Allan Saint-Maximin

[thebrokendoll 9454]

toonotl desperately hoping nobody notices his post above!

 

 

 

 

[Toonpack 9927]

Must admit, thought ASM looked to lay the ball off a bit more than usual on Tuesday rather than dribble down blind alleys. Hopefully that continues as there is always space created when he has the ball.

 

He also needs to stop sitting on his arse for 5 minutes when he's dispossessed.

[Christmas Tree 4821]

17 minutes ago, Toonpack said:

Must admit, thought ASM looked to lay the ball off a bit more than usual on Tuesday rather than dribble down blind alleys. Hopefully that continues as there is always space created when he has the ball.

 

He also needs to stop sitting on his arse for 5 minutes when he's dispossessed.

And then getting up and walking like a 90 year old  

[scoobos 298]

Yeah... Everyone I went to the match with, the BBC and the papers are saying he had a great match.

I think I've crossed the boundary of frustration with him though - he's WORSE than Robert , in that its not lack of effort - more some lack of teamplay or something. 

During the match on Tuesday, I was still screaming at him to pass and to get up when he falls over like he's been bloody shot , it's embarrassing - he's worse than Almiron was for that.

But, he had a great game by all accounts and according to the BBC was "our best player" -  I thought he was amongst the worst on Tuesday. Targett or Trippier were our best players (Targett was MUCH better than I expected) ..

 

I think I might have to learn to forgive and forget.

[Craig 6700]

If we earned points for dribbling the ball past the opposition / running around in circles / keeping his head down / holding on to the ball too much, we'd be top of the league thanks to him. Unfortunately we don't. 

 

Great individual player, but football is a team sport and that's the element of his game he massively needs to improve.

For example, Wood needs to score to settle himself / get the pressure of the price tag off his shoulders. I reckon as soon as he gets one, more will come along with his confidence. ASM had the perfect opportunity on Tuesday to provide that by squaring the ball for a tap in. He didn't do it. 

[Dr Gloom 22143]

On 09/01/2022 at 00:36, toonotl said:

I've honestly had it with him. His attacks fizzle out so frequently and consistently that it isn't even that frustrating anymore because his complete lack of end product is utterly expected every time he gets on the ball. Whenever he has possession it's essentially a right off for that attacking move because he's gonna do ten stepovers, then lose it mid-dribble, or twenty stepovers then pass it directly to the opposition, or thirty stepovers and shoot it at the corner flag.

 

the problem was he was picking it up too deep in his own half. if he continues to pick it up higher up the pitch, like he was able to against everton, then he can make those runs in the right areas. he's a proper menace . still frustrating as fuck, but teams fear him. everton had three or four men on him at times (probably knowing he wouldn't pass)  but they still couldn't get the ball off him

Edited February 10, 2022 by Dr Gloom

[Craig 6700]

At the time we signed him, one of my mates who watches a lot of French football stated there's a reason the likes of Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool etc haven't gone for him - there's little end product. 

He was bang on the money. It is great to watch him terrorising defences but what sets the likes of Ginola apart from him is that you knew with Ginola it would either end up in the back of the net, or released to Ferdinand to do what he did best. Granted we don't have the same quality of striker as we did back then, but that's no excuse for him running down cul-de-sacs rather than releasing it.

I was pleasantly surprised on Tuesday when he laid it off to Murphy late on. Didn't expect it from him. Stuff like that needs to happen more often.

[Dr Gloom 22143]

On 02/08/2019 at 11:23, Diego21 said:

 

Adam Pearson's been around longer than we realised 

[scoobos 298]

44 minutes ago, Craig said:

At the time we signed him, one of my mates who watches a lot of French football stated there's a reason the likes of Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool etc haven't gone for him - there's little end product. 

He was bang on the money. It is great to watch him terrorising defences but what sets the likes of Ginola apart from him is that you knew with Ginola it would either end up in the back of the net, or released to Ferdinand to do what he did best. Granted we don't have the same quality of striker as we did back then, but that's no excuse for him running down cul-de-sacs rather than releasing it.

I was pleasantly surprised on Tuesday when he laid it off to Murphy late on. Didn't expect it from him. Stuff like that needs to happen more often.

What I am going to say is ludicrous if taken literally, I am NOT making a real comparison BUT

Everyone said that about Ronaldo (fairly) when he was first at man united .

If we can get a team based footballing mentality into ASM , I think we all know he's got great potential (not ronaldo level of course, tho that pains me as I hate the whiney spoilt little twat).

[Craig 6700]

I get the point you're making. Ronaldo was a bit of a loose cannon / headless chicken when he first signed for them. The key was how he was managed and as much as I fucking hate SAF, I can't deny he had the unbelievable ability to extract the very best from his players. 

[Howay 12496]

32 minutes ago, scoobos said:

What I am going to say is ludicrous if taken literally, I am NOT making a real comparison BUT

Everyone said that about Ronaldo (fairly) when he was first at man united .

If we can get a team based footballing mentality into ASM , I think we all know he's got great potential (not ronaldo level of course, tho that pains me as I hate the whiney spoilt little twat).

I agree, the lad has insane ability on the ball. The way he goes past players is actually fucking bonkers, there’s very, very few who can do it (as all those successful dribble and take on stats show). What I’m kind of hoping now is if we stay up we bring in quality in these advanced positions, lads like maybe Raphinha, Paqueta, and Isak who won’t put up with him not passing to them, and he will likely have a higher level of trust in them, which I am hoping (along with more team system messaging as you mention) transfers into him releasing the fucking ball when it makes sense to rather than always trying to take the next player on. 
 

Btw, imagine seeing this post and me casually mentioning bringing in 3 players of their level 2-3 year ago . What an absolute ride this is man. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by Howay

[scoobos 298]

Yeah agree with you there - I wonder if you've hit the nail on the head and Bruce Balls told him "you are all we have up front, do it yourself, have confidence" and he's kind of still thinking that now - to be fair Joelinton and Almiron can't hit a cow on the arse with a chello. 

[Ayatollah Hermione 14047]

If he didn’t have Steve Bruce as coach for 3 years, he might have a better footballing head on his shoulders. Then again, Maxi loves that fat cunt so maybe not 

[Dr Gloom 22143]

32 minutes ago, Howay said:

I agree, the lad has insane ability on the ball. The way he goes past players is actually fucking bonkers, there’s very, very few who can do it (as all those successful dribble and take on stats show). What I’m kind of hoping now is if we stay up we bring in quality in these advanced positions, lads like maybe Raphinha, Paqueta, and Isak who won’t put up with him not passing to them, and he will likely have a higher level of trust in them, which I am hoping (along with more team system messaging as you mention) transfers into him releasing the fucking ball when it makes sense to rather than always trying to take the next player on. 
 

Btw, imagine seeing this post and me casually mentioning bringing in 3 players of their level 2-3 year ago . What an absolute ride this is man. 

 

he might be more prepared to release the ball if he had team mates he can trust. 

[Craig 6700]

12 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

he might be more prepared to release the ball if he had team mates he can trust. 

That's not a legitimate defence as far as I'm concerned and it's a line I've seen pedaled a lot by people who steadfastly refuse to be critical of him.

 

If his teammates fuck up, that's on the manager and coaching team to deal with. ASM's shortcomings are not exonerated because he doesn't think his team mates are good enough - he's not the manager.

  

[Polarboy 2311]

2 hours ago, Craig said:

At the time we signed him, one of my mates who watches a lot of French football stated there's a reason the likes of Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool etc haven't gone for him - there's little end product. 

He was bang on the money. It is great to watch him terrorising defences but what sets the likes of Ginola apart from him is that you knew with Ginola it would either end up in the back of the net, or released to Ferdinand to do what he did best. Granted we don't have the same quality of striker as we did back then, but that's no excuse for him running down cul-de-sacs rather than releasing it.

I was pleasantly surprised on Tuesday when he laid it off to Murphy late on. Didn't expect it from him. Stuff like that needs to happen more often.

 

Ginola's stats for us are actually pretty average for the two seasons he was here, 5 goals 8 assists his first season, and 1 goal 5 assists his second, albeit he only played 24 league games the second season. He scored a handful of spectacular goals no doubt, but he was a fair bit more productive when he went to Spurs. ASM's figures aren't far off in his first two seasons, 3 goals 5 assists and 3 goals 4 assists. He's on 5 goals and 3 assists at the minute so he will hopefully eclipse Ginola's best season goal involvement wise. Laurent Robert was mentioned above and out of the three he's was actually the most productive and consistent. First season he was here he got 8 goals and 14 assists. That's getting close to De Bruyne numbers. Not that I'm saying the Robert was as good as De Bruyne of course 😉 Robert didn't quite reach the heights of his first season from them on, but he was steady enough to easily make Ginola and ASM numbers every season after that.

[Dr Gloom 22143]

25 minutes ago, Craig said:

That's not a legitimate defence as far as I'm concerned and it's a line I've seen pedaled a lot by people who steadfastly refuse to be critical of him.

 

If his teammates fuck up, that's on the manager and coaching team to deal with. ASM's shortcomings are not exonerated because he doesn't think his team mates are good enough - he's not the manager.

  

 

not kicking the ball into your own head might see some of our players receive it more often

[Dr Gloom 22143]

i find his ball-hogging irritating. playing for the team and moving the ball more often would make him a better player.  there are a couple of times the other night when targett made great overlapping runs and was in acres but of course ASM chose to cut inside and take on the entire defence as always. 

 

just got to hope that as the squad improves, he starts to release it more often. i think the ronaldo comparison is a valid one. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by Dr Gloom

[Craig 6700]

9 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

not kicking the ball into your own head might see some of our players receive it more often

Granted but I don't think Joelinton aimed to do that, or would be able to repeat it again if he tried. Everyone's allowed a slip up - just ask Wilf Zaha.

[Craig 6700]

8 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

i find his ball-hogging irritating. playing for the team and moving the ball more often would make him a better player.  there are a couple of times the other night when targett made great overlapping runs and was in acres but of course ASM chose to cut inside and take on the entire defence as always. 

 

just got to hope that as the squad improves, he starts to release it more often. i think the ronaldo comparison is a valid one. 

Yeah, what worries me about that is if Targett starts to get frustrated that his overlaps are being ignored. 

[Polarboy 2311]

2 minutes ago, Craig said:

Yeah, what worries me about that is if Targett starts to get frustrated that his overlaps are being ignored. 

 

He played behind Grealish for last season and didn't lose the head, I think he'll be fine 😉

[Dr Gloom 22143]

I was just about to post the same thing. he just looks happy to be here tbh

 

[The Fish 10963]

2 hours ago, scoobos said:

Yeah... Everyone I went to the match with, the BBC and the papers are saying he had a great match.

I think I've crossed the boundary of frustration with him though - he's WORSE than Robert , in that its not lack of effort - more some lack of teamplay or something. 

During the match on Tuesday, I was still screaming at him to pass and to get up when he falls over like he's been bloody shot , it's embarrassing - he's worse than Almiron was for that.

But, he had a great game by all accounts and according to the BBC was "our best player" -  I thought he was amongst the worst on Tuesday. Targett or Trippier were our best players (Targett was MUCH better than I expected) ..

 

I think I might have to learn to forgive and forget.

 

What happened to you? Why do you hate fun?

 

31 minutes ago, Craig said:

That's not a legitimate defence as far as I'm concerned and it's a line I've seen pedaled a lot by people who steadfastly refuse to be critical of him.

 

If his teammates fuck up, that's on the manager and coaching team to deal with. ASM's shortcomings are not exonerated because he doesn't think his team mates are good enough - he's not the manager.

  

 

I don't think that's fair. He's mint on the ball, has scored a few and all that. He backs himself to score more than passing to Joelinton, and with good reason. He's created twice as many chances for other teammates than anyone else. Ritchie is second and Joelinton is 3rd.

 

Personally, I think that because he's very good, there's an expectation that he will be consistently very good. Just like the fans got on Robert's back because he wasn't blammering them in from 40yds every game.

[Howay 12496]

1 minute ago, Craig said:

Granted but I don't think Joelinton aimed to do that, or would be able to repeat it again if he tried. Everyone's allowed a slip up - just ask Wilf Zaha.

Speaking of this, I don’t think I’ve ever seen a player so consistently fall over when he’s about to shoot. I’m not sure what it is but maybe it’s how he plants his foot when he’s about to shoot? Surely it’s something that could be worked on. 
 

I know your post before didn’t quote me so you may not have saw mine the same way but I’m not defending ASM btw, his avoidance of the pass is definitely his own failing. I’m just hoping it’s something that can be taught out of him, hopefully by a combination of Howe and players that simply demand more and will hold him more accountable rather than just applauding his enviable talent on the ball. It likely stems from always being the focal point of his sides, always being the most impactful and likely shouldering the lions share of responsibility, clearly Bruce’s entire fucking game plan was ‘get the ball to ASM and cross wuh fingers’ it was probably similar for Nice. If we survive this season he will now be playing for a very ambitious side that has players of a much higher level, I think that’s when it’ll become time to either adapt his game or be pushed out the side. I like the bloke so I’m hoping it’s the former, but it’s something he has to address going forward. 

[Craig 6700]

3 minutes ago, The Fish said:

I don't think that's fair. He's mint on the ball, has scored a few and all that. He backs himself to score more than passing to Joelinton, and with good reason. He's created twice as many chances for other teammates than anyone else. Ritchie is second and Joelinton is 3rd.

 

Personally, I think that because he's very good, there's an expectation that he will be consistently very good. Just like the fans got on Robert's back because he wasn't blammering them in from 40yds every game.

 

I got on Robert's back because he was a lazy arse that SBR quite eloquently observed "It takes him 30s to get up the pitch and 3 weeks to get back to the halfway line."

On the contrary, I think the criticism of ASM is fair. He is equally marvellous and utterly frustrating to watch at the same time. His individual flair is sublime; his teamwork is somewhat questionable to me.