David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Yup, the reason that Watson, Clark, and latterly Elliott, Hughes, (even Shola & Carroll) could get their chance is because the spine of the team was settled and committed to the club. The young players were able to be introduced to a system that most of the team were comfortable with. They were allowed to make mistakes and find their feet. Of course it helped that some of those were coming into a teams looking up the league, rather than down. Look at Everton, almost every season there's some new kid who's given chances and looks like he's capable of playing in the Premier League. I don't believe for one second that the congested North West produces more kids per club than we do. Watson, Clark, Elliott, Howey etc all struggled initially under Ossie. The mistake he made was to bring them all in together. Keegan realised this immediately and brought in the likes of Kilcline and Sheedy. The importance of having experienced players around the youngsters is something that our current regime has completely missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Watson, Clark, Elliott, Howey etc all struggled initially under Ossie. The mistake he made was to bring them all in together. Keegan realised this immediately and brought in the likes of Kilcline and Sheedy. The importance of having experienced players around the youngsters is something that our current regime has completely missed. Even though, in their tenure, they've seen young players blossom when playing alongside experienced pros; Carrol and Nolan should have been the blueprint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howmanheyman 33834 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 I was at a thing at Old Trafford recently and Frank Stapleton did a bit of a talk. I was talking to the guy who was with him (who does match day stuff with him) and he asked me who I supported and who my favourite player ever for us was. He was shocked when I said David Kelly rather than Shearer, Beardsley or Gazza etc. In fact he couldn't even remember Kelly. I coudln't really blame him for that as he wasn't a memorable player to supporters of other teams but personally I value the effort he put in with his much more limited ability (as well as saving us from the third division). I could have just as easily said Davey Mac or John Anderson because they showed more of what football should really be about than all of the cunts we have playing for us now could ever muster combined. And they did it without the bullshit chest pumping as posturing that players do these days.David Kelly is one of my top picks too, (although I genuinely couldn't say who was my favourite). Think Terry Mac said he'd chase empty crisp packets all day in training if you try told him to. It was fitting he scored the winner at Grimsby a year or so after the Pompey goal as well. Also fitting he signed off with a hat trick v Leicester. The characters we've had compared to now is depressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howmanheyman 33834 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 I was at a thing at Old Trafford recently and Frank Stapleton did a bit of a talk. I was talking to the guy who was with him (who does match day stuff with him) and he asked me who I supported and who my favourite player ever for us was. He was shocked when I said David Kelly rather than Shearer, Beardsley or Gazza etc. In fact he couldn't even remember Kelly. I coudln't really blame him for that as he wasn't a memorable player to supporters of other teams but personally I value the effort he put in with his much more limited ability (as well as saving us from the third division). I could have just as easily said Davey Mac or John Anderson because they showed more of what football should really be about than all of the cunts we have playing for us now could ever muster combined. And they did it without the bullshit chest pumping as posturing that players do these days.Amazed Stapleton couldn't remember another Rep of Ireland striker to be honest. Is he the MUFC version of CT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17645 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 I was at a thing at Old Trafford recently and Frank Stapleton did a bit of a talk. I was talking to the guy who was with him (who does match day stuff with him) and he asked me who I supported and who my favourite player ever for us was. He was shocked when I said David Kelly rather than Shearer, Beardsley or Gazza etc. In fact he couldn't even remember Kelly. I coudln't really blame him for that as he wasn't a memorable player to supporters of other teams but personally I value the effort he put in with his much more limited ability (as well as saving us from the third division). I could have just as easily said Davey Mac or John Anderson because they showed more of what football should really be about than all of the cunts we have playing for us now could ever muster combined. And they did it without the bullshit chest pumping as posturing that players do these days. Have you read "touching distance"? There's a few chapters that bring a lump to the throat but Ned's almost did me in We were shit, but everyone tried and no one hid. Mark Stimson was fuckin appalling but he never ever stopped wanting the ball and trying something down the left. I felt a bit sorry for him more than once but I've no sympathy whatsoever for any of the present squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Amazed Stapleton couldn't remember another Rep of Ireland striker to be honest. Is he the MUFC version of CT? It wasn't Stapleton who I was speaking to, it was bloke who works for Man Utd who was with him (he was actually a Stockport supporter which was the only reason I bothered to speak to him). He did ask me if I wanted my photo taken with Stapleton but I had no interest in getting a picture with a player who had never played for (even if he was one who quite liked in my early footballing days). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Have you read "touching distance"? There's a few chapters that bring a lump to the throat but Ned's almost did me in We were shit, but everyone tried and no one hid. Mark Stimson was fuckin appalling but he never ever stopped wanting the ball and trying something down the left. I felt a bit sorry for him more than once but I've no sympathy whatsoever for any of the present squad. That's it, they are all fucking hiding now. No one really wants the ball and if they get it they are just looking to offload it as quickly as possible. Bravery in football isn't just about putting your head in where it hurts, it's about risking making a mistake by trying to be positive. The wankers we have just don't want to be seen as the one making a mistake. Not read Touching Distance. Thought it would depress me too much. Might give it a go though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howmanheyman 33834 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Have you read "touching distance"? There's a few chapters that bring a lump to the throat but Ned's almost did me in We were shit, but everyone tried and no one hid. Mark Stimson was fuckin appalling but he never ever stopped wanting the ball and trying something down the left. I felt a bit sorry for him more than once but I've no sympathy whatsoever for any of the present squad. Stimson aka Jason Donovan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howmanheyman 33834 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 That's it, they are all fucking hiding now. No one really wants the ball and if they get it they are just looking to offload it as quickly as possible. Bravery in football isn't just about putting your head in where it hurts, it's about risking making a mistake by trying to be positive. The wankers we have just don't want to be seen as the one making a mistake. Not read Touching Distance. Thought it would depress me too much. Might give it a go though. You must read touching distance, it's so much more than just going for the PL title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 6783 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Bournemouth proved that half the team are heartless. Only Shelvey didn't hide that day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Bournemouth proved that half the team are heartless. Only Shelvey didn't hide that day. He's soon changed his tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Shelvey has pretty much been as I expected so far. I never rated him and other than the West Ham and West Brom games he's been pretty poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17645 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Stimson aka Jason Donovan. That style was quite popular in the early nineties I seem to recall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted April 11, 2016 Author Share Posted April 11, 2016 I'll not be sad to see him leave when we go down. And you can add Sissoko and Janmaat to that too. I'm sick to death of seeing such gutless players play for us. I'm disgusted to think of their attitudes compared to we used to have when I first started going to games. Funny you should pick those 3. Wijnaldum, Sissoko and Janmaat are the only players with over 30 appearances. Undroppable? Must play clauses? Actually better than we all perceive but disappoint us more due to previous standards set? Sissoko cost the same as Des Hamilton. think that should be about the level he aims for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Funny you should pick those 3. Wijnaldum, Sissoko and Janmaat are the only players with over 30 appearances. Undroppable? Must play clauses? Actually better than we all perceive but disappoint us more due to previous standards set? Sissoko cost the same as Des Hamilton. think that should be about the level he aims for. I've only recently felt this way about Gini and Janmaat to be fair and Gini played well earlier in the season. Sissoko has been shite for the last two seasons and you would think there must be a clause in his contract for him to still be getting a game. But I'm assuming it's because the managers have seen what he can do and keep blindly hoping he'll pull it out at some point. Sissoko has contributed roughly the same as disco Des this season like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted April 11, 2016 Author Share Posted April 11, 2016 I'm cautious about hammering them as much as I've seen others do, because they are our most productive trio. Their 12 assists are almost half of the club total. Only 13 from the rest of the squad combined. They've also scored a third of our goals (granted 90% Wijnaldum) and none of them are strikers. Think it's a vicious circle. Their motivation to keep carrying the team has waned given what little contribution was coming from elsewhere. Now they aren't performing either and the January buys aren't filling the void. Don't think anyone in that dressing room is in any position to question their overall contribution unfortunately. Everyone else in the squad has gone awol to a greater degree. Think Benitez has to build on that. They will be pivotal to leading us out of this, if it can happen. He has to knock their heads together along with Mitro, Shelvey, Townsend and Coloccini. Tell them that they are the senior 7 that will be starting all remaining games and they have to pull anyone else that gets on the pitch along with them up to their standard or ask questions of them why they're letting the club down. Encourage, inspire, hammer, comfort and improve the other shite we have playing badly or out of position. 100% from them 7 would see us breeze to safety, whoever was alongside them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12496 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 Undroppable? Must play clauses? Actually better than we all perceive but disappoint us more due to previous standards set? I think that's the main reason they catch so much flak, we know they can do better (especially Sissoko who shows it the least) whereas players like Colback and Anita are simply poor players. Janmaat has really given up quite a bit towards the end of the season with his defensive duties, of course you can cite frustration on his part but he's still bottling his duties at times all the same. We saw so much early on from Wijnaldum so it's extremely frustrating that he does fuck all now, even at home he's anonymous. Players like them stand out most when they are not bothering as we know they can play when they want, others like Colback are incapable of dominating a game even when they try their best so it tends to go a bit more unnoticed when they slack off a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted April 11, 2016 Share Posted April 11, 2016 You can cite them being pissed off with what is going on around them or whatever but the fact is they are bottling it now when they are needed the most. I expect nothing else from Sissoko until he leaves but there is still hope that Janmaat (assuming he can play with his dammaged hand) and Wijnaldum can get their heads into the game and show what good players they are until the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17645 Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 Off to the red half of Merseyside?....hope Klopp can find him away from home because he tends to go MIA.... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2016/07/17/liverpool-chase-newcastle-midfielder-georginio-wijnaldum-as-jurg/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5295 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 20m would be ok... Reckon we should actually get nearer 25 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7169 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 If they got £15mil for Ibe we should be getting a lot more for an international midfielder who scored double figures Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 Hold out for 32m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGingerQuiff 2412 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 No way he should be sold for less than Sissoko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5295 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 I doubt we'll get more than 20 for Sissoko... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7169 Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 Looks like the deal is getting close. I've said it before but I would offer £15mil for Will Hughes to replace him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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