Swansea vs Newcastle

[Howay 12496]

28 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

McClaren favoured the Anita-Colback axis didn't he? That was as bad as we've been in central midfield for a while  

Too soon to be bringing that nightmare back up. 

[The Fish 10856]

Anita Colback - absentee receptionist.

[Alex 35077]

[David Kelly 1244]

1 hour ago, Andrew said:

 

I'd like to try it as well but it would be a change of shape Rafa appears very reluctant to make, we're drilled in that 4231 both in defence (which wouldn't change so much with a 433) but the focus and style of attack would have to change quite a bit which would take a while to bed in.

 

Honestly, while we're picking up points reasonably well, I wouldn't change it too much.

Would it be much of a change in formation?  For the last year it's been little better than playing with ten men so I can't see how adding an additional midfielder will change things much.  Certainly not for the worse.

[Andrew 4748]

Just now, David Kelly said:

Would it be much of a change in formation?  For the last year it's been little better than playing with ten men so I can't see how adding an additional midfielder will change things much.  Certainly not for the worse.

 

A tad hyperbolic when we won the league don't you think?

I feel like it would change the Winger/Striker relationship as there wouldn't be a central player as close to the Striker, would the wingers have to sit further up the pitch? would that then compromise their defensive work? Would the fullbacks be able to push up as much as they do in the current system?

 

We're one of those sides under rafa who come under the "well drilled/organised" category, would we lose that with a change of formation? I think yes, ideal for me would be getting a good number 10 in January.

[The Fish 10856]

Just now, David Kelly said:

Would it be much of a change in formation?  For the last year it's been little better than playing with ten men so I can't see how adding an additional midfielder will change things much.  Certainly not for the worse.

 

4-5-1 isolates the lone striker more, especially with the more attacking midfielder of the three being Jonjo Shelvey.

[Dr Gloom 21915]

14 minutes ago, The Fish said:

Anita Colback - absentee receptionist.

 

Comedy Dave is back

[David Kelly 1244]

I said earlier in the thread that the worry would be that the striker go isolated but I honestly don't think either Perez or Diame have ever offered much in the way of support there anyway.

 

And I'd say we won the championship despite our lack of a number 10 rather than because of anything positive they did in the role.

[David Kelly 1244]

I do take the point about the change in what the wingers need to do and how that would impact on their defensive work.  I'm not sure it would be to our detriment but I do concede that it would change how the team would have to work.

[Meenzer 15524]

29 minutes ago, The Fish said:

Anita Colback - absentee receptionist.

 

That's quite good

[Dr Gloom 21915]

Comedy Dave, meet Incredulous Martin 

[ewerk 30598]

[The Fish 10856]

45 minutes ago, Meenzer said:

 

That's quite good

 

 fucker

[Andrew 4748]

1 hour ago, David Kelly said:

I said earlier in the thread that the worry would be that the striker go isolated but I honestly don't think either Perez or Diame have ever offered much in the way of support there anyway.

 

And I'd say we won the championship despite our lack of a number 10 rather than because of anything positive they did in the role.

 

Mate

 

 

 

[Anorthernsoul 1221]

15 minutes ago, Andrew said:

 

Mate

 

 

 

 

 

World class move involving Ritchie, Atsu, Murphy and Diame. Straight from the training ground.

[David Kelly 1244]

31 minutes ago, Andrew said:

 

Mate

 

 

 

I stand corrected.

[essembeeofsunderland 811]

We need a Shane Long type player to do the running and pressurising with a Beardsley type player 'throwing hand grenades' as Keegan would say,and me.

Does Ritchie like picking up cards.Like Wearside Jack before him,getting a card seems to be a part of his game.

[strawb 4248]

Perez got 9 goals and 6 assists last season. It's not amazing but it's not as terrible as people are making out

[acrossthepond 877]

33 minutes ago, strawb said:

Perez got 9 goals and 6 assists last season. It's not amazing but it's not as terrible as people are making out

 

Agreed. I think the problem is that he seems to go missing quite a lot. It was hard to tell he was playing during the first half of the Swansea game. But he's scored a lot of goals for someone who has rarely been used as an out-and-out striker. 

[Graing 15]

7 hours ago, strawb said:

Perez got 9 goals and 6 assists last season. It's not amazing but it's not as terrible as people are making out

 

I don't understand all the hate for Perez, he's really been good at times. Yes he has been inconsistent. He gets muscled off the play too often, but I think he has good vision, ball control, and effort when I've seen him.

[The Fish 10856]

It's a couple of things, imo.

 

Chiefly it's his inconsistency. We've seen him play well against a range of opposition, but lapses in concentration lead to giving the ball away cheaply, poor final balls, or disappointing shots.

Secondly it's the position; #10's in a 4-2-3-1 have a great deal of responsibility to keep the rhythm going. They're the fulcrum, more so than the wide players or the central midfielders. So we notice his fuck ups more because they're during crucial passages of play. #10s are under more pressure to get it right, first time, in tighter spaces, at a quicker pace while receiving more attention.

 

Ultimately we could really do with a better player in that position, because consistency and concentration are almost prerequisites of that role.

[Dr Gloom 21915]

I just don't think he's good enough. Decent player on his day but looks a better bench option. You have to ask how long he can be filed under one for the future though. 

[The Fish 10856]

1 minute ago, Dr Gloom said:

I just don't think he's good enough. Decent player on his day but looks a better bench option. You have to ask how long he can be filed under one for the future though. 

Older than Mitro who's been written off by some of the fanbase already.

[David Kelly 1244]

2 hours ago, The Fish said:

It's a couple of things, imo.

 

Chiefly it's his inconsistency. We've seen him play well against a range of opposition, but lapses in concentration lead to giving the ball away cheaply, poor final balls, or disappointing shots.

Secondly it's the position; #10's in a 4-2-3-1 have a great deal of responsibility to keep the rhythm going. They're the fulcrum, more so than the wide players or the central midfielders. So we notice his fuck ups more because they're during crucial passages of play. #10s are under more pressure to get it right, first time, in tighter spaces, at a quicker pace while receiving more attention.

 

Ultimately we could really do with a better player in that position, because consistency and concentration are almost prerequisites of that role.

I agree with pretty much all of this.  My greatest frustration with him is that we've seen ability yet most of the time we get no product from him at all.  And a lot of the time I feel he's a passenger.  We could afford this in the Championship but it's going to cause us a lot more problems this season.  Like you say, we just need better.  I can't for the life of me understand why it wasn't our first target in the summer.  I don't recall even getting linked with many.

[StoneColdStephenIreland 74]

He's just not cut out for that role as he hasn't got a range of passing or amazing shooting ability. He also seems a bit afraid to get involved as much as he's surrounded by the opposition's centre mids and centre backs meaning he has little to not time on the ball. Whereas when played out wide or as a striker he can concentrate on isolating one or maybe 2 of the opposition defenders and has more time on the ball.