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I think this is just the "red mirage" that was widely predicted. Trump's behaviour makes me think he knows he has lost. I have faith the Supreme Court will not back him on stopping the mail count. If they do its going to be a civil war in the US. Feeling cautiously optimistic that staes such as Wisconsin and Michigan will be comfortable for Biden. Less sure about Pennsylvania, some right wierdos there. 

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37 minutes ago, Renton said:

I think this is just the "red mirage" that was widely predicted. Trump's behaviour makes me think he knows he has lost. I have faith the Supreme Court will not back him on stopping the mail count. If they do its going to be a civil war in the US. Feeling cautiously optimistic that staes such as Wisconsin and Michigan will be comfortable for Biden. Less sure about Pennsylvania, some right wierdos there. 

I follow a Dr on Twitter who is from Pa. he reckons it's looking good for Biden, Governor is a Dem and very highly thought of evidently, loads of postal votes not counted (~60%) mainly in known Dem counties

Edit, either way it's closer than it needed to be to avoid a shit show

 

Edited by Toonpack
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If it is a 'red mirage' it's a damn convincing one. I just looked at PA and trump is 600k ahead with only 2.5m votes left to count. I mean it's possible for sure but it's going to be a case of squeaking over the line rather than crashing through it.

 

Wisconsin also not filling me with optimism, 94% votes counted and Trump 100k up. That's legitimately in "could go either way" territory.

 

Agree that Trump is making all the noises to indicate defeat but this is nowhere near as convincing as it should have been.

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2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

If it is a 'red mirage' it's a damn convincing one. I just looked at PA and trump is 600k ahead with only 2.5m votes left to count. I mean it's possible for sure but it's going to be a case of squeaking over the line rather than crashing through it.

 

Wisconsin also not filling me with optimism, 94% votes counted and Trump 100k up. That's legitimately in "could go either way" territory.

 

Agree that Trump is making all the noises to indicate defeat but this is nowhere near as convincing as it should have been.

It was always going to be close, tbf. Trump has the incumbent’s advantage, which is huge over there. Most presidents survive a second term. He’d be walking it if it wasn’t for covid.  

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1 minute ago, The Fish said:

I still don't fully understand the logic behind Electoral College?

 

It's an anachronism IMO. It gives weighting to rural states that their populations don't justify to ensure that the interests of farmers weren't overlooked back in the day when farming mattered more.

 

It's the same shit that happens here really. The Tories get an 80 seat majority through the capture of rural, underpopulated constituencies.

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1 minute ago, Rayvin said:

 

It's an anachronism IMO. It gives weighting to rural states that their populations don't justify to ensure that the interests of farmers weren't overlooked back in the day when farming mattered more.

 

It's the same shit that happens here really. The Tories get an 80 seat majority through the capture of rural, underpopulated constituencies.

 

But because it benefits Republicans they're not going to change it and will successfully paint any proposed replacement as elitism?

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8 minutes ago, The Fish said:

I still don't fully understand the logic behind Electoral College?

Had a quick look on wiki which suggests a large part of its adoption was related to the enslaved population in the south having no vote. 
Also found this gem, from Alexander Hamilton

”Hamilton was also concerned about somebody unqualified but with a talent for "low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity" attaining high office”

 

:lol:

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14 minutes ago, The Fish said:

I still don't fully understand the logic behind Electoral College?

It’s basically FPTP with bigger constituencies. Neither are fit for  purpose anymore imo. Edit: except the constituencies are different sizes and weighted accordingly of course. 

Edited by Alex
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9 minutes ago, The Fish said:

 

But because it benefits Republicans they're not going to change it and will successfully paint any proposed replacement as elitism?

 

There probably is an argument to say that avoiding cities dominating everything entirely is worth pursuing, but the extent to which the EC favours republicans is depressing. That said, on this occasion, I'm not sure it's really the issue - the votes (at least so far) look pretty much neck in neck. Can't blame this one on EC I don't think.

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I did worry that, like last time round, the Democrats had somehow managed to put forward a candidate capable of losing to Trump. Whatever happens it’s a lot closer than it probably should’ve been given the backdrop. You have to think a lot of that is down to Biden being so uninspiring 

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1 minute ago, Alex said:

I did worry that, like last time round, the Democrats had somehow managed to put forward a candidate capable of losing to Trump. Whatever happens it’s a lot closer than it probably should’ve been given the backdrop. You have to think a lot of that is down to Biden being so uninspiring 

 

I think so. I know Renton finds it objectionable but I really, really believe that no matter the political stripe of a candidate, people are looking for vision. Biden and Hillary offered none of that.

 

Biden 2020 would have lost to trump in 2016 too, I'm pretty certain of that. The only reason he'll win this (I really hope he wins this) is that people have been able to see how dangerous Trump actually is.

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11 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

There probably is an argument to say that avoiding cities dominating everything entirely is worth pursuing, but the extent to which the EC favours republicans is depressing. That said, on this occasion, I'm not sure it's really the issue - the votes (at least so far) look pretty much neck in neck. Can't blame this one on EC I don't think.

 

Well there's huge useless with gerrymandering and voter suppression to contend with too. The system is massively rigged to favour the GOP. 

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8 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

There probably is an argument to say that avoiding cities dominating everything entirely is worth pursuing, but the extent to which the EC favours republicans is depressing. That said, on this occasion, I'm not sure it's really the issue - the votes (at least so far) look pretty much neck in neck. Can't blame this one on EC I don't think.

Democrats don't seem to have learned that it's not about policy, it's personality now. They needed an Obama, someone that would excite the base and be palatable to the others. Instead they've gone for Boring Biden. 

 

Democracy has jumped the shark now.

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1 minute ago, Rayvin said:

 

I think so. I know Renton finds it objectionable but I really, really believe that no matter the political stripe of a candidate, people are looking for vision. Biden and Hillary offered none of that.

 

Biden 2020 would have lost to trump in 2016 too, I'm pretty certain of that. The only reason he'll win this (I really hope he wins this) is that people have been able to see how dangerous Trump actually is.

if you take covid out of the picture, trump hammers biden. and i'm afraid to say he hammers warren and sanders too. america doesn't want their vision. 

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With Nevada, Biden needs two of the last five whereas Trump needs four. 

 

Wisconsin is looking good for Biden so Michigan or Georgia would do it. I hope this happens as if it comes down to Penn the legal shit will get very messy. 

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Just now, Dr Gloom said:

if you take covid out of the picture, trump hammers biden. and i'm afraid to say he hammers warren and sanders too. america doesn't want their vision. 

Yet the Fox exit polls suggest majority support for decent policies. It's like the UK where "values" are becoming king. 

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  • Andrew changed the title to President Biden

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