2017 GE 1

[Renton 21985]

Whereas voting for the party that will actively work to make your life harder is the pinnacle of common sense. We aren't relevant enough for anyone to nuke these days ffs. On the other hand, we actually DO have falling standards of living.

 

Loads of taxi drivers (self employed) believe they are better off under the tories (CT and HF's dad for two), maybe they are right.

 

Unilateral disarmament was one of the principle reasons Labour were annihilated in the early 80s. To say we are not relevant enough to nuke is bizarre. We are the worlds 5th/6th biggest economy and one of the biggest spenders on military defence. We are more significant than Russia. Who is worthy of nuking ffs?

 

As soon as Corbyn said what he did about the deterrent, he rendered himself completely unelectable to the large majority of the public. The public you are labelling as morons for disagreeing.

 

I'd never vote for May but fuck me I really don't know if I can lend support to Corbyn. 

[Park Life 71]

Rayvin and Renton

 

[NJS 4411]

Loads of taxi drivers (self employed) believe they are better off under the tories (CT and HF's dad for two), maybe they are right.

 

Unilateral disarmament was one of the principle reasons Labour were annihilated in the early 80s. To say we are not relevant enough to nuke is bizarre. We are the worlds 5th/6th biggest economy and one of the biggest spenders on military defence. We are more significant than Russia. Who is worthy of nuking ffs? [emoji38]

 

As soon as Corbyn said what he did about the deterrent, he rendered himself completely unelectable to the large majority of the public. The public you are labelling as morons for disagreeing.

 

I'd never vote for May but fuck me I really don't know if I can lend support to Corbyn.

5th behind Germany and Japan who don't have their own nukes.

 

Cock waving nonsense.

[PaddockLad 17645]

I think Gloom started a thread a while back saying replacing trident was patent bollocks. He's largely correct, but he and JC fail to factor in vast swathes of the great British public (and Renton ) still being obsessed with fighting 20th century wars.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

MassIve waste of money

[Howmanheyman 33835]

Or they just think some of Corbyn's "policies" are moronic. Like the one where he has stated he would in no circumstances ever use our nuclear deterrent, for instance.

 

This taxi driver and many traditional Labour voters can see him for the utter charlatan he is. Mocking people like that and calling them fucking stupid only reflects badly on you.

They can see him for the utter charlatan he is but were having a charlatan vision outage when brexit was on the agenda and Johnson and co were talking shite and also had a charlatan vision outage at the last general election.

[Renton 21985]

5th behind Germany and Japan who don't have their own nukes.

 

Cock waving nonsense.

 

I think there's fairly obvious historical reasons those countries don'y employ a nuclear deterrent and save for that they would have. Since the nuclear proliferation treaty it's one thing not to actively develop nuclear weapons but another to unilaterally give them up. No real examples of the latter either other than possibly South Africa. 

[Renton 21985]

I think Gloom started a thread a while back saying replacing trident was patent bollocks. He's largely correct, but he and JC fail to factor in vast swathes of the great British public (and Renton ) still being obsessed with fighting 20th century wars.

 

Maybe it is 20th century thinking but can you really predict the 21st century? Nuclear proliferation is probably a greater threat now than in the 80s imo.

 

As a teenager I was a supporter of CND. As I grew older I read more about history and now believe nuclear weapons are the only thing that prevented a third world war. Do you think it's coincidence none of the nuclear powers have come into direct conflict since WW2? As a historical nuclear power I think it is prudent to keep an independent deterrent, and so do most others. Using ad hom attacks against the majority who think differently to you is not proof you've won the argument. 

[adios 717]

War is peace.

[Renton 21985]

They can see him for the utter charlatan he is but were having a charlatan vision outage when brexit was on the agenda and Johnson and co were talking shite and also had a charlatan vision outage at the last general election.

 

I thought most Labour voters voted Remain? 

 

I'm fucking sick of this debate about Corbyn. I said as soon as he was elected he would be a disaster for the Labour party and by extension the country, and I've been proved 100% correct. The fact he has been so ineffectual against a party imposing austerity led by Theresa Fucking May speaks volumes about the man. Charlatan sums him up perfectly.  

[NJS 4411]

He may be a charlatan but he isn't encouraging people to vote tory unlike your hero.

[Renton 21985]

He may be a charlatan but he isn't encouraging people to vote tory unlike your hero.

You've lost me there like. What has Brian Cox done now?

[NJS 4411]

Blair saying opposing Brexit is more important than voting for parties and people should vote on that basis.

Edited April 23, 2017 by NJS

[Renton 21985]

Blair saying opposing Brexit is more important than voting for parties a day people should vote on that basis.

Ahh, Blair is my hero? How juvenile.

 

There was no greater critic than me of Blair about Iraq 2 and I couldn't give a shit about what he has done since retiring. Still, at least he has a consistent position on Brexit, unlike Corbyn.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

Blair is unquestionably a cunt, but Iraq aside, he wasn't a bad labour leader. At least he was electable, unlike jezza.

[NJS 4411]

He was electable by being a tory. That's the sad truth of this country.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

Corbyn is having a nightmare with his approach to Brexit but I do have a little sympathy for him, given how it's split the labour vote in half. He would be wise to pick a position though and communicate it. At the moment it just looks like he's dodging the issue and offering no alternative to the tories on the issue of the election.

 

Pathetic of Farron to rule out forming a coalition too, though I suspect he'd perform a spectacular if the chance to govern in coalition presented itself.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

He was electable by being a tory. That's the sad truth of this country.

If you review what he actually achieved in office you'll see that's patently bollocks. Ideologically nothing like the cunts who've been running the show this decade.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

But agree that the truth of this country is do you don't win elections from the far left.

 

Win power by speaking to middle England then introduce progressive policies from Downing Street.

[Renton 21985]

Aye, according to NJS we've had the same government for 38 years. If that's what you believe NJS, why even bother with political discourse. If "true labour" has to be Benn, Foot, or Corbyn, just accept nobody wants it.

[NJS 4411]

If you review what he actually achieved in office you'll see that's patently bollocks. Ideologically nothing like the cunts who've been running the show this decade.

Privatisations/ no renationalisations? Check

Involving private finance and crippling the NHS with the debt? Check

Encouraging a property bubble ensuring the poor struggle? Check

Laissez-faire attitude to regulation bordering on worship of the city? Check

Not one of Thatchers crimes corrected? Check

Happy to sell arms to butchers? Check

ATOS? Check

 

Yeah achievements - not one thing Major or Cameron wouldn't have done.

[NJS 4411]

Aye, according to NJS we've had the same government for 38 years. If that's what you believe NJS, why even bother with political discourse. If "true labour" has to be Benn, Foot, or Corbyn, just accept nobody wants it.

If the available range is Thatcher to Blair then it is pointless and it is the same government.

[Renton 21985]

Righto.

[Park Life 71]

He won't stop till he does one of those B-sides and remix album. Then promote it on Breakfast telly.

[Rayvin 5295]

If the available range is Thatcher to Blair then it is pointless and it is the same government.

I'm sure this will come as a surprise to no one, but I agree with this. Only caveat being that of the two I'd still prefer Blair, even if all that does is offer the acceptable face of the same coin.

 

That said, Renton is ultimately right. People don't vote for actual progress. I think this is because they're fucking stupid, he thinks it's because they're concerned about being nuked by Russia. Either way, the press dictates what is and is not acceptable to vote for, and a lack of critical thinking from people generally makes governance along the same basic trajectory very easy.

Edited April 23, 2017 by Rayvin