Tooj 17 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I think Dejong would be the prong of that midfield 3 and I think he could utilise Goufran in the way he got some success with Jonas. Even though you won't agree due to your opinion on Jonas but he's a much more rounded player than Gouffran and far more comfortable in possession. Gouffran in that role would be truly awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 De Jong doesn't play in central midfield. Or Gouffran. :lol: He did last year mind but I wouldn't have him there myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 We're going to be awful. We needed two things this summer. A like-for-like Cabaye replacement and a goalscorer to replace Remy. All we've done is sign some players that we think we can make a profit on that we're going to have to fit into the team somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4702 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 You've got a championship rightback/right mid at left back, a striker and a number 10 as centre mid, and a centre mid as a right attacker. I can only assume you're on the wind up with that team CT. Hold on though. Ryan Taylor played well in that position at the start of the season we finished 5th, his set pieces would be useful, Santon is out and dummet / haidara are make do as well. As for De Jong, this is what I've read about him.... " Under manager Frank de Boer, however, Ajax’s first team has long stopped using a classic No. 10. These days, Ajax’s philosophy has evolved into a 4-3-3 formation with one defensive midfielder, and two central midfielders. Normally, then, De Jong would function as one of the two central midfielders. This meant that he was expected to move up and down the pitch a lot. Not quite a box-to-box player, but not really a classic No. 10 either, awareness and intelligent positioning was required of De Jong. Under manager Frank de Boer, however, Ajax’s first team has long stopped using a classic No. 10. These days, Ajax’s philosophy has evolved into a 4-3-3 formation with one defensive midfielder, and two central midfielders. Normally, then, De Jong would function as one of the two central midfielders. This meant that he was expected to move up and down the pitch a lot. Not quite a box-to-box player, but not really a classic No. 10 either, awareness and intelligent positioning was required of De Jong. So wrong possibly, but wind up no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4702 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Even though you won't agree due to your opinion on Jonas but he's a much more rounded player than Gouffran and far more comfortable in possession. Gouffran in that role would be truly awful. He may be and may well use Colback instead, but we know Pardew loves his work rate. Just my guess anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1224 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Hold on though. Ryan Taylor played well in that position at the start of the season we finished 5th, his set pieces would be useful, Santon is out and dummet / haidara are make do as well. As for De Jong, this is what I've read about him.... " Under manager Frank de Boer, however, Ajax’s first team has long stopped using a classic No. 10. These days, Ajax’s philosophy has evolved into a 4-3-3 formation with one defensive midfielder, and two central midfielders. Normally, then, De Jong would function as one of the two central midfielders. This meant that he was expected to move up and down the pitch a lot. Not quite a box-to-box player, but not really a classic No. 10 either, awareness and intelligent positioning was required of De Jong. Under manager Frank de Boer, however, Ajax’s first team has long stopped using a classic No. 10. These days, Ajax’s philosophy has evolved into a 4-3-3 formation with one defensive midfielder, and two central midfielders. Normally, then, De Jong would function as one of the two central midfielders. This meant that he was expected to move up and down the pitch a lot. Not quite a box-to-box player, but not really a classic No. 10 either, awareness and intelligent positioning was required of De Jong. So wrong possibly, but wind up no. Raylor couldn't get a game on a regular basis for us in the championship. He covered leftback at the start of the season you're talking about and did ok for a while with Jonas helping him out a lot. Once he started to think he could actually do anything other than hold his position and defend he got crucified (the chelsea game being a perfect example). His set pieces are also generally much poorer than is remembered. People think of his goal against the tramps or the ones he scored against us for Wigan but the majority were actually pretty poor. He's (or at least he was, who knows what standard he will return at) a decent squad player but nothing more. Theres no way I'd think about starting him ahead of Santon or Haidara (who I think has the potential to be our best leftback by some distance). Dummet, well he's not even championship standard to yes I'd play Raylor ahead of him. With regards to SDJ, I'd never read that before, what I've read and seen of him suggests someone who plays off the striker but I haven't seen much of him so I'll not argue too much with you there. Gouffran's a striker who we've used as a wide attacker. Yes he works hard but that hardly makes him a central midfielder. Graft would be the only thing he has in his locker that you would want from a centre mid. I'm sorry but suggesting him in the centre of the park is either a wind up or lunacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1224 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 We're going to be awful. We needed two things this summer. A like-for-like Cabaye replacement and a goalscorer to replace Remy. All we've done is sign some players that we think we can make a profit on that we're going to have to fit into the team somehow.To my mind, we've decided to replace Cabaye with Cabella and SDJ rather than like for like. I would have liked to see Grenier come in and provide a player a bit deeper who can do more with the ball. But I don't think it's a massive problem the way we've gone instead. I'm happy we've brought quality in who can score and create goals. We've so far failled to replace Remy though which is a big worry. I don't think Ashley gives a fuck about moving the club forward mind you, but a goal scorer will keep us up and with the other players we've signed, possibly allow us to have a good season. It's a massive risk gambling on Riviere (a player who has no massive scoring pedigree) and Cisse (a player who's touch in front of goal has deserted him so badly it appeared there was a very strong possibility we would have sold him had he not got injured) along with three young uns to score enough goals for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 To my mind, we've decided to replace Cabaye with Cabella and SDJ rather than like for like. I would have liked to see Grenier come in and provide a player a bit deeper who can do more with the ball. But I don't think it's a massive problem the way we've gone instead. I'm happy we've brought quality in who can score and create goals. We've so far failled to replace Remy though which is a big worry. I don't think Ashley gives a fuck about moving the club forward mind you, but a goal scorer will keep us up and with the other players we've signed, possibly allow us to have a good season. It's a massive risk gambling on Riviere (a player who has no massive scoring pedigree) and Cisse (a player who's touch in front of goal has deserted him so badly it appeared there was a very strong possibility we would have sold him had he not got injured) along with three young uns to score enough goals for us. I don't think that was a footballing decision though. If he plays a combination of either Anita, Colback and Tiote in the centre of the park, and i've a feeling he will, then we're going to get outclassed by a lot of teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Eh? All three are solid players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) Eh? All three are solid players. They'll all put a shift in but what do they bring in terms of quality? I can't really name an outstanding technical attribute any of them have. No set piece ability, no long range passing ability. Just tippy tappy short pass grafters. Apart from Tiote who I'm perhaps being harsh on, given the job he does defensively when on form. Edited July 25, 2014 by ClubSpinDoctor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I think you're being incredibly harsh on Anita, who is a very versatile and capable player - particularly with his passing. Again 'grafters' is being used as a negative which is frankly bizarre. Colback's corners already look better than Cabaye's - which were awful. If they're winning possession, maintaining & recycling it I'm not sure what much more you want. All three will chip in with a goal and assist now and then. Can you suggest a 'better' replacement for any of them or are you just twisting bcuz evrythns bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) I think you're being incredibly harsh on Anita, who is a very versatile and capable player - particularly with his passing. Again 'grafters' is being used as a negative which is frankly bizarre. Colback's corners already look better than Cabaye's - which were awful. If they're winning possession, maintaining & recycling it I'm not sure what much more you want. All three will chip in with a goal and assist now and then. Can you suggest a 'better' replacement for any of them or are you just twisting bcuz evrythns bad? I think Anita is one of the biggest wastes of money on our books, I'd prefer Colback to start over him. What more do I want from a central midfielder? One with the vision and ability to be able to thread an unpredictable delicately weighted pass through to a striker. One that can spray a ball over to a man in space at the other side of the pitch. One that can hit an effort on target from range and actually score or trouble the goalkeeper. You know, some qualities that might separate them from being able to do the same stuff that the opposition midfielders can do equally well. Win possession, maintain and recycle. What incredibly low expectations. Edited July 25, 2014 by ClubSpinDoctor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Colback didn't have much bother ''hitting one from range'' against us did he? As I've said all three can get goals and assists if need be - so I wouldn't call my expectations low at all. 'Win possession, maintain and recycle.'That's generally their job on the pitch - especially if two are deployed as DM's and one player centrally higher up. (who you'd expect more of) This is in a 433 by the way. If you don't rate Anita...then...ah forget it man. That's just farcical. He's one of the best passers on our books and a fine footballer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 6993 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Fuck me you're boring. De Jong and Cabella are 2 of the most exiting players we've signed in years. Krul Janmaat Colo Willo Santon Tiote Sissoko Cabella. De Jong. Gouffran Rivière/Cisse Much better than the team we had for the last 6 months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) Colback didn't have much bother ''hitting one from range'' against us did he? As I've said all three can get goals and assists if need be - so I wouldn't call my expectations low at all. 'Win possession, maintain and recycle.'That's generally their job on the pitch - especially if two are deployed as DM's and one player centrally higher up. (who you'd expect more of) This is in a 433 by the way. If you don't rate Anita...then...ah forget it man. That's just farcical. He's one of the best passers on our books and a fine footballer. He doesn't exactly have a range on him does he. I'm not saying they're all terrible players. I'm saying that there isn't a lot of technical ability in, and we'd be in danger of being outclassed by teams. You only have to look at what happened when Cabaye left as proof of what taking that quality out of our central midfield did to us. We've brought in quality further up the pitch but we're still lacking it in the engine room. Anita hardly grabbed his opportunity with both hands and made the position his in the second half on the season, did he? Edited July 25, 2014 by ClubSpinDoctor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Fuck me you're boring. De Jong and Cabella are 2 of the most exiting players we've signed in years. Krul Janmaat Colo Willo Santon Tiote Sissoko Cabella. De Jong. Gouffran Rivière/Cisse Much better than the team we had for the last 6 months I don't disagree, they are exciting players. But we needed other positions filling more urgently. We've signed a HBA replacement, but not a Remy/Cabaye replacement! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Of course he has a range - and an accurate one too. Which position didn't he make his own by the way? He was deployed in 5 different ones & he was seldom found wanting. The entire team went to shit without Cabaye - but who was saying he's a replacement for Cabaye? They're completely different players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4702 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 People keep putting Santon in teams. Isn't he out til November? Also with regard to De Jong. I'm imagining him being like a better version of Nolan when he attacked a lot during the Championship. Is that close? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 There's no return date for Santon - it's only down as a 'knee' injury which he had problems with before. I wouldn't say that De Jong is like Nolan at all tbh - he's a much, much better footballer (as vague as that sounds he wont be a passenger) Have a youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 6993 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) Why do we need to buy like for like? That's not how football works. You don't just go and buy the nearest copy of Cabaye we can find and alls well again. New players = new formations and new tactics Edited July 25, 2014 by TheRollingStones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 That's it like - I'd say we're a bit more flexible if anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12496 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 I reckon Cabella and De Jong will chip in more goals then our midfield last season (Cabella scored a decent amount in a poor montpellier team didn't he?), my fear is they seem to be hoping Riviere can carry us through until Cisse recovers. I think Cisse will probably look better as he'll have a greater variety of service than he had last year, but he's out for a while. My main worry is the centre backs, Colo looked tired at times last year and I can't see him playing week in week out which leaves us down to Willo and Taylor. Both can be decent (especially Willo) when alongside a decent CB but together is worrying. Of course they could move Janmaat inside but we're not exactly flush with full backs and I'd rather not see Dummett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Hog 508 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 People keep putting Santon in teams. Isn't he out til November? You're thinking of Wycliffe Jean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Of course he has a range - and an accurate one too. Which position didn't he make his own by the way? He was deployed in 5 different ones & he was seldom found wanting. The entire team went to shit without Cabaye - but who was saying he's a replacement for Cabaye? They're completely different players. I thought they were both central midfield players. Cabaye left, we had a central midfield player that could have stepped up to the plate. For whatever reason, we went to shit without him. The lads we've signed are "completely different players" too. Meaning we haven't replaced what we were lacking when he left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClubSpinDoctor 0 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Why do we need to buy like for like? That's not how football works. You don't just go and buy the nearest copy of Cabaye we can find and alls well again. New players = new formations and new tactics Ah right. Like when we had 3 left backs playing. I understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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