Monkeys Fist 43067 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 shearer would win in a fight Wasn't this as a result of a Shearer free kick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17646 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I can't agree with that. I think his performances were generally above the players around him, he spent a lot of his career with us surrounded by a paucity of top class players and had to try and work with the likes of Silvio Maric. He suffered pretty shocking injuries and still went on to become the League's and Newcastle's top striker. I kind of get where you're coming from, his ego did get in the way at times, but I'd argue that was when the man pulling the strings wasn't up to Shearer's standard. You never heard of him falling out with Sir Bob, because Sir Bobby was getting results. Gullit and his ilk did not. Sir Bob strongly hints in his book that Shearer knocked a nail or two into his SJP coffin, particularly to do with the UEFA cup tie in Valerenga where Shearer travelled but didn't play and went straight to the press whingeing about it, knowing full well how it would undermine his manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Didn't Robson want rid of Shearer as he was ailing, but Shepherd wouldn't hear of it? There's also the story of Robson enquiring with the local press why they went easy on Shearer after poor shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 I didn't remember that at all, I know he's no saint, far from it, but my point was that even when he fell out with managers it wasn't reflected on the pitch. Him being Billy Big Bollocks wasn't to the detriment to the team. His age and knackered body might have been, but not his ego. Him snatching the ball off Paul Robinson on his way to 5 goals against Wednesday didn't detract from the team. I can't accept that Shearer was over-rated. He's idolised by some who can't see his personality and professional shortcomings but on the pitch he was mighty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj 17 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I don't remember him doing it after every goal though? He did aye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17646 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Didn't Robson want rid of Shearer as he was ailing, but Shepherd wouldn't hear of it? There's also the story of Robson enquiring with the local press why they went easy on Shearer after poor shows. True about him wanting rid, Benitez made an offer but it was turned down by Shepherd. Shearer asked Robson why he wasn't told of the offer, was told it was "club business" Don't know about the press thing, but it again sounds a bit like the manager having difficulty with a player that had too much power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Better than Shearer IMO. 1.6 goals per game in his 9 years at Fiorentina. At the time Serie A had some of the best defences in the world.I would completely agree if that were actually true. 1.6 goals a game would be phemnomenal in any league let along a very defensive Itallian. As it was, 0.6 goals a game is also brilliant. I think it could be argued that Shearer was slightly overrated by us because he's a Geordie and (to a much lesser extent) he turned down Manure but he was still the best player I've ever seen play for us and the best striker the premier league has had. Yes after his injuries he lost some of what he had earlier in his career but the fact he managed to adapt his game (admittedly massively with the help of primarily Bellamy but also all the other pace we had in that team) is even greater credit to him. Of course he didn't have Pedro or Gazza's god given magic but he worked really hard at what he did have and you would struggle to find a weakness on any major part of his game (his passing was excellent, his crossing was superb, he was second to none in the air, he could tackle, he was competant with both feet, he was strong as fuck and of course his finishing was sublime). He might have been a selfish bloke at times and I do believe the relationship between him Robson wasn't always what it was made out to be but I don't think that deminishes what a great player he was for us at all. Back the original question, I think Milner is massively overrated. I still think the £12m or so we got for him was fantastic money (obviously the lack of spending it on a replacement cost us). He wasn't (and still isn't) a bad player but all he's ever been is a grafter. He came as a winger and couldn't cross a ball to save his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Agree totally about Milner. How he gets games at Man C is a mystery to me (lot as sub I grant you). #HappyFace to clear up the Batistuta v Shearer stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonasjuice 0 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Milner's one of those funny players who's actual ability and form hasn't really changed that much for the last 6-7 years, but the public perception of it has. Seems he goes from being a 'talentless workhorse' to an 'underrated important cog' and back again quite regularly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonasjuice 0 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 He's a decent all rounder with some limitations who would be useful in any of the top 4 squads but never one of the main men basically. I remember the 2010 World Cup in particular there were a lot of embarrassingly over the top negative reactions to him getting any game time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Agree totally about Milner. How he gets games at Man C is a mystery to me (lot as sub I grant you). #HappyFace to clear up the Batistuta v Shearer stats. I'm relying on the Stats on wiki but according to their figures he only once scored more goals in a season than games he played. And that was in Qatar. I would guess that even Ronaldo and Messi couldn't get close to a run of getting on towards 2 goals per game over 9 seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4857 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Agree totally about Milner. How he gets games at Man C is a mystery to me (lot as sub I grant you). #HappyFace to clear up the Batistuta v Shearer stats. http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/gabriel-batistuta/profil/spieler/5959#subnavi http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/alan-shearer/profil/spieler/3110 Batistuta did not get 1.6 goals a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 (edited) Batistuta had 0.62 goals per game at Fiorentina. Shearer had 0.76 at Blackburn, 0.58 in the premier league as a whole and 0.51 for us. If you took Shearers 9 peak years including injuries (ie his time at Blackburn and his first few seasons for us) he actually averaged 0.64. Both clearly had amazing records. Edited November 18, 2014 by David Kelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4411 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Pav was fucking shite. I don't care what anybody says.Disagree. Perhaps more prone to errors than most but overall decent. One of the best saves I've ever seen against everton as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aimaad22 4222 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Saying Shearer might have had a less than positive impact at the later stage of his career is one thing, but overrated? Hell no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 I think Milner is one of those players that managers love to have. He's happy enough being relied on to come off the bench and play as an attacking fullback, a defensive winger, a wide midfielder, a harrassing defensive midfielder just in front of the back four, an attacking midfielder or a grafting striker. On either wing. He has the technical ability to play any of those roles adequately at a pinch, he's got the athleticism to cover the shortcomings, the footballing intelligence to play the system the manager wants and the attitude to do it without complaint. He'll never be a "top top" player, but I totally understand how he's enjoyed a decent career at Manchester City when other, more lustrous stars have blinked out. Also why he'd never really have shone at clubs with lesser players around him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35573 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Saying Shearer might have had a less than positive impact at the later stage of his career is one thing, but overrated? Hell no. He became about 75% of the player he was in the space of one bad injury (i.e. the pre-season one at Everton). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1260 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I think Milner is one of those players that managers love to have. He's happy enough being relied on to come off the bench and play as an attacking fullback, a defensive winger, a wide midfielder, a harrassing defensive midfielder just in front of the back four, an attacking midfielder or a grafting striker. On either wing. He has the technical ability to play any of those roles adequately at a pinch, he's got the athleticism to cover the shortcomings, the footballing intelligence to play the system the manager wants and the attitude to do it without complaint. He'll never be a "top top" player, but I totally understand how he's enjoyed a decent career at Manchester City when other, more lustrous stars have blinked out. Also why he'd never really have shone at clubs with lesser players around him I suppose there are similar players who have enjoyed good careers at big clubs while not playing in a lot of the games but then struggling at smaller clubs. The most obvious recent example is Park. He regularly played in the big games for Ferguson and never let him down but then he was shite when he went to QPR in search of more regular football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj 17 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Park was a class little player when he was an attacking winger at PSV as well. Ferguson is a master at getting people to sacrifice their own flair for the good of the team. Rooney is a prime example of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Park was a class little player when he was an attacking winger at PSV as well. Ferguson is a master at getting people to sacrifice their own flair for the good of the team. Rooney is a prime example of that. You must have seen the debate about Rooney lately. Well, one of the questions on twitter and the like was "Would Rooney get in your all time England 11?" Even though his style of play; the "false nine" didn't really get recognised until recently so he'd be competing with strikers like Shearer, Lineker, Greaves etc. Stupid fucking questions like that aside, why do you think Rooney divides opinion so much? So many don't rate him and point to his performances, especially in finals. Those that do rate him point to the shit around him and the style of play etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35573 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Hidegkuti played as a false number 9 in 1953 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10963 Posted November 18, 2014 Author Share Posted November 18, 2014 Hidegkuti played as a false number 9 in 1953 "Widely". I should have said "widely recognised". It's my own fault. I forgot about the pendants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3965 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 "Widely". I should have said "widely recognised". It's my own fault. I forgot about the pendants. The stupid ingots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj 17 Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 You must have seen the debate about Rooney lately. Well, one of the questions on twitter and the like was "Would Rooney get in your all time England 11?" Even though his style of play; the "false nine" didn't really get recognised until recently so he'd be competing with strikers like Shearer, Lineker, Greaves etc. Stupid fucking questions like that aside, why do you think Rooney divides opinion so much? So many don't rate him and point to his performances, especially in finals. Those that do rate him point to the shit around him and the style of play etc. Read this a few years ago from an Everton fan which was a pretty decent summary. http://www.redcafe.net/threads/our-wayne-is-better-than-yours-everton-viewpoint.197166/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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