VAR... really??

[Andrew 4747]

1 minute ago, Andrew said:

I don't know how the rulings are laid out regarding longer passages of play, not sure where I could find them.

Wikipedia to the rescue (take with a pinch of salt)

 

There are 4 types of calls that can be reviewed.[1]

• Goals and whether there was a violation during the buildup
• Penalty decisions
• Red card decisions (second yellow cards are not reviewable)
• Mistaken identity in awarding a red or yellow card

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_assistant_referee

 

So "offside" calls aren't referred unless leading directly to one of the above, so if you are put through on goal you best keep going until the whistle goes properly, and if you're a defender you should too.

[PaddockLad 17239]

28 minutes ago, Andrew said:

 

The flag should've stayed down but it didn't, without VAR that goal wouldn't have stood, that is what it's for. Regardless of the offside rule misinterpretation above your conclusion doesn't make sense.

 

 

 

Yes and no, on the correct interpretation it's fair to put the flag up. If the rules are that anal then it's virtually impossible to tell what part of the body is in front. 

 

I think refs welcome this tbh, it takes pressure off them. The situation where any punter with sky can know better than the ref is plainly ludicrous too.  But in every other sport the crowd is informed clearly what is going on, either by big screen or as in NFL (after consulting his 4/5? colleagues) the ref goes to a mic and informs the entire stadium and the viewing public. I think for it to be a real success it'll have to include the crowd being informed properly. 

 

I don't agree with any of it though. Life is imperfect. I don't see why sport shouldn't be. Football became the world game without this nonsense. As I quoted before, what do we want sport to be for? Why do we have to seek truth and justice on the field of play? I get fairness, but we've got this far without it. It's just unesscessary. 

 

 

[Andrew 4747]

Yes and no?

https://streamable.com/70i2e

He's not offside but was flagged off, that goal wouldn't have stood without VAR even though it should have, there's no yes and no about it.

[ewerk 30544]

35 minutes ago, Andrew said:

 

Refs decision innit, play to the whistle as a player and leave it at that.

 

Last night was a perfect example, played through with just a touch and finish to make, does so, no one actually involved stopped playing and the incident went to VAR. I don't know how the rulings are laid out regarding longer passages of play, not sure where I could find them.

 

Longer term I expect we'll see fewer offsides flagged initially as assistants only flag when they're more certain knowing that the VAR can catch the marginal cases. 

I was thinking more then the play is higher up the pitch and there's a good 5/10 seconds between the through ball and the player shooting at the goal. I'd imagine though, as you say, that play won't be stopped and it'll be reviewed after the goal.

[adios 717]

27 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

I don't agree with any of it though. Life is imperfect. I don't see why sport shouldn't be. Football became the world game without this nonsense. As I quoted before, what do we want sport to be for? Why do we have to seek truth and justice on the field of play? I get fairness, but we've got this far without it. It's just unesscessary. 

 

 

2

Life is imperfect, why do we bother extending our lives with all this fancy dan modern medicine?  We became the dominant species on the planet without that nonsense.

[PaddockLad 17239]

51 minutes ago, Andrew said:

Yes and no?

https://streamable.com/70i2e

He's not offside but was flagged off, that goal wouldn't have stood without VAR even though it should have, there's no yes and no about it.

 

Fuck me it's TTs very own seeker of truth and justice. Do you wear a cape? 

 

Am not suggesting anything you're saying is incorrect. Am questioning the need for VAR because of the history and traditions of the game in the 130 year history of it up until January 2018. I hope I've indicated that I'm aware of and understand  the issues to do with  its introduction and implementation, but for me Its change for change' s sake and not welcome. 

[ewerk 30544]

Why bother with linesmen? Just let the referee decide.

Why bother with a referee? etc. etc.

[PaddockLad 17239]

42 minutes ago, adios said:

Life is imperfect, why do we bother extending our lives with all this fancy dan modern medicine?  We became the dominant species on the planet without that nonsense.

 

It's a sport ffs, not a fuckin moon shot

 

[Meenzer 15518]

The offside rule is a bit uppity iyam.

[PaddockLad 17239]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

Why bother with linesmen? Just let the referee decide.

Why bother with a referee? etc. etc.

 

You can have a Ashes test match without umpires. Theyre irrelevant. I do not want that to happen to football 

[ewerk 30544]

But what's the point of linesmen? 

[Andrew 4747]

23 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

Fuck me it's TTs very own seeker of truth and justice. Do you wear a cape? 

 

Am not suggesting anything you're saying is incorrect. Am questioning the need for VAR because of the history and traditions of the game in the 130 year history of it up until January 2018. I hope I've indicated that I'm aware of and understand  the issues to do with  its introduction and implementation, but for me Its change for change' s sake and not welcome. 

 

In that case I have completely misunderstood what you mean by those first two sentences, what is "yes and no" referring to? How is it fair to put the flag up when hes not offside? Yes, its tough to call marginal offsides correctly, no one disputes that, that's why VAR is useful.

 

I accept that you don't like the idea of the change, that's entirely your call but your arguments regarding the actual decisions made by VAR haven't made that much sense to me.

[Alex 35059]

45 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

You can have a Ashes test match without umpires. Theyre irrelevant.

You can't and they're not.

[adios 717]

49 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

It's a sport ffs, not a fuckin moon shot

 

I agree, it's not a matter of life and death...

[PaddockLad 17239]

24 minutes ago, Andrew said:

 

In that case I have completely misunderstood what you mean by those first two sentences, what is "yes and no" referring to? How is it fair to put the flag up when hes not offside? Yes, its tough to call marginal offsides correctly, no one disputes that, that's why VAR is useful.

 

I accept that you don't like the idea of the change, that's entirely your call but your arguments regarding the actual decisions made by VAR haven't made that much sense to me.

 

No they wouldn't have, not least  becasuse  I wasn't aware of the guidance notes/appendices to do with body parts  that are now in use. Yes in that youre right VAR worked perfectly last night.

 

No because I'm aware of, due to a mate being a referee on the national list and my own experiences in 20 years of Sunday league football that there's an immortal phrase uttered  by refs to linesmen before a lot of games up to a very high level; " if you think it's offside stick your flag in the air and I'll make the decision".  It really is that simple, and it's been that simple up until very recently. And we've all loved that game. For me, and I understand this has now been near 30 year process, the game is no longer a sport it's a multi million pound business and decisions on the pitch are now subject to business type scrutiny. It's one of the final nails tbh. 

[PaddockLad 17239]

7 minutes ago, Alex said:

You can't and they're not.

 

 

ok, explain to someone with a passing interest in cricket why that's the case. 

[Ken 119]

Too early to say that it is beneficial. Has been used over here in Australia and it has had its teething problems. Farcical at times but I guess FIFA use us as guinea pigs because we aren't a big player in the world. There are positives but the stoppages in play that I have seen have turned off people here, not a country to turn people off football for these reasons. Other things to do and other sports to watch.

[Alex 35059]

8 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

 

ok, explain to someone with a passing interest in cricket why that's the case. 

Loads of reasons but the main ones are you only get two unsuccessful reviews per innings and it's actually an umpire which makes the call when a review takes place (and it isn't always as clean cut as with Hawkeye giving LBWs out or not). Not really arsed about this either way, just pointing out I disagree with your comment on the Ashes. On the whole I think it works well in cricket though.

[Ken 119]

15 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

 

ok, explain to someone with a passing interest in cricket why that's the case. 

Saying that adjudicators, human,  aren't necessary in any sport let alone cricket is daft. Have a word.

[Ayatollah Hermione 13856]

I think we’re all missing the point that our refs are absolutely too stupid to know when to call for VAR and when to just deny us a penalty on principle.

[strawb 4247]

Arguing against something that might improve the absolutely terrible standard of reffing is a strange stand point like.

 

If something is shit, you try to make it better? 

 

Did you oppose the back pass rule rule as well? It was fun watching the old Liverpool teams pass back to the keeper from the halfway line all the time mind.

[Howmanheyman 33113]

VAR sounds like the leader of an evil intergalactic empire.

[PaddockLad 17239]

6 hours ago, strawb said:

Arguing against something that might improve the absolutely terrible standard of reffing is a strange stand point like.

 

If something is shit, you try to make it better? 

 

Did you oppose the back pass rule rule as well? It was fun watching the old Liverpool teams pass back to the keeper from the halfway line all the time mind.

 

So how are you measuring the standard of refereeing? By what some pundit in the media tells you? Perhaps you'd also like to expand on how VAR will change the way the game is played in a fairly significant way as changing the back pass rule did? I don't remember having strong opinions one way or the other on that tbh but if you had a goalie who could actually play a bit of football as we did with Pav it was easy to adapt to. What a change in the way the game is played has got to do with games being reffed from Heathrow fuckin airport am not sure though. 

 

 

[ewerk 30544]

[PaddockLad 17239]