Scots Money

[Meenzer 15526]

Yeah, the battle for the Yes campaign will be to embed intangible concepts like "hope" to a sufficient extent to outweigh the doubts in floating voters' minds. It's not impossible but it's a hell of a challenge. A late surge towards "Yes" in the polls is probably more conducive to that kind of instinctive "ah, fuck it" response than months or years of 50-50 polls, though, so you never know.

[Christmas Tree 4725]

Quite frightening that Scotland could sleepwalk into independence on the back of promises made by Sturgeon and Salmond.

[Meenzer 15526]

That's not frightening. This is frightening:

 

 

[topcat 0]

Quite frightening that Scotland could sleepwalk into independence on the back of promises made by Sturgeon and Salmond.

 

Sleepwalking my arse - those voting Yes have been given a comprehensive white paper and some positive politics over the past year - backed up with the simple fact that the SNP have marshalled the country quite well since 2007.

 

This against the Better Together campaign which has delivered no manifesto and has been one of the most patronising, negative and degrading campaigns in the history of world politics.

 

Easy choice really for those with a bit of intelligence but the BT camp have settled for the constant drip feed of bullshit trying to scare the bejesus out of vulnerable groups (young & elderly) to secure a marginal victory. In other strands of society such practices would be called grooming but I suppose we're all in it together eh?. Regrettably the tactics may prove fruitful next week.

[ewerk 30610]

Currency and central bank. You have neither. Unfortunately they're prerequisites for any form of civilised society.

[topcat 0]

Keep talking bud - sounds like they have convinced you - and there was me thinking you were one of the sharper tacks on the board.

 

You're factually incorrect statements have been answered ad nauseam:

1. international tradeable currency so theres eff alll BoE can do to stop us using sterling

2. we'll take on a share of the debt for a share of the assets - which will give us lender of last resort (unless your lot throw the dummy out the pram)

3. deals will be done in 18 months after the vote - first phone calls on 19th will be from Osbourne/Carney to get it sorted sharpish - I'm sure they have a Plan B too ( no, really they do don't they?)

 

I'm sure as part of a civilised society your imperial masters will not want to destabilise your own currency and fuk everyone up down south - or maybe that's part of their Plan B too

[Renton 21624]

Keep talking bud - sounds like they have convinced you - and there was me thinking you were one of the sharper tacks on the board.

 

You're factually incorrect statements have been answered ad nauseam:

1. international tradeable currency so theres eff alll BoE can do to stop us using sterling

2. we'll take on a share of the debt for a share of the assets - which will give us lender of last resort (unless your lot throw the dummy out the pram)

3. deals will be done in 18 months after the vote - first phone calls on 19th will be from Osbourne/Carney to get it sorted sharpish - I'm sure they have a Plan B too ( no, really they do don't they?)

 

I'm sure as part of a civilised society your imperial masters will not want to destabilise your own currency and fuk everyone up down south - or maybe that's part of their Plan B too

Explain point 2 a bit more please. If BoE is lender of last resort, doesn't that mean the remaining UK will control your economy through interest rates etc that suit us, and you will have fuck all say on it? Is this independence?

 

I've never seen the currency argument properly answered by yes. There's no plan A yet alone a plan B. If I were Scottish, I'd definitely go no, based on the arguments I've heard, and look forward to improved devolution, which is a major achievement. I think that's what will happen anyway, so well done. In the North East, we really need more decentralized power, but that's a different story.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3894]

Explain point 2 a bit more please. If BoE is lender of last resort, doesn't that mean the remaining UK will control your economy through interest rates etc that suit us, and you will have fuck all say on it? Is this independence?

 

I've never seen the currency argument properly answered by yes. There's no plan A yet alone a plan B. If I were Scottish, I'd definitely go no, based on the arguments I've heard, and look forward to improved devolution, which is a major achievement. I think that's what will happen anyway, so well done. In the North East, we really need more decentralized power, but that's a different story.

Quick question who controls the bank of England?

[Christmas Tree 4725]

 

Sleepwalking my arse - those voting Yes have been given a comprehensive white paper and some positive politics over the past year - backed up with the simple fact that the SNP have marshalled the country quite well since 2007.

 

This against the Better Together campaign which has delivered no manifesto and has been one of the most patronising, negative and degrading campaigns in the history of world politics.

 

Easy choice really for those with a bit of intelligence but the BT camp have settled for the constant drip feed of bullshit trying to scare the bejesus out of vulnerable groups (young & elderly) to secure a marginal victory. In other strands of society such practices would be called grooming but I suppose we're all in it together eh?. Regrettably the tactics may prove fruitful next week.

Seems to me that they're promising more money for everything and everyone based on oil prices that don't exist.

[ewerk 30610]

Keep talking bud - sounds like they have convinced you - and there was me thinking you were one of the sharper tacks on the board.

 

You're factually incorrect statements have been answered ad nauseam:

1. international tradeable currency so theres eff alll BoE can do to stop us using sterling

2. we'll take on a share of the debt for a share of the assets - which will give us lender of last resort (unless your lot throw the dummy out the pram)

3. deals will be done in 18 months after the vote - first phone calls on 19th will be from Osbourne/Carney to get it sorted sharpish - I'm sure they have a Plan B too ( no, really they do don't they?)

 

I'm sure as part of a civilised society your imperial masters will not want to destabilise your own currency and fuk everyone up down south - or maybe that's part of their Plan B too

 

Honestly, the entire plan for your independent nation is based on the hope that the a Tory UK government will do a massive U turn? That really is pure folly.

 

And the idea that the the Bank of England will guarantee the banks of a foreign nation is laughable, particularly when a yes vote will immediately see Scottish banks emptied of every single pound put there by foreigners.

 

I think that you're very much inflating your nation's negotiating position with anyone.

 

My question would be, what happens if the UK government and BoE do end up telling you to do one? What is the roadmap for an independent Scotland in that situation?

[Park Life 71]

The currency issue is going to swing it in the end. The Scots are the last people on earth who are going to put their money in danger.

[ChezGiven 0]

I think it's a good thing and would be quite happy to see an 'aye' vote (as an aside, doesn't every Scotsman hate the concept of a 'yes' campaign give how it's the definitive difference in our linguistic style?).

 

That said, think the key issue for me is the inability to devalue the currency. Independence means control but without monetary control what exactly is the win here? Seems to me it wil be worse not being politically connected to the body deciding on your monetary future and less independent, more like a child being told what to do. No?

[ewerk 30610]

Not just monetary control but any currency union would most likely involve restrictions on fiscal policy.

[ChezGiven 0]

I was thinking about that but how? They are free to set their own tax rate unless the currency union becomes bound by some specific agreement. In the absence of a specific ruling, Scotland could set their fiscal policy in divergence with the imposes monetary policy. It's another economic risk for them but they could do it.

[ewerk 30610]

Oh aye, the point I was trying to make was that the BoE and UK government would never agree to a formal currency agreement without pre-agreed fiscal restrictions on an 'independent' Scotland in order to avoid them stealing our currency and then slashing corporation tax to attract inward investment that could otherwise come to the UK.

[Park Life 71]

Oh aye, the point I was trying to make was that the BoE and UK government would never agree to a formal currency agreement without pre-agreed fiscal restrictions on an 'independent' Scotland in order to avoid them stealing our currency and then slashing corporation tax to attract inward investment that could otherwise come to the UK.

They'd get up to all sorts of mischief....

[topcat 0]

Quick question who controls the bank of England?

 

not sure who owns it now - but it was set up originally by a Scot

[Park Life 71]

 

not sure who owns it now - but it was set up originally by a Scot

This whole thing is shrouded in mystery ain't it....

[topcat 0]

Oh aye, the point I was trying to make was that the BoE and UK government would never agree to a formal currency agreement without pre-agreed fiscal restrictions on an 'independent' Scotland in order to avoid them stealing our currency and then slashing corporation tax to attract inward investment that could otherwise come to the UK.

 

there's deals to be done all right if it is a Yes and anyone who reckons these deals won't be done quickly is fairly deluded ... if they don't then the market instability will create absolute havoc down south - it won't just be cash moving out of Scotland -they'll be shipping it out of the rest of the UK too sharpish

 

the markets dipping the other day wasn't in reaction to the Yes side creeping ahead in one poll - it was a reaction to the Westminster government who have sat on their hands for months thinking No was a done deal getting caught on the hop without a Plan B

 

Latest (and probably most accurate poll given what's happening on the ground up here) was in the Guardian today 42% No 40% Yes remainder undecided

[Park Life 71]

 

there's deals to be done all right if it is a Yes and anyone who reckons these deals won't be done quickly is fairly deluded ... if they don't then the market instability will create absolute havoc down south - it won't just be cash moving out of Scotland -they'll be shipping it out of the rest of the UK too sharpish

 

the markets dipping the other day wasn't in reaction to the Yes side creeping ahead in one poll - it was a reaction to the Westminster government who have sat on their hands for months thinking No was a done deal getting caught on the hop without a Plan B

 

Latest (and probably most accurate poll given what's happening on the ground up here) was in the Guardian today 42% No 40% Yes remainder undecided

The pound is a counter trade for the euro. More euros go through London than any other city. Instability would be short term and much more catastrophic for Scotland with regard to capital flight.

[topcat 0]

ICM poll in the Sunday Telegraph tomorrow puts Yes at 54%

 

... not convinced in those stats unless they've polled a bunch of the undecideds on the turn

[ewerk 30610]

 

there's deals to be done all right if it is a Yes and anyone who reckons these deals won't be done quickly is fairly deluded ... if they don't then the market instability will create absolute havoc down south - it won't just be cash moving out of Scotland -they'll be shipping it out of the rest of the UK too sharpish

 

the markets dipping the other day wasn't in reaction to the Yes side creeping ahead in one poll - it was a reaction to the Westminster government who have sat on their hands for months thinking No was a done deal getting caught on the hop without a Plan B

 

Latest (and probably most accurate poll given what's happening on the ground up here) was in the Guardian today 42% No 40% Yes remainder undecided

You ignored my question from 9.31 this morning.

[ewerk 30610]

The pound is a counter trade for the euro. More euros go through London than any other city. Instability would be short term and much more catastrophic for Scotland with regard to capital flight.

You're on fire with rational arguments recently. The medication must be working.

[Park Life 71]

You're on fire with rational arguments recently. The medication must be working.

The Spice must flow.

[topcat 0]

You ignored my question from 9.31 this morning.

Apologies sir I didn't ignore you - last I looked you were taking exception to a topical joke made on another thread - honestly hadn't noticed your question - then I was out in the sunshine to see the Jags demolish the ICT (pity NUFC couldn't make it a double)

 

It's been made clear that our continued use of sterling would be a transitional arrangement until either a Scottish currency was set up (we already print and distribute money) or the less preferred option of the Euro, How long this transitional arrangement would last is anyones guess but could well be up to 10 years.

 

In the interim Salmond has offered to take on up to 10% of the debt of the UK (around £130bn) but only in trade for a likewise share of the assets - taking on the debt gives access during transition to the BofE as lender of last resort. But whilst Carney said initially it was possible his paymaster Osbourne said no - meaning denying us lender of last resort, keeping all of the debt for yourselves and turning us at a stroke into bad debtors allegedly (quite childish but that's the whole tenet of the No campaign regrettably).

 

As I said this is all up for grabs in the days and weeks beyond the 19th - Salmond has plenty to bargain with too not least of which is Trident which could end up costing you £100bn+ for the new system plus up to £40bn to relocate (if it's relocated at all)