Politics

[The Fish 10814]

4 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

There is no chance they're going to call a General Election - maybe if the polls were tighter they would consider it but as things stand it would be suicide.

 

Unfortunately the only question we have ahead of us is whether it's Boris Johnson or Rishi Sunak, I fear. Not even sure which way I would want that to go, frankly.

 

Also seems clear that they're intending to do whatever comes next without any sort of voting.

Is there any mechanism to call a GE when you're not the party in power?

[Craig 6682]

1 minute ago, The Fish said:

Is there any mechanism to call a GE when you're not the party in power?

 

Calling a no-confidence motion in the government. But I think the only person able to call this is the leader of the opposition.

[Rayvin 5189]

1 minute ago, trooper said:

So do they keep going down the line like Starmer said yesterday "Everyone gets 15 minutes as PM" How will the market react if Truss gets goosed today. Will it be seen as a good or bad thing ?

 

The uncertainty will be bad, the replacement will be a boost, would be my guess.

 

The depressing thing about this is that they have two years to 'move on' from it - they'll put a stabilising person in now. Truth be told, unless it's Johnson, we may start to see the other side of the Tory party (Cameron style Tories) begin to come back into control. Which obviously enhances them in an electoral sense. The smart move would be for whoever they put in there to come in and draw an immediate line between the ERG fanatics and everyone else, claim to be a government of adults now etc.

[Craig 6682]

2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

The Tories need to go for someone boring but with the appearance of being competent. Basically another Theresa May. If they do that they will recover in the polls but not nearly enough to actually win the next GE. The problem they're going to have is there's a lot of cunts in there who will basically look at this as their last chance to become PM and won't forgo that opportunity for the sake of the party.

 

Agreed and in the Tory Party, they're few and far between. John Major was another that fit that bill.

[Rayvin 5189]

2 minutes ago, The Fish said:

Is there any mechanism to call a GE when you're not the party in power?

 

I doubt there's anything stopping Labour from calling for a vote on it but they'd need enough Tories to go along with the process for it to get through. And a lot of those Tories would be quite literally signing their jobs away at this point in time, if they did so.

[ewerk 30394]

The no chance of a VoNC passing. Look at how easily they won last night. It would be turkeys voting for Christmas and there's no Tory MP willing to sign their own P45.

[trooper 940]

6 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

I doubt there's anything stopping Labour from calling for a vote on it but they'd need enough Tories to go along with the process for it to get through. And a lot of those Tories would be quite literally signing their jobs away at this point in time, if they did so.

Could Labour not call it & hope enough Tories jump ship & join them. I'd imagine there's never been a better time to see how many rats would leaving a "Stinking Ship"

[Craig 6682]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

The no chance of a VoNC passing. Look at how easily they won last night. It would be turkeys voting for Christmas and there's no Tory MP willing to sign their own P45.

 

You're right, And a VoNC can then not be called for another year, I think. 

[trooper 940]

Thirteenth MP say it is time for Truss to go

Miriam Cates has become the 13th Tory MP to call for Liz Truss to stand down.

[Rayvin 5189]

So long story short, while this is an amusing drama, the upshot is that we'll end up with a new PM selected by the Tory MPs themselves, and who will have two years to steady the ship and make them look competent again.

 

I think Truss may have been too useless too quickly for us really. Would have been great if she'd held off on this madness until she was a year in.

[Dr Gloom 21868]

1 minute ago, Rayvin said:

So long story short, while this is an amusing drama, the upshot is that we'll end up with a new PM selected by the Tory MPs themselves, and who will have two years to steady the ship and make them look competent again.

 

I think Truss may have been too useless too quickly for us really. Would have been great if she'd held off on this madness until she was a year in.

 

mate, the tories aren't coming back from this. even if they offer up a couple of years of rishi or hunt, they're fucked at the next election.

 

it's crap for the country that we can't get rid of them today - they deserve to be out now. but it's good for labour that they they get to oversee this period of stagflation, falling living stands and economic decline. they deserve to own the mess they created. 

[Rayvin 5189]

1 minute ago, Dr Gloom said:

 

mate, the tories aren't coming back from this. even if they offer up a couple of years of rishi or hunt, they're fucked at the next election.

 

it's crap for the country that we can't get rid of them today - they deserve to be out now. but it's good for labour that they they get to oversee this period of stagflation, falling living stands and economic decline. they deserve to own the mess they created. 

 

Agreed but right now they're polling at the level of being wiped off the face of the earth. They'll be back within respectable parameters again within a couple of years, that's the annoying thing.

[Meenzer 15466]

It's only six days since Kwarteng was sacked. Feels like a year.  

[Craig 6682]

38 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

So long story short, while this is an amusing drama, the upshot is that we'll end up with a new PM selected by the Tory MPs themselves, and who will have two years to steady the ship and make them look competent again.

 

I think Truss may have been too useless too quickly for us really. Would have been great if she'd held off on this madness until she was a year in.

 

As I've said before, I'm not convinced it's not all part of a bigger plan to get 'Cincinnatus' back into number 10. Perhaps Truss is something of a patsy?

[Alex 34952]

They aren’t that competent or clever. He might be back at some point but I don’t see him being the next PM. Even if that were to happen it’s not some big master plan though. 

[Alex 34952]

38 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

Agreed but right now they're polling at the level of being wiped off the face of the earth. They'll be back within respectable parameters again within a couple of years, that's the annoying thing.

Probably. The thing is their base will go back to being selfish cunts even if Labour turn things round economically as they start worrying about ‘illegal immigrants’, ‘scroungers’, etc again 

[Rayvin 5189]

7 minutes ago, Craig said:

 

As I've said before, I'm not convinced it's not all part of a bigger plan to get 'Cincinnatus' back into number 10. Perhaps Truss is something of a patsy?

 

Don't think it's a plan (this has been so chaotic I can't believe anyone could have orchestrated it) but do think there's a very real possibility of a return of Johnson here. If this had been a more gradual process with clear trip ups from the Tory high command on Truss, I could have believed it was a carefully managed set piece - but as it stands their whole party has exploded and they're all running around on fire. If that was the plan, I think they maybe overshot what was needed.

[Craig 6682]

[Rayvin 5189]

4 minutes ago, Alex said:

Probably. The thing is their base will go back to being selfish cunts even if Labour turn things round economically as they start worrying about ‘illegal immigrants’, ‘scroungers’, etc again 

 

I checked the Mail yesterday and it was full of comments backing Braverman, claiming she'd been sacked for being the first home secretary ever to actually do what she was supposed to do (presumably personally executing immigrants). Those guys might go Reform UK at least once the Tories settle down, but if Johnson comes back in I suspect they'll flock back.

[Craig 6682]

 

[Renton 21438]

1 hour ago, Ginolaandtonic said:

They know if they call one now they’ll lose. They’re fucked anyway but I guess it’s a toss up between certain death and possible certain death.

 

And 3 years more salary, perks, and pension contributions. 

[Gemmill 44557]

Brady is in 10 Downing St. 

[Ginolaandtonic 169]

2 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

And 3 years more salary, perks, and pension contributions. 

 

Yep

[Renton 21438]

16 minutes ago, Craig said:

 

 

 I mean how isn't Johnson also a "previously failed candidate"? 

 

The tories have no unity candidate, and that includes Johnson more than anyone, has everybody forgot the sequence of events that led to his resignation? It's literally impossible for them to unite the extremes of the parliamentary party. And all this in the background of a catastrophic drop in living standards. Takes some bedwetting this like. 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Renton

[ewerk 30394]

But what’s the difference between Labour and the Tories?