Kevin Carr's Gloves 3809 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 19 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said: What is the lefts obsession with Palestine? Fuck off cunt. 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5176 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 I sometimes wish I was capable of that level of bluntness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 34846 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 It’s almost like it’s all an attention-seeking game to him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4689 Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 Hey, if you’re not sure just say so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 34846 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 He was sure, don’t worry about that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15404 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21812 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 no evidence of antisemitism in the Labour Party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeys Fist 42064 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Oi vey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4718 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinRobin 11125 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Don't think PR is ever the answer, unless there has to be a minimum amount votes before you get a place in Parliament. PR unfortunately just allows more bigots and loonies to get a hand in government, and mainstream parties have to pander to them to stay in power (which is, of course, the only real game in town for most (all?) politicians). As a result, the left goes further left, and the right goes further right. It is certainly the case in Australia and Israel (looking from outside) and probably in many other PR jurisdictions, so be careful what you wish for. We need something better, but as long as it involves political turkeys having to vote for Christmas, I doubt you will get it anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 34846 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 21 hours ago, Rayvin said: This is a difficult one for me because I agree that a centre that actually gives a fuck is exactly where politics should be. I just don't think that's where we were. Also, I'd have more time for your views on this if you ever admitted you were wrong about the many, many things you have been wrong about. He doesn’t understand anything but, worse than that, he doesn’t even try to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30266 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 So that's another one gone from Labour. Possibly a few to come today from the Tories. At this rate they'll be a larger force in the Commons than the Lib Dems by the end of the week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 34846 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 It could be interesting if they end up holding the balance of power Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30266 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Chris Williamson MP once again with his finger on the pulse regarding the state of the Labour party, "In my 43 years as a member of this party, I've never seen it more united." Oh and FTR, KD and NJS, he has a pretty dodgy record on the whole antisemitism craic too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21812 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) So Young Labour proclaim that Palestine Lives in a tweet (since deleted) in response to Joan Ryan quitting as an MP because of antisemitism. This is one day after they accused Berger of being a traitor and coward after bing driven out of Labour because of antsemitic abuse. And a day after Ruth George accused the new Independent Group of being funded by Israel. But remember there is no evidence of an antisemitism crisis in the labour party - it’s just a distraction. Edited February 20, 2019 by Dr Gloom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21300 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said: So Young Labour proclaim that Palestine Lives in a tweet (since deleted) in response to Joan Ryan quitting as an MP because of antisemitism. This is one day after they accused Berger of being a traitor and coward after bing driven out of Labour because of antsemitic abuse. And a day after Ruth George accused the new Independent Group of being funded by Israel. But remember there is no evidence of an antisemitism crisis in the labour party - it’s just a distraction. Young Labour and the young conservatives have both become radicalised and extreme. This wasn't what we had in mind 20 years ago when we wanted young people to engage more in politics. It's beyond pro Palestine, antizionist and antisemitic now. If you don't follow the full doctrine, you are hounded out. Group think and identity politics. I want nothing more to do with labour, nobody I know in my age group does any more. Edited February 20, 2019 by Renton 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21812 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Is this sort of thing happening to the same extent with the young conservatives? 9 minutes ago, Renton said: Young Labour and the young conservatives have both become radicalised and extreme. This wasn't what we had in mind 20 years ago when we wanted young people to engage more in politics. It's beyond pro Palestine, antizionist and antisemitic now. If you don't follow the full doctrine, you are hounded out. Group think and identity politics. I want nothing more to do with labour, nobody I know in my age group does any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 21300 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Just now, Dr Gloom said: Is this sort of thing happening to the same extent with the young conservatives? From what I hear, it's a competition from them who can be most right wing and fascist. They were always massive cunts though. In the 90s when I was young and involved in New Labour to a small extent, everyone was a moderate. This is changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21812 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 The Labour Party in 2019 Chair of CLP accused of bullying Luciana Berger appeared on show broadcast by David Icke https://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/chair-of-clp-accused-of-bullying-luciana-berger-appeared-on-show-broadcast-by-david-icke-1.479784 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15404 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 8 hours ago, RobinRobin said: Don't think PR is ever the answer, unless there has to be a minimum amount votes before you get a place in Parliament. Yes, that'd have to be in there too. The German system makes some sense - you cast two votes, one directly for your local constituency MP (i.e. for a person) and one for a party list. The parties have to get over five percent to be allowed into parliament, but the MPs elected directly in the constituency votes are allowed in regardless of their party. So you keep out some of the loonier factions that would otherwise get in on pure PR (like when the BNP got nearly 2% of the national vote in 2010) but allow for local concentrations of votes like for Caroline Lucas in Brighton, that Kidderminster Hospital campaigner who won as an independent that time etc. to be rewarded. (That's an oversimplified description and there are exceptions, but you get the general idea.) You'd have to tweak it to allow for Scotland/Wales/NI but it's not a bad compromise. And it deals with some of the concerns with PR about losing touch with your local MP, as constituencies are only twice the size they would be otherwise, which I think is all right. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5176 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 55 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said: So Young Labour proclaim that Palestine Lives in a tweet (since deleted) in response to Joan Ryan quitting as an MP because of antisemitism. This is one day after they accused Berger of being a traitor and coward after bing driven out of Labour because of antsemitic abuse. And a day after Ruth George accused the new Independent Group of being funded by Israel. But remember there is no evidence of an antisemitism crisis in the labour party - it’s just a distraction. For it not to be a distraction there need to be profound and noticeable consequences. Are there any? Also, I'm a bit lost on the first things you posted. There seems to be a lot of anti Israeli stuff but I'm seeing nothing about Jews in general. I thought they were distinct issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5176 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 52 minutes ago, Renton said: Young Labour and the young conservatives have both become radicalised and extreme. This wasn't what we had in mind 20 years ago when we wanted young people to engage more in politics. It's beyond pro Palestine, antizionist and antisemitic now. If you don't follow the full doctrine, you are hounded out. Group think and identity politics. I want nothing more to do with labour, nobody I know in my age group does any more. You guys literally created this and now wash your hands of it Amazing. It's like a microcosm for the political fuck up in general. Blame the young people who we've shafted over and over again for being radicalized in their desperation to find lube to make the shafting less painful. There really is a generational war mixed into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 15404 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 Anyway, that's Heidi Allen, Anna Soubry and Sarah Wollaston gone too. Can't blame them really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30266 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Rayvin said: You guys literally created this and now wash your hands of it Amazing. It's like a microcosm for the political fuck up in general. Blame the young people who we've shafted over and over again for being radicalized in their desperation to find lube to make the shafting less painful. There really is a generational war mixed into this. Failure to address the housing problem aside, how did New Labour fuck the youth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 5176 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, ewerk said: Failure to address the housing problem aside, how did New Labour fuck the youth? Open goal that one. Failing to oppose austerity. Next? Anyway i wasn't pointing the finger at Labour specifically. More the generation in power. Edited February 20, 2019 by Rayvin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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