Generic small time football blather thread FOREVER

[ohhh_yeah 2930]

 

 

[aimaad22 4086]

Bit similar to some muslim cricketers not wearing alcoholic beverage sponsors etc, as far as having a personal opinion while being part of a team that may think a bit differently. If it's all done respectfully I can only see it as a good thing, diversity and all that. 

[Rayvin 5151]

5 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

He's not campaigning against it or anything like that is he, so what's the problem? You can't force someone to wear a symbol, or support something they don't believe in. Just as you shouldn't be prohibiting them from doing so. 

 

Freedom of expression should always be with respect to the place and culture you're living in, I don't see him abusing that in anyway, he's just doesn't want to be a part of it personally. 

 

It's a tough one though because the flag is asking him to say "I think homosexual people should be treated with the same respect in their private lives as everyone else" and his non-consent to support that notion is saying... I mean presumably the opposite. He's not saying "I choose not to be gay" (as if that was an option) - he's instead saying "I reject the notion that this other person can "choose" to be gay".

 

That does feel like a fairly solid step over a line that we wouldn't accept in other contexts?

[NJS 4355]

"Freedom of expression" = religious get out card for being a bigot. 

[Gemmill 44114]

He's entitled to express himself any way he likes. I just happen to think the idea that it's OK to what...not believe in homosexuality or to wish to oppose it or refuse to accept its existence (or whatever the fuck his backwards viewpoint is) can just fuck right off.

 

The fact he does it quietly doesn't make it respectful. His refusal, in and of itself, is an act of disrespect. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Gemmill

[Alex 34725]

36 minutes ago, Isegrim said:

 

Jake Daniels was. 

[Ayatollah Hermione 13762]

Well, at least he’s getting abuse for being homophobic instead of being black. We’ve come a long way baby

[Rayvin 5151]

Yeah I've 180'd fully on this on thinking it through. I can't reconcile holding the view that "opposing" someone over something they can't change is in any way acceptable or productive, and it should be called out. It may be a "belief" but not all beliefs are benign. And his non-involvement may be actively harming homosexual people within Islamic communities. He may simply be ignorant of the facts, but he can fix that by informing himself.

 

I'm sorry for my initial post which was poorly thought through and insensitive tbh.

[ohhh_yeah 2930]

11 minutes ago, NJS said:

"Freedom of expression" = religious get out card for being a bigot. 

 

This can not be said enough!!!

 

[aimaad22 4086]

4 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

It's a tough one though because the flag is asking him to say "I think homosexual people should be treated with the same respect in their private lives as everyone else" and his non-consent to support that notion is saying... I mean presumably the opposite. He's not saying "I choose not to be gay" (as if that was an option) - he's instead saying "I reject the notion that this other person can "choose" to be gay".

 

That does feel like a fairly solid step over a line that we wouldn't accept in other contexts?

 

I don't know if people see that flag as saying those things specifically. I think it's seen generally as support for or normalizing/mainstreaming that community. I cant claim to be too educated about it to be honest, I may be wrong and I'm sure it varies from place to place. I've already seen huge differences in the way it's taken in liberal places like Portland and then conservative ones like Texas, and muslims are very much a minority in both. 

 

9 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

The fact he does it quietly doesn't make it respectful. 

 

It's being imposed on him though. He may never have wanted to make this a public thing or hurt the people in support of the cause.

[Isegrim 9680]

Some real bollocks getting spouted tbh.

 

Just sitting out a match to not have to admit supporting bigotry has nothing to do with being brave. You could argue that it would have been brave to admit to being a homophobe or a racist. It’s also not comparable with players being uneasy advertising alcohol or betting based on religious grounds as those are shared by people based on other principles as well.

 

But when in Rome do as the Romans do unless you valid grounds based on your conscience to do otherwise. But then be brave and express your view.

 

I expect people taking part in the western society and making a living of it to respect the predominantly values. I don’t expect people to share it. But if not then be honest about it.

[ohhh_yeah 2930]

3 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

 

It's being imposed on him though. He may never have wanted to make this a public thing or hurt the people in support of the cause.

 

He is now imposing feelings on people the message was intended for.

 

[aimaad22 4086]

Just now, Isegrim said:

It’s also not comparable with players being uneasy advertising alcohol or betting based on religious grounds as those are shared by people based on other principles as well.

 

That's why I said only in terms of taking a different stance from your team, I know it's not the same 'thing'. 

[Gemmill 44114]

7 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

 

I don't know if people see that flag as saying those things specifically. I think it's seen generally as support for or normalizing/mainstreaming that community. I cant claim to be too educated about it to be honest, I may be wrong and I'm sure it varies from place to place. I've already seen huge differences in the way it's taken in liberal places like Portland and then conservative ones like Texas, and muslims are very much a minority in both. 

 

 

It's being imposed on him though. He may never have wanted to make this a public thing or hurt the people in support of the cause.

 

The reason the rainbow flag is viewed differently in Portland and Texas is because Texas is full of religious conservative bigots. They just happen to be of the Christian variety. 

 

We are never going to agree on this tbh, so I think I'll skip the discussion. 👍

[ohhh_yeah 2930]

1 minute ago, Gemmill said:

 

The reason the rainbow flag is viewed differently in Portland and Texas is because Texas is full of religious conservative bigots. They just happen to be of the Christian variety.   

 

 

[aimaad22 4086]

2 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

 

The reason the rainbow flag is viewed differently in Portland and Texas is because Texas is full of religious conservative bigots. They just happen to be of the Christian variety. 

 

We are never going to agree on this tbh, so I think I'll skip the discussion. 👍

 

Agreed  

[Rayvin 5151]

I mean, I thought that this was a respectful and interesting discussion. Didn't get the sense that anyone was going to fall out.

 

Either way, fair enough.

[aimaad22 4086]

3 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

I mean, I thought that this was a respectful and interesting discussion. Didn't get the sense that anyone was going to fall out.

 

Either way, fair enough.

 

I didn't either, I mean we've had a few of these discussions over the last few years here, religion related. A couple may have gotten a bit fiery (thus the description in the tag  ) but I don't think anybody is truly nasty here. It just get's a bit tedious when you know the other person's also got a strongly held belief that you don't agree with,  so I get Gemmill here. 

 

I do find it a bit strange though that religiously people often very easily get labelled bigots and such, often simply on the basis they have a religion, while one of the biggest criticism levelled at them is intolerance. 

[Meenzer 15347]

4 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

I do find it a bit strange though that religiously people often very easily get labelled bigots and such, often simply on the basis they have a religion that they use to justify bigotry and intolerance, while one of the biggest criticism levelled at them is intolerance. 

 

Fixed your post, HTH  

[NJS 4355]

I think it's about to what extent you embrace, accept or reject the tenets that have become at odds with the societal zeitgeist. 

 

I find it interesting how many followers of Abrahamic religions are happy to renounce all sorts of things including creationism and rejection of wealth but cling on to simple bigotries like racism and homophobia - I guess that says a lot about human nature. 

 

[aimaad22 4086]

6 minutes ago, Meenzer said:

 

Fixed your post, HTH  

 

 

I rest my case  

[wykikitoon 19807]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/18625897/gareth-bale-cardiff-transfer-real-madrid-wales/?utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=sunfootballfacebook200522&utm_source=Facebook#Echobox=1652996103

 

'Hell'

 

[Dougle 3288]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/61493783

 

Has the horrendous fucker popped his corks?

Edited May 20, 2022 by Dougle

[Andrew 4713]

Just found the most obscure football shirt ive ever seen irl in a charity shop, so now its mine

[ohhh_yeah 2930]

4 hours ago, Andrew said:

Just found the most obscure football shirt ive ever seen irl in a charity shop, so now its mine

 

On to the semis!

Samut Praka are defeated