have qualified more times under Hall than we ever would under Shepherd. He has taken us into decline. And I told you before, Gullit's management of NUFC doesn't come into this discussion. For the record, the Gullit appointment mystified me... 101939[/snapback] what - we are still buying big, thinking big, we've developed the stadium and built a new training complex, if not for Souness [who you said give time too] we would still be in the top 5. Hardly a disastrous slide, in fact we could well be back in this time next year, what would you say then. The true mark of anything is in comparison with the competition, and as I've pointed out with plenty of examples, Shepherd is well ahead of most of his competitors. You can't back your statement up with facts can you ? Which is all I'm doing, stating facts and basing an opinion on them. You also can't name me the better man lurking in the backround, as there should be plenty available if he is so crap ........ Edited February 28, 2006 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44425 Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 (edited) Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it http://www.toontastic.net/forum/index.php?...70entry100470 Really Gem I think it's laughable that some on here take the piss out of another forum for what they say is kiddies posting...I have serious doubts about some of you lot if you seriously believe that the chairman is the team manager of the club and responsible for choosing the players the club buys, although it would explain why you blame Shepherd for everything that goes wrong - but give no credit for what is done well ... Edited March 1, 2006 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44425 Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it 102106[/snapback] Who was responsible for the lack of common sense in not sacking Souness though? You make it very clear that it was common sense to sack Souness, but you seem to blame me for lacking the common sense to sack him. You are aware that I'm not on the NUFC Board, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Why have we continued utilising the resources that Shepherd took over, again, if that is just a simple thing why didn't our old directors, and why have other big clubs in the premiership ie Leeds, Villa, Everton, Man City gone backwards....did they have shit chairman who allowed this to happen or good chairman who kept them competing at or as near the top as possible, buying England players and appointing managers with winning CV's. This is what Shepherd has done Clicky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it 102106[/snapback] Who was responsible for the lack of common sense in not sacking Souness though? You make it very clear that it was common sense to sack Souness, but you seem to blame me for lacking the common sense to sack him. You are aware that I'm not on the NUFC Board, right? 102108[/snapback] Just as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Backs to the wall time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Why have we continued utilising the resources that Shepherd took over, again, if that is just a simple thing why didn't our old directors, and why have other big clubs in the premiership ie Leeds, Villa, Everton, Man City gone backwards....did they have shit chairman who allowed this to happen or good chairman who kept them competing at or as near the top as possible, buying England players and appointing managers with winning CV's. This is what Shepherd has done Clicky 102109[/snapback] see also the top of this page Alex "what - we are still buying big, thinking big, we've developed the stadium and built a new training complex, if not for Souness [who you said give time too] we would still be in the top 5. Hardly a disastrous slide, in fact we could well be back in this time next year, what would you say then. The true mark of anything is in comparison with the competition, and as I've pointed out with plenty of examples, Shepherd is well ahead of most of his competitors. You can't back your statement up with facts can you ? Which is all I'm doing, stating facts and basing an opinion on them. You also can't name me the better man lurking in the backround, as there should be plenty available if he is so crap ........" You can point out constructive criticism to this as well if possible I see you still haven't told me what your criteria for appointing managers, other than wait and see what Fred does before deciding to criticise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44425 Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it 102106[/snapback] Who was responsible for the lack of common sense in not sacking Souness though? You make it very clear that it was common sense to sack Souness, but you seem to blame me for lacking the common sense to sack him. You are aware that I'm not on the NUFC Board, right? 102108[/snapback] Just as well 102110[/snapback] Aye, we've already got Shepherd there lacking the common sense you speak of. No point having me there doing the same job eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Backs to the wall time 102111[/snapback] Not for me Alex I'm stating facts.........4th, 5th best run club in the country, or 2nd/3rd best after Manu and Chelsea isn't crap..... I reckon you answer my straightforward questions matey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 1, 2006 Author Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it 102106[/snapback] Who was responsible for the lack of common sense in not sacking Souness though? You make it very clear that it was common sense to sack Souness, but you seem to blame me for lacking the common sense to sack him. You are aware that I'm not on the NUFC Board, right? 102108[/snapback] Just as well 102110[/snapback] Aye, we've already got Shepherd there lacking the common sense you speak of. No point having me there doing the same job eh? 102113[/snapback] Of course not, he admitted he made a mistake, you haven't you've just sloped the blame Why not answer the same questions I've put to Craig and Alex over this thread Gem ? How are we better than all the other big city clubs that I've mentioned that are all capable of matching our turnover, spending and performance in the last decade ? Consider the fact that the current situation has not always been the case .... and then tell us who this man waiting to take over the club to put in millions of his own money and want nothing back is ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 see also the top of this page Alex "what - we are still buying big, thinking big, we've developed the stadium and built a new training complex, if not for Souness [who you said give time too] we would still be in the top 5. Hardly a disastrous slide, in fact we could well be back in this time next year, what would you say then. The true mark of anything is in comparison with the competition, and as I've pointed out with plenty of examples, Shepherd is well ahead of most of his competitors. You can't back your statement up with facts can you ? Which is all I'm doing, stating facts and basing an opinion on them. You also can't name me the better man lurking in the backround, as there should be plenty available if he is so crap ........" You can point out constructive criticism to this as well if possible I see you still haven't told me what your criteria for appointing managers, other than wait and see what Fred does before deciding to criticise 102112[/snapback] As I've just pointed out Leazes, you credit Shepherd with signing players when it suits you as in the post I quoted and Souness when it suits you. Incidentally my criteria for a new manager would be along the lines of: Assessing their track record in terms of results. Looking at the their reputation as a coach/tactician Seeing if they have experience of managing a ‘big club’ Making a judgement on their hunger for success Looking at their man-management skills The list goes on. Meanwhile Shepherd has said this time he’ll listen to the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44425 Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Can I recommend that people STOP arguing about Shepherd with Leazes. He refuses to see sense on anything anyone says to him about the bloke, so ultimately you're destined to go round and round in circles with him. Waste of everyone's time. 101691[/snapback] shame Gemmil, but I think you are all being narrow minded and very naive to think there is a new chairman out there who will run the club better and more ambitiously than Shepherd, despite all the evidence to the contrary. After all, I have pointed out how many other big city clubs could match us, but don't, and our old directors who didn't...pretty much common sense to me...but then again sacking Souness ages ago rather than giving him time was common sense too .... 101930[/snapback] I don't know how on the one hand you can say how great Shepherd is, and on the other comment on the lack of common sense required not to sack Souness. You've transferred the blame for that onto me apparently, same as the blame for Bellamy goes to Souness, the blame for Luque goes to Souness, the credit for Owen goes to Shepherd etc. etc. etc.. The list goes on...... 102085[/snapback] the same that you showed ..... this was asked last week, show me where I have said anything other than the manager picks the personnel and the chairman handles the finance based on the managers professional expertise.....this is how football clubs are run and why they appoint professional managers, I don't believe I am having to explain this, but here is where I said the same as I've just done as you obviously missed it 102106[/snapback] Who was responsible for the lack of common sense in not sacking Souness though? You make it very clear that it was common sense to sack Souness, but you seem to blame me for lacking the common sense to sack him. You are aware that I'm not on the NUFC Board, right? 102108[/snapback] Just as well 102110[/snapback] Aye, we've already got Shepherd there lacking the common sense you speak of. No point having me there doing the same job eh? 102113[/snapback] Of course not, he admitted he made a mistake, you haven't you've just sloped the blame Why not answer the same questions I've put to Craig and Alex over this thread Gem ? How are we better than all the other big city clubs that I've mentioned that are all capable of matching our turnover, spending and performance in the last decade ? Consider the fact that the current situation has not always been the case .... and then tell us who this man waiting to take over the club to put in millions of his own money and want nothing back is ?? 102115[/snapback] So how does it go now then? "One bad appointment, subsequent failure to recognise the mistake until (by your admission Leazes) serious damage has been done to the club, and a total lack of common sense do not make a bad chairman." We can keep adding to this phrase of yours if you like? Have I missed anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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