Politics

[Craig 6682]

Yeah I also live in the south and have a genuine fear that if there was a GE tomorrow the Tories would get back in. Round here people think they're doing a good job. And as you rightly point out, there is concern amongst hard core Labour supporters that Starmer hasn't got what is required to enact the level of change we need so he'll really struggle to convince the floating voters. 

 

I'm not sure who the answer is but I don't think it's Starmer. It's a shame Burnham doesn't currently have a seat. I think he'd make an excellent PM.

[wykikitoon 19991]

Trickle down economics doesn't work

[Rayvin 5188]

1 hour ago, Renton said:

 

My concern is he will get in, but will not provide the complete change in the constitution the country desperately needs. A slow rather than a quick death. 

 

As you know I fully share this concern but if that bit about PR is true then IMO he can do whatever the fuck he likes. That whole term, if it does nothing else, will have been worth it for the ability to finally put the Tories to the sword once and for all.

[Renton 21428]

2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

As you know I fully share this concern but if that bit about PR is true then IMO he can do whatever the fuck he likes. That whole term, if it does nothing else, will have been worth it for the ability to finally put the Tories to the sword once and for all.

Agreed. But I listened to him on that politics podcast, the one with Rory Stewart and Alistair Campbell. He didn't even acknowledge there is a problem in Uk politics (unlike both hosts). Nothing big will change under him imo. 

[Rayvin 5188]

I've not been on the Starmer bandwagon since he U-turned on the EU but have been told on here before (and this is fair) that he's biding his time on policies and vision until there's actually something to compete for. The public have short memories, it's possible that this is the play. I want more from him than that, many others on here seem to think the same, but we're not the ones he's trying to appeal to. We're the ones he's taking for granted.

 

When he comes to power, the argument is that he'll stealth through a lot of things as well that he couldn't have campaigned on even if they're inherently sensible. I don't know if this is a realistic hope, but again, that's what the pro-Starmer side seem to think.

 

And as said, if he brings in PR - for me, at this point, he could be a Tory and I'd vote for him. PR is that important now.

[Rayvin 5188]

1 minute ago, Renton said:

Agreed. But I listened to him on that politics podcast, the one with Rory Stewart and Alistair Campbell. He didn't even acknowledge there is a problem in Uk politics (unlike both hosts). Nothing big will change under him imo. 

 

I mean I think this too, honestly. I still hope I'm wrong.

[spongebob toonpants 3958]

1 hour ago, Holden McGroin said:

 

I live in the South where the Tories are rife. Some basic, catchy PR like "Lets finish the job" and splatter that all over the Sun/Mail 

Exactly, different world down here. People where I work, most of whom aren't that particularly well paid, all watched the funeral avidly, lapped up the bumlicking, will now revert to there all as bad as each other, Labour just want to give all our money to immigrants, its all thescivers fault.

 

I think the country is done tbh

[Renton 21428]

1 minute ago, spongebob toonpants said:

Exactly, different world down here. People where I work, most of whom aren't that particularly well paid, all watched the funeral avidly, lapped up the bumlicking, will now revert to there all as bad as each other, Labour just want to give all our money to immigrants, its all thescivers fault.

 

I think the country is done tbh

 

That's just based on your personal anecdote and NUFC style thinking though, which is negatively biased. It doesn't align with the polls which are terrible for the cons. And imo, they will only get worse the more people see of Truss and the more cost of living and recession bites. 

[Holden McGroin 6549]

1 minute ago, Renton said:

 

That's just based on your personal anecdote and NUFC style thinking though, which is negatively biased. It doesn't align with the polls which are terrible for the cons. And imo, they will only get worse the more people see of Truss and the more cost of living and recession bites. 

 

Aye, but they will time the PR perfectly for the GE and it would be stuff like....Ukraine war forcing gas/elec costs up but look what we did etc. etc.  Just hoping the swing/young voters have enough to savvy to go with Starmer. Its as much about the leader as it is about policies to a large portion of voters.

[Alex 34950]

Collated polls for August as per electoral calculus point to a small Labour majority (about 15). There’s obviously a margin of error but it’s been ages since any polls have suggested anything other than Labour being the single largest party. The Tories seem to be a mile away from actually winning again. 

[spongebob toonpants 3958]

7 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

That's just based on your personal anecdote and NUFC style thinking though, which is negatively biased. It doesn't align with the polls which are terrible for the cons. And imo, they will only get worse the more people see of Truss and the more cost of living and recession bites. 

Wish I shared your confidence, but I don't 

Sadly I agree if Starmer does get in we won't be addressing the real problem

[Renton 21428]

2 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said:

 

Aye, but they will time the PR perfectly for the GE and it would be stuff like....Ukraine war forcing gas/elec costs up but look what we did etc. etc.  Just hoping the swing/young voters have enough to savvy to go with Starmer. Its as much about the leader as it is about policies to a large portion of voters.

 

I know what your saying but when things start actually affecting people, as recessions always do, they react to that. It's all about the economy at the end of the day. Throw in the fact that Starmer has successfully distanced himself from Corbyn, and then, Truss. That is one turd even Murdoch and Dacre can't polish. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if Murdoch jumped ship, especially as Starmer isn't much of a threat to him. 

[Gemmill 44554]

Aye Murdoch won't want to back a loser. 

[Tom 14011]

1 hour ago, Alex said:

Collated polls for August as per electoral calculus point to a small Labour majority (about 15). There’s obviously a margin of error but it’s been ages since any polls have suggested anything other than Labour being the single largest party. The Tories seem to be a mile away from actually winning again. 

Given the damage the tories have unleashed on the country in the last 12 years I've never understood Labour's blank refusal to engage in a coalition of some sort. 
 

It's always ruled out before every election & it does my head in.

[PaddockLad 17148]

3 hours ago, Holden McGroin said:

A pessimist is never disappointed Rents.

 

I live in the South where the Tories are rife. Some basic, catchy PR like "Lets finish the job" and splatter that all over the Sun/Mail with Starmer spilling a bit of brown sauce while eating a sausage sandwich and its game on.

If Labour does back some form of PR at conference I think that could be a major line of attack for the tories at a GE “Labour are destroying 1000 years of democracy in these fair isles” etc etc and the same gimps that swallowed Brexit will lap it up….

[Alex 34950]

An electoral pact, based on PR, would see the Tories absolutely annihilated. So it won’t happen of course. It would be a good option to combat the ‘destruction of our democracy’ narrative though 

[Craig 6682]

2 hours ago, Renton said:

 

I know what your saying but when things start actually affecting people, as recessions always do, they react to that. It's all about the economy at the end of the day. Throw in the fact that Starmer has successfully distanced himself from Corbyn, and then, Truss. That is one turd even Murdoch and Dacre can't polish. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if Murdoch jumped ship, especially as Starmer isn't much of a threat to him. 

 

Murdoch is definitely the barometer to watch for. Famously jumped ship in 1997 IIRC.

 

[Holden McGroin 6549]

The fact that the the Tories have butt-fucked the whole country for the past 12 years  but are still JUST behind in the polls suggests to me  they'll have a really good chance of winning the GE with a 2 year run up.

[Holden McGroin 6549]

Rees-Mogg will be happy:

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/victorian-disease-returns-uk-nhs-28042355

[Renton 21428]

22 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said:

The fact that the the Tories have butt-fucked the whole country for the past 12 years  but are still JUST behind in the polls suggests to me  they'll have a really good chance of winning the GE with a 2 year run up.

 

Just behind? Really? Considering they have a new leader and a dead queen bounce, this is more than just behind.

[ewerk 30393]

24 minutes ago, Holden McGroin said:

The fact that the the Tories have butt-fucked the whole country for the past 12 years  but are still JUST behind in the polls suggests to me  they'll have a really good chance of winning the GE with a 2 year run up.

They're ten points behind in the polls. The fact that gives Labour only a very slim majority says a lot about our electoral system.

Edited September 21, 2022 by ewerk

[Rayvin 5188]

Yeah as has been said, we can't risk Labour going this alone. It has to be an electoral pact - we really, really need to kill the Tories off here.

[PaddockLad 17148]

2 hours ago, Gemmill said:

Aye Murdoch won't want to back a loser. 

He may have done last time out….  I read it in a few places that he favoured Sunak..even that senile old fucker can see the ERG are bad news

 

 

[PaddockLad 17148]

3 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

Yeah as has been said, we can't risk Labour going this alone. It has to be an electoral pact - we really, really need to kill the Tories off here.

The electoral annihilation of the Lib Dems after getting into bed with the tories May prevent this on both sides….just a thought, tbh fuck knows..

[Rayvin 5188]

14 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

The electoral annihilation of the Lib Dems after getting into bed with the tories May prevent this on both sides….just a thought, tbh fuck knows..

 

Doesn't have to mean coalition, could just be an agreement not to stand in each other's way in key seats. That would probably be enough? Labour become the largest party, LDs recover lost ground.