Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) German police are saying the bomber flew into Dusseldorf and Frankfurt over the last month. They won't say how long he was there or just changing planes for Libya...He wasn't stopped because he wasn't on any watch list that they had from the UK. Dusseldorf has had links with extremists in the past and some are being watched in the City. https://www.thelocal.de/20170523/syrian-rebel-leader-faces-war-crimes-trial-in-germany ''German national news agency DPA reported the defendant was known as the "father of the wolf" and had supervised the torture. Victims were suspended from ceilings with chains and beaten with iron rods and cables while being variously accused of being non-believers, regime spies or members of the Kurdish minority. The suspect was arrested after one of his alleged former victims recognised him in the western German city of Münster, DPA reported.'' Edited May 25, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 As of June 2016, the Terrorist Watch List is estimated to contain over 2,484,442 records, consisting of 1,877,133 individual identities. The haystack's ever expanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Happy Face said: As of June 2016, the Terrorist Watch List is estimated to contain over 2,484,442 records, consisting of 1,877,133 individual identities. The haystack's ever expanding. Various estimates range from 800 - 1300 being actively monitored in the UK security services at a cost of 3m or so a day. We have to start thinking about revoking citizenship of males under the age of 55 flying to Syria, Libya, Iraq either directly or via Turkey etc... Illegal tho innit. I think Holland have started doing it but haven't looked into the legal ins and outs. Edited May 25, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4966 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 42 minutes ago, Andrew said: Army bomb disposal have been called to a college in Trafford and the area has been cleared. Suspicious package has been cleared, seems that someone was arrested and everything is back open again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 3 minutes ago, Park Life said: Various estimates range from 800 - 1300 being actively monitored in the UK security services at a cost of 3m or so a day. We have to start thinking about revoking citizenship of males under the age of 55 flying to Syria, Libya, Iraq either directly or via Turkey etc... I know you're a trump supporter, but didn't think you'd back his muslim ban. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22391 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 6 minutes ago, Happy Face said: As of June 2016, the Terrorist Watch List is estimated to contain over 2,484,442 records, consisting of 1,877,133 individual identities. The haystack's ever expanding. What does that allusion even mean? Are you against this surveillance as a breach of privacy rights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, Happy Face said: I know you're a trump supporter, but didn't think you'd back his muslim ban. I would revoke citizenship of Jihadi's in a heartbeat. Their family, friends, pets and local takeaway. Edited May 25, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Park Life said: I would revoke citizenship of Jihadi's in a heartbeat. But that's not what you proposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22391 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, Happy Face said: I know you're a trump supporter, but didn't think you'd back his muslim ban. Am assuming he means those with evidence of being involved in the civil wars. Most people don't want jihadists here, you don't have to be a trump supporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Happy Face said: But that's not what you proposed. I meant Jihadi's if that was unclear. There are 1100 or so roaming our streets right now and are know to the security services as fighters who have had training. Only 40 prosecutions in the last 5 years iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Renton said: What does that allusion even mean? Are you against this surveillance as a breach of privacy rights? There's a balance to be struck between concentrating surveillance for optimum use of resource as opposed to casting the net so wide as to be unmanageable and useless. I'm against blanket surveillance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) Amsterdam – The Dutch senate on Tuesday approved a law that would take away Dutch citizenship of jihadists with a double nationality, amidst fear over the return of jihadist fighters who have joined radical groups such as the Islamic State (ISIS) in Syria and Iraq. The proposal allows the Minister of Security and Justice to revoke the Dutch nationality of citizens without any trial. This includes Dutch fighters that have joined any group listed as a terrorist organization like al-Nusra Front or ISIS.'' http://aranews.net/2017/02/netherlands-revoke-citizenship-jihadists/ https://nsnbc.me/2017/02/08/netherlands-to-revoke-citizenship-of-jihadists-with-dual-citizenship/ Edited May 25, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5567 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Happy Face said: There's a balance to be struck between concentrating surveillance for optimum use of resource as opposed to casting the net so wide as to be unmanageable and useless. I'm against blanket surveillance. Given that Pandora's Box is open on Islamic Extremism (and I agree with you on why we are targetted), it does seem that the solution has to be pragmatic rather than perhaps balanced. While very very few of us ever will be killed by terrorism, it's an absolutely toxic issue in society that hurts everyone, including Muslims. The only 'strategy' I can see for dealing with it is to eliminate Islam through a battle of ideologies. But this involves just enduring the terrorism and hoping we can stop it pre-emptively. Maybe we can infect Islam with identity politics and have them turn on each other (as we have with other groups) but who knows. Either way, just tolerating it certainly won't be popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22391 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, Happy Face said: There's a balance to be struck between concentrating surveillance for optimum use of resource as opposed to casting the net so wide as to be unmanageable and useless. I'm against blanket surveillance. I agree, but I don't think you or I are in the position to know where the optimal balance is. I'll draw attention to your logical fallacy the other day, you implied, intentionally or not, that there was an equivalence with being under some form of surveillance and being blown up by a terrorist bomb. There isn't of course, one is much more catastrophic on a personal level. The consequences of a false negative are much worse the a false positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Rayvin said: Given that Pandora's Box is open on Islamic Extremism (and I agree with you on why we are targetted), it does seem that the solution has to be pragmatic rather than perhaps balanced. While very very few of us ever will be killed by terrorism, it's an absolutely toxic issue in society that hurts everyone, including Muslims. The only 'strategy' I can see for dealing with it is to eliminate Islam through a battle of ideologies. But this involves just enduring the terrorism and hoping we can stop it pre-emptively. Maybe we can infect Islam with identity politics and have them turn on each other (as we have with other groups) but who knows. Either way, just tolerating it certainly won't be popular. Love the way you've managed to shoe horn identity politics into even this.. There is an element of identity politics with reg to how you see yourself however. 49% or summink see themselves as Muslims before and above being Americans. Edited May 25, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 https://www.channel4.com/news/islamic-state-citizenship-extremists-law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15836 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 20 minutes ago, Park Life said: Love the way you've managed to shoe horn identity politics into even this.. I blame the PLP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 22391 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 5 minutes ago, Meenzer said: I blame the PLP. I think you underestimate the narrative role of the MSM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 42 minutes ago, Renton said: I agree, but I don't think you or I are in the position to know where the optimal balance is. I'll draw attention to your logical fallacy the other day, you implied, intentionally or not, that there was an equivalence with being under some form of surveillance and being blown up by a terrorist bomb. There isn't of course, one is much more catastrophic on a personal level. The consequences of a false negative are much worse the a false positive. That wasn't about surveillance, it was a response to internment camps being advocated. They're still not equivalent obviously, and I had no intention of suggesting any equivalence, but it's all about proportional response. I don't believe a proportionate response is to dispense with the just rule of law we have lived by for so long and lock up a percentage of the population without charge because of the fear they might do something. Nor do I believe it's proportionate to put millions on watch lists that restrictthem from flying or ensure that when they do they face as much difficulty as possible and are detained as long as possible. The numbers for that sort of thing should be closer to what Parky mentioned earlier. Those under active suspicion. I don't agree with using attacks as an excuse to gather all the communications of everyone on the planet either. I think security services should concentrate on suspects and require a warrant to collect information on those individuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35910 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Renton said: I think you underestimate the narrative role of the MSM. Inflitrated by SJWs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5567 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 FFS fine, I'll shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 7 minutes ago, Alex said: Inflitrated by SJWs Seduced by LGBT's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5567 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, Park Life said: Seduced by LGBT's. LGBT's aren't one of mine, sorry. There really is plenty for you all to run at without making stuff up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wykikitoon 21456 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15836 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, Rayvin said: LGBT's aren't one of mine, sorry. There really is plenty for you all to run at without making stuff up LGBT's are very much one of Parky's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now