spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 26 minutes ago, The Fish said: Urgh... Jesus. Goal threat ≠ Goal return It's surely one of the most important stats we can use in forming an opinion 16 minutes ago, The Fish said: It might do, you make a good point, but I guess I'm thinking that it'll probably be harder to score at the levels he has when he DOESN'T GET THE FUCKING BALL! This claim is completely invalid as you completely ignore our possession percentage, amongst all the other variables. You are just cherry picking the stat the supports your position. I thought you were more rigorous than that. Sad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 How is this still rumbling on. When ASM comes back, Almiron will get less of the ball. Not none of the ball, less of the ball. How is this contentious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 1 minute ago, The Fish said: How is this still rumbling on. When ASM comes back, Almiron will get less of the ball. Not none of the ball, less of the ball. How is this contentious? It's not contentious it's just completely unproven. Also completely ignores the areas where he does receive the ball, which might just impact on his goal threat If you are going to make spurious claims at least put the work in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 Because its subjective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 1 minute ago, spongebob toonpants said: It's not contentious it's just completely unproven. Also completely ignores the areas where he does receive the ball, which might just impact on his goal threat If you are going to make spurious claims at least put the work in Don't mess with the stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 Just now, spongebob toonpants said: It's surely one of the most important stats we can use in forming an opinion This claim is completely invalid as you completely ignore our possession percentage, amongst all the other variables. You are just cherry picking the stat the supports your position. I thought you were more rigorous than that. Sad! No, it shows he's performed well, not that he has usurped ASM as the most dangerous goal threat. I've shown that, per 90, Almiron gets more touches, is the target of more passes, when ASM isn't playing. In terms of possession percentage. In terms of being a target of a pass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 16 minutes ago, The Fish said: No, it shows he's performed well, not that he has usurped ASM as the most dangerous goal threat. I've shown that, per 90, Almiron gets more touches, is the target of more passes, when ASM isn't playing. In terms of possession percentage. In terms of being a target of a pass So both Almiron's 2nd highest percentage in both those charts came when ASM was playing. Interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 1 minute ago, spongebob toonpants said: So both Almiron's 2nd highest percentage in both those charts came when ASM was playing. Interesting Why, in the world, would you cherry pick those two, instead of looking at the overall trend? Given, y'know, that's what we're talking about? with ASM, Almiron averages 7.3% of the teams' touches, without it's 7.5%, leave out the Liverpool game and it's 8%. with ASM, Almiron averages 9.8% as the team's passing target, without it's 9.7%, leave out Liverpool and it's 10.3%. 75% of ASM's games see him as the passing target one in ten times. Almiron is 25% with ASM, without it's 50%. So, in summary. When ASM plays, Almiron has fewer touches and is the passing target less often. Right, now that we've cleared that up you can go ask someone else to explain shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinRobin 11280 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wykikitoon 20150 Posted October 25, 2022 Author Share Posted October 25, 2022 Basically ASM has been our outlet and main focal point. It is going to be interesting once ASM comes back. I am sure he will become the focal point again. Miggy is producing and it would be class if he can carry it on once ASM comes back as it gives opposition two areas where they have to be worried about. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 6 minutes ago, wykikitoon said: Basically ASM has been our outlet and main focal point. It is going to be interesting once ASM comes back. I am sure he will become the focal point again. Miggy is producing and it would be class if he can carry it on once ASM comes back as it gives opposition two areas where they have to be worried about. Not possible Wykiki. The ball has to go to ASM every time. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 I can just imagine Maxi's mother screeching on the sidelines: "Pass it to Allan, PASS IT TO ALLAN" 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 46 minutes ago, The Fish said: Why, in the world, would you cherry pick those two, instead of looking at the overall trend? Given, y'know, that's what we're talking about? with ASM, Almiron averages 7.3% of the teams' touches, without it's 7.5%, leave out the Liverpool game and it's 8%. with ASM, Almiron averages 9.8% as the team's passing target, without it's 9.7%, leave out Liverpool and it's 10.3%. 75% of ASM's games see him as the passing target one in ten times. Almiron is 25% with ASM, without it's 50%. So, in summary. When ASM plays, Almiron has fewer touches and is the passing target less often. Right, now that we've cleared that up you can go ask someone else to explain shit. 2 things to say. Sample size and correlation vs causality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinRobin 11280 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 32 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said: I can just imagine Maxi's mother screeching on the sidelines: "Pass it to Allan, PASS IT TO ALLAN" Is Fish really Maxi's mum? Never guessed 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30616 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 8 minutes ago, RobinRobin said: Is Fish really Maxi's mum? Never guessed It's where he got his penchant for wearing Gucci sweatbands. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44888 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 It is true that the Fish once turned up to the Trent in a do-rag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44888 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 Apparently it's spelled durag. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, The Fish said: No, it shows he's performed well, not that he has usurped ASM as the most dangerous goal threat. I've shown that, per 90, Almiron gets more touches, is the target of more passes, when ASM isn't playing. In terms of possession percentage. In terms of being a target of a pass Ok @The Fish from those stats and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not a stat guy like you. Almiron is the target of a pass 35.25 times a game with ASM, and 35.75 without. Doesn't really seem that different, so maybe you should calm your skin Edited October 25, 2022 by spongebob toonpants Removed superfluous % sign. Not a stats guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 23 minutes ago, Gemmill said: It is true that the Fish once turned up to the Trent in a do-rag. Can't be true? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 12 minutes ago, spongebob toonpants said: Ok @The Fish from those stats and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not a stat guy like you. Almiron is the target of a pass 35.25 times a game with ASM, and 35.75 without. Doesn't really seem that different, so maybe you should calm your skin You are wrong. With ASM in the team, Almiron is the target of a pass 35.25 times a game and 40.75 without, and again, if you disregard Liverpool it's closer to 45 times a game. That's a 27.7% increase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 25 minutes ago, Gemmill said: It is true that the Fish once turned up to the Trent in a do-rag. It was a DFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 34 minutes ago, The Fish said: You are wrong. With ASM in the team, Almiron is the target of a pass 35.25 times a game and 40.75 without, and again, if you disregard Liverpool it's closer to 45 times a game. That's a 27.7% increase. Well if you can disallow Liv I can disregard ManC which makes it 40 per game with ASM in the side. Still think you are bending the stats to fit your narrative. More to the point you are basing this on the stats for ASM playing only 4 games, one of which was ManC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6587 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 This is possibly the worst argument I've ever been involved in (that includes the one I had with the mrs about vacuuming when we didn't speak for a week after). 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 3997 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 9 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said: This is possibly the worst argument I've ever been involved in (that includes the one I had with the mrs about vacuuming when we didn't speak for a week after). Fair enough I'll stop. I didn't even disagree with his point, just the lolstats to back it up. Sorry @The Fish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10857 Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, spongebob toonpants said: Well if you can disallow Liv I can disregard ManC which makes it 40 per game with ASM in the side. Still think you are bending the stats to fit your narrative. More to the point you are basing this on the stats for ASM playing only 4 games, one of which was ManC Well, if you really want I can go through last season, and discover further evidence that ASM has been the chief attacking outlet for Newcastle United since he joined. I can show that he's consistently received more of the ball, had more touches than Almiron has. But I think we both know that I'll provide that then you'll twist and moan and find another reason to disregard the evidence that backs up that which is self-evident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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