adios 717 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I do kind of agree with Quiff about the extent it's got to (other than the weird virgin slur). I was talking to a young male American friend of mine, and they do seem genuinely confused about where the line is. Like he seemed worried about shagging someone while they were pissed without written consent. Unless you're a complete aspie, it should be pretty obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7034 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Tbf that yank college swimmer that just got away scot free after pulling an unconscious lasses knickers down and touching her up shows that there are big issues in the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Yeah, I guess both sides are being fuckwits, especially given that Limbaugh quote I posted in the other thread. Obviously one side is far, far worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strawb 4270 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Why is the onus on the man? If they didn't speak he didn't consent either I mean, you were the one using knock off viagra to get it up no? So you could send a telegram by the time you get hard. If you had sex (two hours after you double dropped your special pills) with a wasted girl you had never said a word to, is that not a bit strange? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGingerQuiff 2412 Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I mean, you were the one using knock off viagra to get it up no? So you could send a telegram by the time you get hard. If you had sex (two hours after you double dropped your special pills) with a wasted girl you had never said a word to, is that not a bit strange? Just as strange as it is for the wasted girl that is having sex with the wasted bloke that she's never spoken to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30656 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 He denied speaking to her, prior, during or after the sex. Where does the consent come from? When did he deny speaking to her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5226 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Just as strange as it is for the wasted girl that is having sex with the wasted bloke that she's never spoken to No one has an answer to this other than its a double standard mate. It's considered acceptable for a sober woman to sleep with a drunk man though because of stereotypes about men not being able to get it up when drunk and so on. Also I would imagine few men turn around later and claim they've been raped. Those that do are probably laughed out of court. There's the answer. Not saying it's right, but I can't think of any other conclusion. It's the same reason that female paedophiles get off easy. Narratives are more important that truth and rationality, IMO. As for Ched Evans, the whole thing will hopefully act as a warning to other young men. Also hope he'll be able to redeem his career to a degree. Unfortunately, this may also damage the outcomes of other rape cases where victims do deserve justice. That's the biggest danger with high profile cases like this. Im curious as to what the guardian is going to say given what they published on the topic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Do actual female paedophiles get off easy? ie. those who fiddle with prepubescent kids? Great topic for general football thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5226 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 (edited) Do actual female paedophiles get off easy? ie. those who fiddle with prepubescent kids? Great topic for general football thread. I'm probably being a bit liberal with the term but I've read a good number of cases of female teachers seducing and engaging with 13/14 year old boys. The sentences they get aren't equivalent. I don't even think it's called rape over here is it? Would a woman doing what Johnson did get the same sentence as him? No chance. But yes you're right about the thread. Although Ched Evans was the theme and we're not too far off that. I was just trying to answer quiff's question as helpfully as possible Edited October 15, 2016 by Rayvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4389 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 He denied speaking to her, prior, during or after the sex. Where does the consent come from?He supposedly came out with a general "can I join in" to the pair of them and she supposedly agreed - I don't think exactly how was stated - maybe she waved him over. On the US swimmer I think there's a difference between assuming consent by a lack of objection during foreplay and grabbing someone who's unconscious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30656 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 A lot of people hammered him at the time, and his lass for daring to suggest the girl involved might have been exaggerating. Just about every paper had the whole family down as moral pariahs and hounded him out of every club that offered him a second chance Does this all change now? He still took a pissed lass home and shagged her after his mate. A different jury just happens to think he's got implied consent this time round Be interesting to see how the papers handle it The papers will of course handle it in a rational, balanced manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7034 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 (edited) 'As a slim ball who treats women like dirt he is, GUILTY!!!' 'See ALL of Ola on page 3' It's like a Brass Eye skit Edited October 15, 2016 by StraightEdgeWizard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5226 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 What a waste of space the sun is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonatine 11405 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 https://thesecretbarrister.com/2016/10/14/10-myths-busted-about-the-ched-evans-case/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7034 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Interesting So it's alleged that she went home with a bloke the night before the alleged rape and someone else 2 weeks after it. Rightly or wrongly that in itself appears to have been enough to raise some doubt in the jury's mind. Evans family have shot themselves in the foot by offering £50k to anyone that came forward with new evidence though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4389 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 The one before shouldn't matter - if a "slag" is raped its still rape. The one after just raises questions of how she was affected by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4772 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 The one before shouldn't matter - if a "slag" is raped its still rape. The one after just raises questions of how she was affected by it. According to the secret barrister it wasn't that she had done it but the manner in which the two blokes described the sex with her being very similar to how Evans had done previously which could imply consent or reason to believe Evans felt he had it or that she was more in control of her faculties than had previously been considered. Reasonable doubt is all that's needed after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3902 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 According to the secret barrister it wasn't that she had done it but the manner in which the two blokes described the sex with her being very similar to how Evans had done previously which could imply consent or reason to believe Evans felt he had it or that she was more in control of her faculties than had previously been considered. Reasonable doubt is all that's needed after all. Did it point out they didn't make these similar descriptions in the original trial before the £50,000 was offered? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30656 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Wasn't there the main point that she had consensual sex with the guy three times and each time couldn't remember it the next morning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7034 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Aye, and it's not a case of 'rape is rape' as has been pointed out for the last 4 years. It's never been denied that she allowed him to have sex with her, only that she was too pissed to have the mental capacity to give that consent. And quite frankly if she's shagged 3 blokes in a fortnight and can't remember any of them then some of the blame needs to lie at her door for getting in that such a ridiculous state over and over again. If being 'raped' by a bloke doesn't stop you going out and doing the same again a fortnight later then you need to have a word with yourself All of this is conjecture of course and there's only 2 people who know exactly what happened in that hotel room Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4772 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Did it point out they didn't make these similar descriptions in the original trial before the £50,000 was offered? Yep, perhaps you should read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3902 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Wasn't there the main point that she had consensual sex with the guy three times and each time couldn't remember it the next morning? Which guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35113 Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Aye, and it's not a case of 'rape is rape' as has been pointed out for the last 4 years. It's never been denied that she allowed him to have sex with her, only that she was too pissed to have the mental capacity to give that consent. And quite frankly if she's shagged 3 blokes in a fortnight and can't remember any of them then some of the blame needs to lie at her door for getting in that such a ridiculous state over and over again. If being 'raped' by a bloke doesn't stop you going out and doing the same again a fortnight later then you need to have a word with yourself All of this is conjecture of course and there's only 2 people who know exactly what happened in that hotel room Just sounds like she's pretty fucked up tbh. It's not the behaviour of a happy person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30656 Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Which guy? At Mr Evans' retrial, the man, who cannot be named, said the woman stayed over at his house on two or three occasions prior to the alleged rape after meeting up at Rhyl's Zu Bar. He said on each occasion they were intimate but the next day she could not remember what had happened. Actually, they didn't have sex but were 'intimate'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3902 Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Actually, they didn't have sex but were 'intimate'. The guy who changed his testimony for some unknown reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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