Official EU negotiations Thread

[Dr Gloom 21912]

And yet he voted labour, apparently 

[Christmas Tree 4725]

6 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

You listed the arguments for Brexit, which most of knew from the outset were, well, bollocks. 

 

I'm still struggling to comprehend why you voted Corbyn given your concerns about the magic money tree.

 

Still, it seems like a few branches of the tree can be shaken for the important stuff, like whoreing the DUP to prop up a failed government. Just not the trivial stuff like paying nurses, police and firefighters properly. 

 

 

The arguments for Brexit are sound. 

 

Voting for Corbyn was a moment of weakness that I'll have to live with.

 

finding 1 billion over 2 years is not in the same league as find 6/7 billion every year.

[Christmas Tree 4725]

4 minutes ago, Renton said:

Interesting. 

Things get better under  Labour.

Things get worse under Tories.

 

CT logic. Give Tories credit for labour's success and blame labour for Tories mess.

 

 

 

Ofcourse they get better cos they borrow and spend til "there's no money left".

[ewerk 30544]

And there essentially is the problem. The arguments for Brexit are not sound. 52% didn't vote for sound arguments. The majority of those voters voted that way because they have a (largely) irrational fear of immigration and/or they believe that our law makers are somehow superior to those in Europe.

[Dr Gloom 21912]

Arguments for Brexit weren't sound. The referendum was fought on an immigration ticket and yet you had prominent brexiteers arguing we could control immigration while maintaining tariff free access to the single market. It has always been obvious that was massive con - was never going to happen.

[Renton 21567]

8 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Ofcourse they get better cos they borrow and spend til "there's no money left".

Of course. Even though it's demonstrably untrue.

[Christmas Tree 4725]

49 minutes ago, Renton said:

Of course. Even though it's demonstrably untrue.

 

 

70's labour

Winter of discontent, unions out of control, imf loans, almost bankrupt, "weak man of Europe".

 

cue Tories who leave a strong economy and a transformed country.

 

97 labour

create a benefit culture, fail to prevent mass immigration, ruin generation to come with PFI's, take us into an illegal war, destroy Iraq, ignore hillsbrough, fail to regulate banks, mid staffs, no money left.

 

Cue Tories to create 3 million jobs, turn around the economy, sort pension time bomb, legalise same sex marriage, pay down the deficit.

 

anyway, we've done all this before so not getting dragged back into this

 

[Rayvin 5217]

I thought benefit culture was created by Maggie after she failed to put into place any adequate structure for the move away from our natural industries, and subsequently created an underclass?

[Renton 21567]

Fantastic. CT putting blame of Hillsborough on Labour now.

 

It's a complete myth that the conservatives are "good" with the economy, as the present incumbents have proven. Doubled the debt, not going to balance the books in over a decade, massively increased inequality and reduced the standard of living for 90% if their electorate.

 

Did you cheer with the Tory MPs when they cut the pay of public sector workers for the seventh year running CT? 

[Dr Gloom 21912]

CT coming across like he definitely voted Labour here 

[NJS 4377]

28 minutes ago, Renton said:

Fantastic. CT putting blame of Hillsborough on Labour now.

 

It's a complete myth that the conservatives are "good" with the economy, as the present incumbents have proven. Doubled the debt, not going to balance the books in over a decade, massively increased inequality and reduced the standard of living for 90% if their electorate.

 

Did you cheer with the Tory MPs when they cut the pay of public sector workers for the seventh year running CT? 

Biggest ever post war proportion of debt to GDP was under Lamont.

[Christmas Tree 4725]

57 minutes ago, Renton said:

Fantastic. CT putting blame of Hillsborough on Labour now.

 

It's a complete myth that the conservatives are "good" with the economy, as the present incumbents have proven. Doubled the debt, not going to balance the books in over a decade, massively increased inequality and reduced the standard of living for 90% if their electorate.

 

Did you cheer with the Tory MPs when they cut the pay of public sector workers for the seventh year running CT? 

 

You do realise the debts gone up because the government has to borrow every year to keep public services / public sector pay at the levels they are? 

 

All this im afraid is a result from the crash and the state they left the economy in.

 

We still have to borrow 50 odd billion each year now just to stand still, but hey, let's put up pay, invest more in everything, give free tuition fees, nationalise public services......

 

As for the public sector it would be great if there was 6/7 billion around to give them a rise but there's not. I also think overall the majority on are on fairly decent wages / pensions compared to a lot of people. Much better ways to spend that money. Sure they should be in the queue, but they shouldn't be heading it. A lot more worthy causes such as disabled etc.

 

But no, all politicians are terrified of upsetting the public sector so I'll sure they'll get their bit in the Autumn. I hope when they do it's targeted at the low earners and not across the board.

[strawb 4247]

Voted labour this year though, apropos of nowt

[Christmas Tree 4725]

17 minutes ago, Ant said:

 

you think wrong, but that's the problem you think things rather than find out and then make stupid comments about how things should be done even though you've no basis for what you're saying

 

 

Compare a nurses wage to a carer

in a Care home.

 

a policemans to a security guard.

 

lots of people in shops, offices and call centres can only dream of the pay and pensions of the public sector.

[strawb 4247]

They do different jobs mate, hence the different pay

[Dr Gloom 21912]

Public sector workers have had below inflation pay rises (pay cuts in other words) for 7 years now under these utter cunts.

[Dr Gloom 21912]

It's no wonder people have had enough of austerity. The £1bn+ the tories were able to pluck from the magic money tree for the DUP encapsulates how austerity was an ideological choice rather than a necessity, and these cunts have the gall to cheer in the commons when they condemned police, nurses et all to more of the same treatment.

Edited July 1, 2017 by Dr Gloom

[ewerk 30544]

29 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Compare a nurses wage to a carer

in a Care home.

 

a policemans to a security guard.

 

lots of people in shops, offices and call centres can only dream of the pay and pensions of the public sector.

 

True. The Chief Executive of my local council gets paid £100k pa and has a cushy pension. I don't get paid £100k. What are these commie public servant cunts moaning about?

[Renton 21567]

1 hour ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Compare a nurses wage to a carer

in a Care home.

 

a policemans to a security guard.

 

lots of people in shops, offices and call centres can only dream of the pay and pensions of the public sector.

Let's compare highly trained professionals with life and death responsibility with untrained people with much less responsibility. Then let's say there should be a race to the bottom with the former getting the latter's pay and conditions.

 

 

 

[ewerk 30544]

4 hours ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

 

70's labour

Winter of discontent, unions out of control, imf loans, almost bankrupt, "weak man of Europe".

 

cue Tories who leave a strong economy and a transformed country.

 

97 labour

create a benefit culture, fail to prevent mass immigration, ruin generation to come with PFI's, take us into an illegal war, destroy Iraq, ignore hillsbrough, fail to regulate banks, mid staffs, no money left.

 

Cue Tories to create 3 million jobs, turn around the economy, sort pension time bomb, legalise same sex marriage, pay down the deficit.

 

anyway, we've done all this before so not getting dragged back into this

 

 

Quote

 Britain is currently the worst performing major economy in the world and among the EU28.

 

[Christmas Tree 4725]

3 hours ago, Renton said:

Let's compare highly trained professionals with life and death responsibility with untrained people with much less responsibility. Then let's say there should be a race to the bottom with the former getting the latter's pay and conditions.

 

 

 

 

My point is simply there's a hell of a lot more people in society having a tougher time than most public sector workers. 

[Christmas Tree 4725]

2 hours ago, ewerk said:

 

 

 

Based on one quarter that normally gets revised up later in the year.

[ewerk 30544]

19 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Based on one quarter that normally gets revised up later in the year.

 Based on a quarter that was subsequently revised down. Actually.

[Renton 21567]

52 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

My point is simply there's a hell of a lot more people in society having a tougher time than most public sector workers. 

 

What an amazing point. 

 

So these people aren't doing well under a Tory government either?

 

Then who is? Want me to spell it out?

[Meenzer 15518]