Yahoo secretly scanned customer emails on behalf of U.S. intelligence

[Gemmill 44881]

 

 

if they're intelligence is anything like my own.

Well on this evidence, let's hope not.

[Gemmill 44881]

I can see why Mark Zuckerberg might take the precaution if taping up his Webcam, but J69 of Chester-le-street?

 

Howay man, find something else to complain about, there's plenty.

Easy to say when you aren't sat with your trousers round your ankles and a pair of Jap panties taped to your face.

[Renton 21626]

Can't see that video or whatever it is HF (damn you big brother!) but have you any solutions to your fears that wouldn't involve setting up an overarching snooping agency to snoop on the snoopers?

[Dr Gloom 21924]

Frankly, in an age where the main threat to security comes from small cell but co-ordinated terrorists, investment in surveillance is a necessity. The money is better spent on that than on nuclear weapons, which seem a conete waste of money in this age.

 

Perhaps the Paris attacks could have been averted if there was more cross border work in this area.

 

On a personal level, I find it unsettling. The infringement of civil liberties seems wrong But i don't think we've reached big brother levels just yet and if it helps stop more nutters conspiring to blow up innocent people then I'm all for it. The only thing I wouldn't want aired in public is my perverted porn search history but I doubt it's the worst out there or if it'd be of much interest to anyone other than my Mrs.

[Renton 21626]

It's so far beyond what we're discussing here. What we're having is a genuine debate about things that are already two decades out of date. If they target you they can predict what you think, what you are likely to do in any situation and the same for everyone you know or have ever had contact with.

 

For instance they farm data on say 100,000 individuals their computers have modeled who might be high risk, then they put our a fake news story or some social media claptrap and they monitor and calibrate the reaction and interaction of those individuals to the bait.

For the last time, who the fuck are "THEY"?

[Happy Face 29]

 

https://theintercept.com/2016/10/05/fbi-secret-methods-for-recruiting-informants-at-the-border/

 

Story on the Intercept yesterday with documents showing that the US border patrol shares passenger information with the FBI on people in no way linked to any crime.  Intention being to detain and interview these people at the border and turn them into informants if they can be useful, depending on where they come from, where they travel, what they do for work and that.

 

This isn't the odd rogue fbi worker abusing power to the detriment of law-abiding citizens, this is the policy of how to use private information on law-abioding citizens.

[Renton 21626]

Frankly, in an age where the main threat to security comes from small cell but co-ordinated terrorists, investment in surveillance is a necessity. The money is better spent on that than on nuclear weapons, which seem a conete waste of money in this age.

 

Perhaps the Paris attacks could have been averted if there was more cross border work in this area.

 

On a personal level, I find it unsettling. The infringement of civil liberties seems wrong But i don't think we've reached big brother levels just yet and if it helps stop more nutters conspiring to blow up innocent people then I'm all for it. The only thing I wouldn't want aired in public is my perverted porn search history but I doubt it's the worst out there or if it'd be of much interest to anyone other than my Mrs.

Well that's what incognito mode is for.

[Happy Face 29]

Can't see that video or whatever it is HF (damn you big brother!) but have you any solutions to your fears that wouldn't involve setting up an overarching snooping agency to snoop on the snoopers?

 

There are companies that protect privacy... Apple have been excellent on privacy.  Whatsapp provide encryption.  As I mentioned Signal, protonmail, duckduckgo, Tor.   Mega encrypt your cloud storage.  Companies that use open source encryption rather than proprietary should allay any fears Parky has that such security is just lip service.

 

The secret service will not be restrained in their pursuit of our information or open about the tools and companies they use to do so, their mantra is "collect it all".

 

The problem is that even when the information on what is happening is available a majority either don't pay attention or aren't that bothered by it and are happy enough with the trade off of getting simple, free, cross platform syncing communication tools and losing their privacy.

[Happy Face 29]

Well that's what incognito mode is for.

 

Incognito keeps the information off your computer (so the wife and kids can't find it) and Google's advertising algorithm (so nowt embarrassing appears during normal browsing).

 

The history is all retained on Google servers though.

[Park Life 71]

Well that's what incognito mode is for.

[Renton 21626]

There are companies that protect privacy... Apple have been excellent on privacy. Whatsapp provide encryption. As I mentioned Signal, protonmail, duckduckgo, Tor. Mega encrypt your cloud storage. Companies that use open source encryption rather than proprietary should allay any fears Parky has that such security is just lip service.

 

The secret service will not be restrained in their pursuit of our information or open about the tools and companies they use to do so, their mantra is "collect it all".

 

The problem is that even when the information on what is happening is available a majority either don't pay attention or aren't that bothered by it and are happy enough with the trade off of getting simple, free, cross platform syncing communication tools and losing their privacy.

Well the trade off as far as I can see is that genuine terrorists and organised criminals are going to go undetected to preserve your nebulous concept of privacy. So, for instance, when it is claimed that over 100 terrorists attacks have been thwarted in the UK since 7/7, are you:

 

Saying mass murder going ahead is a price worth paying for privacy.

 

OR

 

Are you inclined to think this figure is fabricated?

[Renton 21626]

Incognito keeps the information off your computer (so the wife and kids can't find it) and Google's advertising algorithm (so nowt embarrassing appears during normal browsing).

 

The history is all retained on Google servers though.

And it's completely transparent about that. My only concern is the wife doesn't find out about my BR Deltic circa 1968 to 1978 fetish.

[Happy Face 29]

Well the trade off as far as I can see is that genuine terrorists and organised criminals are going to go undetected to preserve your nebulous concept of privacy. So, for instance, when it is claimed that over 100 terrorists attacks have been thwarted in the UK since 7/7, are you:

 

Saying mass murder going ahead is a price worth paying for privacy.

 

OR

 

Are you inclined to think this figure is fabricated?

 

I think the security services could point to evidence of all the incidents they say they have thwarted.  The problem is that the security services are heavily involved in facillitating many of those incidents in the first place

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/opinion/sunday/terrorist-plots-helped-along-by-the-fbi.html

 

How many would have happened without that support?

 

On security Vs Liberty, I agree with Benjamin Franklin

 

Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

[Kid Dynamite 7029]

I can see why Mark Zuckerberg might take the precaution if taping up his Webcam, but J69 of Chester-le-street?

 

Howay man, find something else to complain about, there's plenty.

You are spectacularly missing the point. I'm sure they aren't watching me, but if I started making some dodgy Google searches or decided I wanted to enter politics and became better known then it would be a different story.

 

This whole 'they can do what they want cos I've got nothing to hide' argument makes me laugh. Nazi Germany/North Korea ran on a similar theory

[Renton 21626]

So it's your contention then that my latter choice is correct, ALL these prevented acts of terrorism were essentially fabricated through entrapment? Can't say I agree that's likely.

[Renton 21626]

You are spectacularly missing the point. I'm sure they aren't watching me, but if I started making some dodgy Google searches or decided I wanted to enter politics and became better known then it would be a different story.

 

This whole 'they can do what they want cos I've got nothing to hide' argument makes me laugh. Nazi Germany/North Korea ran on a similar theory

"They" again. I have asked dozens of times who this is and have never once had a serious reply. Until I do it is just lazy paranoid conspiracy theory to me.

 

You've also offered zero proof "they" have the ability or inclination to snoop on you prospectively or retrospectively through your web cam. Can you even name a single person who has entered politics who has had his Google searches used against him or herself?

Edited October 6, 2016 by Renton

[Kid Dynamite 7029]

Things like that don't tend to be advertised in the papers. Boris Johnson worked for years to position himself as the next prime minister and pulled out at the 11th hour. Plenty of rumours that he was blackmailed into stepping down

 

Funnily enough this just cropped up on Twitter

 

[Renton 21626]

Fascism is a political movement. I think we need to separate the technological aspects of this issue from the political (is the technology versus those who use/abuse it).

 

I think it's widely accepted that Boris Johnson was stabbed in the back by Gove. Without offering a shred of evidence, you have indicated that it is really due to some mysterious, undefined, dark forces who have access to his internet history, and have randomly offered us a poem about fascism. If that's the best you've got I think I'll continue to sleep easily in bed for now.

[Rayvin 5223]

To be fair, all points being made here are good ones. It depends on how much you trust the establishment, ultimately.

[Happy Face 29]

So it's your contention then that my latter choice is correct, ALL these prevented acts of terrorism were essentially fabricated through entrapment? Can't say I agree that's likely.

 

No,  I've covered this and you've misrepresented what I said intentiaonally with block capitals for emphasis.  There is evidence that many folied attacks are actually facilitated by security services.  Any number of foiled attacks presented to the public should therefore take that into consideration on the sensible conclusion that some of the attacks would never have taken place anyway without the help of security services.

 

There is always a risk of terrorist attacks.  No "war on terror" can EVER be won or seen as temporary in response to a short lived escalation, so the question is what is a proportional response to the actual danger faced that balances security and liberty.  I'm sure you are well aware of the statistics on the liklihood of being killed by various things which places terror attacks among the lowest threats we face daily.  I don't agree with it being the justification for a litany of erosions to our freedom.  From emails snooping to travel bans, from outlawed protest to criminalised whistleblowing.

[Kid Dynamite 7029]

Fascism is a political movement. I think we need to separate the technological aspects of this issue from the political (is the technology versus those who use/abuse it).

 

I think it's widely accepted that Boris Johnson was stabbed in the back by Gove. Without offering a shred of evidence, you have indicated that it is really due to some mysterious, undefined, dark forces who have access to his internet history, and have randomly offered us a poem about fascism. If that's the best you've got I think I'll continue to sleep easily in bed for now.

You don't have to agree with any of the points I've made but your condescension just makes you sound like a cunt tbh

[Dr Gloom 21924]

You don't have to agree with any of the points I've made but your condescension just makes you sound like a cunt tbh

 

[Park Life 71]

Renton couldn't care less about the people who's lives have been degraded and impacted by illegal surveillance. He deserves to be on a watch list for his holier than thou - leisure-fair approach to this important topic. War on Renton!

 

*Nice bit of auto-correct there.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Park Life

[Dr Gloom 21924]

leisure fair  

[Park Life 71]

leisure fair

Sums the man up tbh.