Nottingham Forest v Newcastle United - Friday 2 December - 7.45pm - Sky Sports

[Dr Gloom 22510]

The two penalty saves did it, I think, especially the second. If we'd let that in the second half would've been a massacre IMO. But keeping the penalties out really spurred the team on.

 

Just goes to show what a difference it makes having a quality keeper, and makes it more galling that we went out of the cup on Tuesday thanks to the comedy antics of someone who really shouldn't be anything but fourth choice. 

 

As far as Shelvey goes, I think Rafa will rapidly lose patience with him, the same way he's done with Mitrovic. He doesn't want undisciplined players getting themselves suspended all the time and derailing our momentum. It wouldn't surprise me if we bought a new creative midfielder to replace Shelvey in January. 

 

is darlwo the new krul? he's making a decent case to be the new number 1. though elliot was no mug last season either. time to ditch the coward?  #essembee

[The Fish 11068]

I don't think I'd want any more than that other than squad players.

Personally I think 4 quality players would be ideal.

Yeah, 4 top flight players plus maybe a couple of prospects. 

 

Although over the course of 2 windows, I'd be happy to add 6+ players. We sign an attacking midfielder to rotate with Shelvey, a young striker like Tammy Abraham in January, then 4 quality players in the summer?

[David Kelly 1280]

I think we need an attacking midfielder and we might have to bite the bullet and just get one that does us for the rest of the season.  We're highly unlikely to get better than Shelvey in January.  If we get promoted and buy one they I'd want us to be looking for an improvement on Shelvey tbh.

If we go up we definitely need a number 10 and a left winger.  They would be my priorities.

[Dr Gloom 22510]

and drop the gouff?

 

yeah, alright then. 

[StoneColdStephenIreland 74]

Perez's best position is out on the wing imo as he doesn't seem as lost out there but it's hard to drop one of our current wingers in favour of him with his current form.

 

Well definitely need another winger when we go up as Gouffran was always out of his depth in the Prem.

[David Kelly 1280]

Gouffran is out of contract in the summer. I can't see it being renewed.

[Dr Gloom 22510]

Don't you think he's earned an extension?

[Rayvin 5572]

I like the guy but still not convinced he can hack it in the PL, even as cover. That said, I wouldn't have made replacing him a priority.

[aimaad22 4370]

I think we've a core that can do it in the Prem.

 

Darlow, Elliot, Krul

Yedlin

Mbemba, Lascelles, Clark

----

Anita, Hayden,

Shelvey 

Ritchie, Atsu

Mitrovic

 

There's a lot of ifs and buts in that core

 

Clark can be a bit iffy, was for Villa anyway. Mbemba/Lascelles have a lot to learn still, its a young partnership. But because the ability seems to be there we should stick with them.There'll be games when we wish for a more solid experienced partnership though I think. Anita is a squad player at premiership level. Can do a good job at times but like we've discussed often before he lacks the physicality and the talent/ability needed in lieu of it at that level. Shelvey and Mitro have big question marks over consistency. More confident about Ritchie being a decent player for us. Atsu and Hayden are far from proven premiership players.

 

Im still not in favour of an overhaul, attitude and commitment seems to be spot on now. With the right additions around this group you'd back Rafa to establish us again in the premiership. And hopefully build on from there gradually. Just saying there's a fair bit of work still to be done on this group, they'll do well in this league but unless we supplement them with a 3-4 quality additions we'll be asking for trouble next year imo.

[aimaad22 4370]

I think we need an attacking midfielder and we might have to bite the bullet and just get one that does us for the rest of the season.  We're highly unlikely to get better than Shelvey in January.  If we get promoted and buy one they I'd want us to be looking for an improvement on Shelvey tbh.

If we go up we definitely need a number 10 and a left winger.  They would be my priorities.

 

Yeah and left back too. That position seems to have been a problem area for forever now. Who was the last quality LB we had? Bernard?

 

Perez is a funny one. Really thought he'd go on to be real quality. Still time for him of course but he just seems to have gone completely off the boil. 

[David Kelly 1280]

Don't you think he's earned an extension?

He's done a job this season and balanced out the team but he's not been great. And I wouldn't expect more of him if we go up. He's also in his 30's now so I expect this will be his last season.

[Dr Gloom 22510]

I'd give him an extra year. Rafa likes a grafter and he's certainly shown more discipline and attacking threat than he ever did under Pardew, albeit against poorer opposition. He's been a bit like dirk kuyt was for him at Liverpool. Unspectacular but solid.

 

Agree that he shouldn't be first team material next season.

[The Fish 11068]

There's a lot of ifs and buts in that core

 

Clark can be a bit iffy, was for Villa anyway. Mbemba/Lascelles have a lot to learn still, its a young partnership. But because the ability seems to be there we should stick with them.There'll be games when we wish for a more solid experienced partnership though I think. Anita is a squad player at premiership level. Can do a good job at times but like we've discussed often before he lacks the physicality and the talent/ability needed in lieu of it at that level. Shelvey and Mitro have big question marks over consistency. More confident about Ritchie being a decent player for us. Atsu and Hayden are far from proven premiership players.

 

Im still not in favour of an overhaul, attitude and commitment seems to be spot on now. With the right additions around this group you'd back Rafa to establish us again in the premiership. And hopefully build on from there gradually. Just saying there's a fair bit of work still to be done on this group, they'll do well in this league but unless we supplement them with a 3-4 quality additions we'll be asking for trouble next year imo.

Good post and I agree with much of it. I think there's shades of grey with each of them, no one player is 100% good enough for the Premier League. I just fancy that Rafa's Anita will be much better than McClaren's, Carver's or Pardew's. 

 

I totally agree we need to add 4-5 players, around that core and maybe add a couple more young prospects.

[Alex 35913]

Yeah and left back too. That position seems to have been a problem area for forever now. Who was the last quality LB we had? Bernard?

 

Perez is a funny one. Really thought he'd go on to be real quality. Still time for him of course but he just seems to have gone completely off the boil. 

Enrique, unless you're CT.

[aimaad22 4370]

Knew I was missing someone, thought it was Santon

 

Enrique was solid aye. Bernard was on a different level though I think, for a couple of years at least during the CL years with Sir Bobby. Especially going forward.

[The Fish 11068]

Knew I was missing someone, thought it was Santon

 

Enrique was solid aye. Bernard was on a different level though I think, for a couple of years at least during the CL years with Sir Bobby. Especially going forward.

Not really, he was as suspect at the back as the rest of them. I thought Enrique was the pick of the bunch, especially because of the relationships he had with Colo and Jonas on the left.

[Alex 35913]

Knew I was missing someone, thought it was Santon

 

Enrique was solid aye. Bernard was on a different level though I think, for a couple of years at least during the CL years with Sir Bobby. Especially going forward.

Enrique was a much better full-back than Bernard imo.

[David Kelly 1280]

Enrique was a much better full-back than Bernard imo.

Agreed.  Ricky was the best we've had since Beresford/Elliott.

[David Kelly 1280]

Good post and I agree with much of it. I think there's shades of grey with each of them, no one player is 100% good enough for the Premier League. I just fancy that Rafa's Anita will be much better than McClaren's, Carver's or Pardew's. 

 

I totally agree we need to add 4-5 players, around that core and maybe add a couple more young prospects.

Rafa's Anita was still looking shit in midfield at the start of the season.  He looked competent at rightback at the end of last season though.  He's another who's out of contract in the summer but he's younger and Rafa does seem to love him so I could see him getting a new contract. 

[aimaad22 4370]

Not really, he was as suspect at the back as the rest of them. I thought Enrique was the pick of the bunch, especially because of the relationships he had with Colo and Jonas on the left.

 

See there's my point, Bernard had to play with O'Brien and Bramble and what not

 

Okay not going to debate this after forgetting the guy's name I guess most of the defensive errors I can recall from that time were by the above two, and Bernard WAS quality going forward

 

Cant have many complaints with Enrique, he was quality. Before shaving his head and being shite for Liverpool.

Edited December 6, 2016 by aimaad22

[David Kelly 1280]

I'd give him an extra year. Rafa likes a grafter and he's certainly shown more discipline and attacking threat than he ever did under Pardew, albeit against poorer opposition. He's been a bit like dirk kuyt was for him at Liverpool. Unspectacular but solid.

 

Agree that he shouldn't be first team material next season.

The whole left side of the pitch needs replacing in the summer (although I'll reserve judgement on Lazaar until I've seen  more of him).  I wouldn't be against keeping Gouffran as a squad member if he had time left on his contract.  But I'm not keen on, and can't see us, offering him a new one.

[rogerbarton 24]

I'd love to see us bring in a winger with a bit of flair about them. Pleased with Ritchie, as I was with Townsend, but I'd love to see another Ginola, Ben Arfa or Robert. Not sure those temperamental characters go down well with Rafa, like.

[The Fish 11068]

The whole left side of the pitch needs replacing in the summer (although I'll reserve judgement on Lazaar until I've seen  more of him).  I wouldn't be against keeping Gouffran as a squad member if he had time left on his contract.  But I'm not keen on, and can't see us, offering him a new one.

 

I'd love to see us bring in a winger with a bit of flair about them. Pleased with Ritchie, as I was with Townsend, but I'd love to see another Ginola, Ben Arfa or Robert. Not sure those temperamental characters go down well with Rafa, like.

 

I like the looks of Atsu, if he can improve his final ball and decision making he'll be tip top.

 

Agree that that kind of mercurial Gauloises-smoking, Proust-quoting, genius doesn't dovetail with Benitez's pragmatic approach to football. @@Gemmill must be delighted. 

[Tom 14021]

According to Caulkin & Ryder (sic) BOTH red cards are to be overturned.

[David Kelly 1280]

Aye seen that.  Fucking ref should get sacked for that game.

 

I'm surprised like.