Only in America

[ewerk 31195]

He had 23 weapons in his hotel room, a further 19 at his home plus thousands of rounds of ammo. How could gun control not have helped stop this? Surely a register of firearms would have at least red flagged this man as a dangerous individual? Even a ban on assault weapons would've greatly reduced the numbers of dead and injured.

[The Fish 10963]

2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

He had 23 weapons in his hotel room, a further 19 at his home plus thousands of rounds of ammo. How could gun control not have helped stop this? Surely a register of firearms would have at least red flagged this man as a dangerous individual? Even a ban on assault weapons would've greatly reduced the numbers of dead and injured.

 

Yeah, even if "responsible gun owners" who, for whatever reason, want a rifle and thousands of rounds of ammo were concerned about the faff of some checks, and being on a government list, isn't that a small price to pay if it stops 59 people dying and 500 hundred people getting injured?

[ewerk 31195]

There is literally no number of deaths that would convince the NRA and its sort to support any form of gun control. Even the 'if everyone else was armed they would've stopped this' argument doesn't work this time. There is no talking to these people. Republicans will never do anything about it because an awful lot of them need NRA money and votes to get elected. Sadly the gun control movement is nowhere near as passionate or organised to counter this and never will be.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

You need your gun for protection? Is that while they're called assault rifles? I've never heard of these protection rifles you speak of. (HT Jim Jefferies).

 

Which state do you live in @Howay?

 

I had the chance to work in California last year, which fell down due to salary negotiations, though my Mrs was never 100% on board, mainly because of the gun laws. She only feels more vindicated after the Vegas tragedy. 

 

The US is an amazing place but their gun laws are completely bonkers. It's the main thing that puts me off going there. That plus the all the evangelical christian and pro life nutters. 

[The Fish 10963]

2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

There is literally no number of deaths that would convince the NRA and its sort to support any form of gun control. Even the 'if everyone else was armed they would've stopped this' argument doesn't work this time. There is no talking to these people. Republicans will never do anything about it because an awful lot of them need NRA money and votes to get elected. Sadly the gun control movement is nowhere near as passionate or organised to counter this and never will be.

 

There must be a way to frame the argument that would get through to the voters, if not the lobbyists? Surely?

 

It's so self-evident that some form of gun control would reduce the frequency of mass shootings in the U.S.. I mean, you can legally buy a minigun as long as it was made before 1996. How can that be justified at all? You can buy a flamethrower, what kind of monsters are you defending yourself against that requires a fucking flamethrower? 

 

 

[Renton 21985]

10 minutes ago, The Fish said:

 

There must be a way to frame the argument that would get through to the voters, if not the lobbyists? Surely?

 

It's so self-evident that some form of gun control would reduce the frequency of mass shootings in the U.S.. I mean, you can legally buy a minigun as long as it was made before 1996. How can that be justified at all? You can buy a flamethrower, what kind of monsters are you defending yourself against that requires a fucking flamethrower? 

 

 

Flame throwers are canny necessary if you get attacked by zombies tbf. 

[ewerk 31195]

15 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

I had the chance to work in California last year, which fell down due to salary negotiations, though my Mrs was never 100% on board, mainly because of the gun laws. She only feels more vindicated after the Vegas tragedy. 

 

The US is an amazing place but their gun laws are completely bonkers. It's the main thing that puts me off going there. That plus the all the evangelical christian and pro life nutters. 

 

TBF your chance of being a victim of gun violence is still fairly low and shouldn't be anything to put your missus off moving there.

[Renton 21985]

Fascinating mentality in the US like. On the one hand there's their waynsane gun laws and constant exposure to violence in the media. On the other hand, there's the contradiction of them being religious fanatics and puritanical about sex and nudity. 

 

I can't get my head how many, maybe even most, of the UK identifies more with these fucknuts than with Europeans. 

[ewerk 31195]

14 minutes ago, The Fish said:

 

There must be a way to frame the argument that would get through to the voters, if not the lobbyists? Surely?

 

It's so self-evident that some form of gun control would reduce the frequency of mass shootings in the U.S.. I mean, you can legally buy a minigun as long as it was made before 1996. How can that be justified at all? You can buy a flamethrower, what kind of monsters are you defending yourself against that requires a fucking flamethrower? 

 

 

 

If twenty children being massacred isn't enough to change people's minds then I'm afraid that nothing will do.

[Meenzer 15716]

3 minutes ago, Renton said:

I can't get my head how many, maybe even most, of the UK identifies more with these fucknuts than with Europeans. 

 

They don't come over here and talk forrun on our buses.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

 

TBF your chance of being a victim of gun violence is still fairly low and shouldn't be anything to put your missus off moving there.

 

That's how I see it. It's like the terrorist threat here. With gun crime over there it's generally black on black drug/gang shootings.

 

I'm sure we would have been fine in our middle class bubble but the gun laws and the broad, cultural  acceptance that guns are ok is unsettling, particularly with a gun lobby bitch in the White House.

[Renton 21985]

3 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

TBF your chance of being a victim of gun violence is still fairly low and shouldn't be anything to put your missus off moving there.

That's nonsense though. Alright, the incidence of gun related death may be relatively low compared with other causes of death, but the fear of gun crime is bound to affect you social interactions and ultimately quality of life. 

[ewerk 31195]

If you're an idiot, then yes, I can see how it would.

[Dr Gloom 22147]

2 minutes ago, Meenzer said:

 

They don't come over here and talk forrun on our buses.

 

They do take to London buses wearing shorts with knee high white socks and fanny packs though 

[Rayvin 5296]

Do you think, if they got a truly radical liberal in, that this person could offer a referendum on it? Would lobbying stand up in the face of a 70% no vote?

 

Obviously I know that the majority of Americans might actually want guns, and that any referendum is likely to be entirely counter-productive, and ultimately end up tearing the country apart, but it still might at least put the issue to bed. If the majority came out in favour of them, then that is just the reality of their country. No point blaming the NRA, politicians, etc. It's squarely on the shoulders of the American people.

[Meenzer 15716]

3 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

They do take to London buses wearing shorts with knee high white socks and fanny packs though 

 

Now that's what I call white terrorism.

[ohhh_yeah 2991]

2 hours ago, ewerk said:

 

Quite pally is one way of putting it. To be more exact they donated $30m to Trump’s campaign. It’s a ridiculous amount of money to give and even more ridiculous for Trump to have accepted. The result being that he is in their pocket and has been doing things like overturning an Obama rule restricting gun access to the mentally unwell. 

 

There is a vote next week to legalize gun silencers. It is beyond idiotic!

 

[Renton 21985]

4 minutes ago, ewerk said:

If you're an idiot, then yes, I can see how it would.

Really? Okay then, if it's not an important issue then I don't see what your issue is on this thread. 

[ewerk 31195]

Just now, ohhh_yeah said:

 

There is a vote next week to legalize gun silencers. It is beyond idiotic!

 

 

It'll never make it through both the House and the Senate.

 

Though I wonder what possible justification there could be for the law.

[ewerk 31195]

1 minute ago, Renton said:

Really? Okay then, if it's not an important issue then I don't see what your issue is on this thread. 

 

500 innocent people being shot is an issue and one which legislation can reduce the chance of happening again.

 

Letting it affect your day to day life is ridiculous as the odds of it happening to you are minute.

 

I'm in no way worried about being a victim of a terror attack, it doesn't mean that I don't want the government and the police to stop them from happening.

[ohhh_yeah 2991]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

 

It'll never make it through both the House and the Senate.

 

 

Hope you are correct. Rumored that brown envelopes have been handed out like portions in a cafeteria.

 

[ewerk 31195]

8 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

Do you think, if they got a truly radical liberal in, that this person could offer a referendum on it? Would lobbying stand up in the face of a 70% no vote?

 

Obviously I know that the majority of Americans might actually want guns, and that any referendum is likely to be entirely counter-productive, and ultimately end up tearing the country apart, but it still might at least put the issue to bed. If the majority came out in favour of them, then that is just the reality of their country. No point blaming the NRA, politicians, etc. It's squarely on the shoulders of the American people.

 

It would take more than a referendum. For proper gun control you would need an amendment to the constitution and that isn't easy with any issue. It's impossible when it comes to guns.

Edited October 3, 2017 by ewerk

[ewerk 31195]

2 minutes ago, ohhh_yeah said:

 

Hope you are correct. Rumored that brown envelopes have been handed out like portions in a cafeteria.

 

 

It might get through the House but not the Senate. I see that they've delayed the vote on the bill, can't be seen to loosening gun control after what happened. It'll be okay in a month though.

[Renton 21985]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

 

500 innocent people being shot is an issue and one which legislation can reduce the chance of happening again.

 

Letting it affect your day to day life is ridiculous as the odds of it happening to you are minute.

 

I'm in no way worried about being a victim of a terror attack, it doesn't mean that I don't want the government and the police to stop them from happening.

There are about 15,000 people killed a year by firearms in the US, including hundreds of children and thousands of teenagers. Hardly comparable to our terrorism threat.

 

If you think it's entirely normal for your kids to have to go to a school through a metal detector, and that will have no impact on your psyche, fair enough. It's a bit much calling people who disagree idiots though. 

[ewerk 31195]

6 minutes ago, Renton said:

There are about 15,000 people killed a year by firearms in the US, including hundreds of children and thousands of teenagers. Hardly comparable to our terrorism threat.

 

If you think it's entirely normal for your kids to have to go to a school through a metal detector, and that will have no impact on your psyche, fair enough. It's a bit much calling people who disagree idiots though. 

 

Not every school has metal detectors, you big fanny.

 

Gun deaths are high in the US, that's no shock. But your chances of being a victim are greatly affected by your race, gender and socio-economic status. As a middle-class white male you're probably in one of the lowest risk categories. Your point was that it would affect your day to day life and that isn't the case.