Politics

[Rayvin 5176]

2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

I don't think the public were ready for a left wing agenda back then tbh.

 

The public were ready to break under austerity and would have kicked the government with any radical agenda. So I'm going to just flat out disagree with you on that one.

Edited May 4, 2018 by Rayvin

[ewerk 30259]

2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

The public were ready to break under austerity and would have kicked the government with any radical agenda. So I'm going to just flat out disagree with you on that one.

And yet they didn't do so under Corbyn's leadership? I'm not saying that Miliband necessarily had the correct manifesto but Labour were still seen by many as the cause of the economic crisis and I'm not sure that the electorate and media would have been keen on the notion of increased borrowing.

[ewerk 30259]

5 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

And? His vote makes Labour look weak, increases uncertainty and reduces stability in the party.

 

Remember that:

 

 

I'll let Renton defend himself but to me there's a big difference in voting in a local election in a safe Labour council than voting in the GE.

[Rayvin 5176]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

And yet they didn't do so under Corbyn's leadership? I'm not saying that Miliband necessarily had the correct manifesto but Labour were still seen by many as the cause of the economic crisis and I'm not sure that the electorate and media would have been keen on the notion of increased borrowing.

 

Without Brexit i think they would have. Unfortunately the radical agenda the public went with was a right wing one, because it was served up first. And also, i would add, appeals more to the baser urges of the electorate.

[Rayvin 5176]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

I'll let Renton defend himself but to me there's a big difference in voting in a local election in a safe Labour council than voting in the GE.

 

In which case why are we reading anything into the results of these elections at all? Well I'm not tbh, so why are you, is the better question. 

 

And i dont disagree with Renton fwiw, I'm just throwing your logic back at you.

[Renton 21293]

10 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

In which case why are we reading anything into the results of these elections at all? Well I'm not tbh, so why are you, is the better question. 

 

And i dont disagree with Renton fwiw, I'm just throwing your logic back at you.

 

Council elections are important for local reasons but are also a barometer of feeling about leadership. I wanted to make my opinions clear about Brexit by voting Renew. The results show Corbyn has no chance securing a majority. An honorable man would resign. Corbyn isn't honourable though. 

[ewerk 30259]

16 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

In which case why are we reading anything into the results of these elections at all? Well I'm not tbh, so why are you, is the better question. 

 

And i dont disagree with Renton fwiw, I'm just throwing your logic back at you.

How about I throw my fucking fist in your face?

I'm not reading into the overall vote count but at a higher level on how many councils Labour have picked up. 

[Alex 34838]

5 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Council elections are important for local reasons but are also a barometer of feeling about leadership. I wanted to make my opinions clear about Brexit by voting Renew. The results show Corbyn has no chance securing a majority. An honorable man would resign. Corbyn isn't honourable though. 

I've thought for a while he must secretly know he hasn't got much chance of getting a majority. I think, given the state of the government, yesterday's results pretty much confirmed that. I didn't vote because I didn't feel I could support someone any more who isn't going to beat the Tories and a Labour vote would essentially be a sign of approval. Like yourself I would still vote Labour in a GE but it really is time to look elsewhere. I'm not even talking about policy, it's about him now. I have a bit of time for the bloke and I think he's decent and principled but, probably more than anything else in terms of what holds him back, he lacks the sort of pragmatism required for leadership whether that be an inability or lack of desire to really to after the government when the opportunity arises or whatever. It's almost unthinkable what another term after this one of the Tories in charge could do for this country in the long run.

[Monkeys Fist 42060]

10 minutes ago, ewerk said:

How about I throw my fucking fist in your face?

I'm not reading into the overall vote count but at a higher level on how many councils Labour have picked up. 

[Renton 21293]

3 minutes ago, Alex said:

I've thought for a while he must secretly know he hasn't got much chance of getting a majority. I think, given the state of the government, yesterday's results pretty much confirmed that. I didn't vote because I didn't feel I could support someone any more who isn't going to beat the Tories and a Labour vote would essentially be a sign of approval. Like yourself I would still vote Labour in a GE but it really is time to look elsewhere. I'm not even talking about policy, it's about him now. I have a bit of time for the bloke and I think he's decent and principled but, probably more than anything else in terms of what holds him back, he lacks the sort of pragmatism required for leadership whether that be an inability or lack of desire to really to after the government when the opportunity arises or whatever. It's almost unthinkable what another term after this one of the Tories in charge could do for this country in the long run.

 

Aye, pretty much agree entirely. I know several others that do too. 

[Alex 34838]

4 minutes ago, Monkeys Fist said:

[SpaceCadet 5]

[adios 717]

18 minutes ago, ewerk said:

How about I throw my fucking fist in your face?

I'm not reading into the overall vote count but at a higher level on how many councils Labour have picked up. 

 Accountants rioting, bare-chested in the streets. RAWRRRR!

[Meenzer 15401]

 

[adios 717]

Every time I read @ewerk and @Renton discuss Corbyn all I hear now is Michelle Wolf screeching "did you used to date him?"

[Alex 34838]

2 minutes ago, Meenzer said:

 

A lot of people like to say (you may have heard it mentioned by CT ) that people won't vote for a left wing government, but really it's more or less explained there. You won't win the marginal seats that you need for victory. I know I've said it loads of times before but the fptp voting system where your vote counts for much more or less depending on where you live is ridiculous

 

 

[Rayvin 5176]

28 minutes ago, ewerk said:

How about I throw my fucking fist in your face?

I'm not reading into the overall vote count but at a higher level on how many councils Labour have picked up. 

 

 

I'm not getting a rise out of you...am I?

 

Look we've been round the houses on this before, you guys drew me into this so i dont know what you expected.

[Rayvin 5176]

I'm not even saying anyone here is wrong about Corbyn, but Renton specifically mentioned Neoliberalism as if that was the alternative to Corbyn.

 

I'm not voting for it.

[ewerk 30259]

15 minutes ago, adios said:

 Accountants rioting, bare-chested in the streets. RAWRRRR!

[Alex 34838]

The silver lining here is that the Tories, despite how it's being painted, did shit. Just not as shit as some predictions.

[SpaceCadet 5]

They did just fine where I am, my town usually goes conservative but this time my whole borough have turned blue.

[strawb 4181]

Anecdotal

[Andrew 4718]

A relatively easy labour retention for Burnley, though they did lose seats overall.

 

And of course my ward, in its perpetual efforts to stop me seeing the good in where I live, have voted in a UKIP councillor again.

[SpaceCadet 5]

Was there any need for UKIP to compare themselves to the black death? They did did win a seat on Andrew's local council after all.

[Meenzer 15401]

45 minutes ago, Alex said:

The silver lining here is that the Tories, despite how it's being painted, did shit. Just not as shit as some predictions.

 

Aye, I think poor expectations management from Labour has helped the Tories paint their results as a relative win. The overarching message is still broadly "everyone's shite and we don't like politicians", so no one needs to be getting cocky about anything, quite frankly.