Politics

[Monkeys Fist 41551]

It's very simple really, he's thick as mince.

[Howmanheyman 32192]

Not sure where you get your drop from. Can't see anything that would cause it. Are you a non Dom ?

 

Getting it from your fucking calculator link, mate!

That's obviously not good for you, but the general theme of using taxpayers money as a crutch for business is a bad idea. Business in the UK one way or another is subsidized to the tune of 92billion by taxpayers. Need to get that down. Thought the Tories were relatively tame and was expecting bigger attacks on the more vulnerable in society. At the end of the day Tories are soft right so most of this will be smoke and mirrors for public consumption and didn't expect anything fundamental to change and it would have been the same if it had been Labour. Both are pretty much a front for the ruling elite. Right now there is no alternative. When a genuine movement comes to claw back rights and fairer distribution of wealth it will be under unabated attack from day one....But it will come.

obviously not good for the 'likes of me' Parky, old fruit. I work full time. Wife fucked. Bring the revolution on, mate.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Howmanheyman

[Park Life 71]

I've found with working class Tories is that they've convinced themselves they've got some angle...That those around them just can't see it. Or sometimes it's just things passed down from the father.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

And fiddle their expenses, take back handers and arrange lucrative directorship positions which their privileged position affords him, leaving them substantially better off.

 

Assuming that stat is even true in the first place, it sounds like bullshit to me. Where are you quoting it from exactly? You can't just put any old shit in quotation marks and call it a fact, that's not how it works.

The Guardian

[Howmanheyman 32192]

The likes of Mike Ashley will sort us out. Looks after his lads does wor Mike.

[Park Life 71]

One of the problems with 'democracy' is that old people vote much more than young ones and they scare easily and as they get older become Conservative with a small c. The other problem is that the elite own the media which removes any semblance of balance or the ability of folk to make their minds up with all the facts. It all goes back to the deal Thatcher made with the Murdoch press. The Greek elite (philosophers, drunks and kiddie fiddlers) knew what they were doing when they invented the demos and the Romans followed on with their bread and circus angle.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/apr/28/how-margaret-thatcher-and-rupert-murdoch-made-secret-deal

 

"Times Newspapers had long cherished their independence. In 1966, when the Times was in financial difficulty, the new owner who came to the rescue, Lord Roy Thomson of Fleet, promised to sustain it as an independent non-partisan newspaper – precisely how he had conducted the profitable Sunday Times. Murdoch was able to acquire both publications in 1981 only because he began making solemn pledges that he would maintain the tradition of independence. He broke every one of those promises in the first years.

 

His breach of the undertakings freely made for Times Newspapers was a marked contrast with the independent journalism we at the Sunday Times (and William Rees-Mogg at the Times) had enjoyed under the principled ownership of the Thomson family. Thatcher was a vital force in reviving British competitiveness, but she abetted a concentration of press power that became increasingly arrogant and careless of human dignity in ways that would have appalled her, had she remained in good health long enough to understand what her actions had wrought.'

Edited July 8, 2015 by Park Life

[Christmas Tree 4547]

CT, I struggle to comprehend how you're a working class taxi driver and you vote Tory? Do you not understand how politics works? Staggering. No-one in their right minds can be working class and vote Tory, the Tories don't even represent the middle class any more.

 

Also, you present very poor arguments to very relevant points me and others on here put across. You don't seem to understand what you stand for. Like a parody account.

I was just correcting the inaccuracy in your statement.

 

As for understanding politics, I understand them fairly well. Every Labour government has left office with unemployment higher. How does that help the working class.

 

Free child care for 3 and 4 years olds greatly helps the working class.

 

Even tonight labour politicians are lining up begrudgingly agreeing with large swathes of today's budget.

 

By your reckoning we have a majority Conservative government voted in purely by the upper class.

 

As for your parody last paragraph, that's just sour grapes at being corrected. You're better than that.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

 

Getting it from your fucking calculator link, mate!

obviously not good for the 'likes of me' Parky, old fruit. I work full time. Wife fucked. Bring the revolution on, mate.

Aye, I know. I meant I can't see what happens in 2017 that causes your drop.

 

Maybe the link is shit.

[Howmanheyman 32192]

Aye, I know. I meant I can't see what happens in 2017 that causes your drop.

 

Maybe the link is shit.

It could well be shit. I fucking well hope so for my family's sake.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

I've found with working class Tories is that they've convinced themselves they've got some angle...That those around them just can't see it. Or sometimes it's just things passed down from the father.

Aye think that's the other way around. (Labour). Tory voters are much more likely to switch allegiance if a better opportunity is on offer, where as Labour supporters will just vote Labour regardless, particularly in northern Britain.

 

With regard to Tax Credits, they were a very cunning plan by Brown to "buy" a big chunk of the vote. Totally out of control now with 9/10 families with kids getting them.

[adios 717]

CT is a Tory because everyone around him is Labour. It's probably that simple.

[Anorthernsoul 1221]

CT is a Tory because everyone around him is Labour. It's probably that simple.

Pretty much it to be fair. He just casts legitimate holes in policy aside like a true Tory robot, like the MP's in TV interviews who tow the party line like they've been programmed without any considerable thought. Prime example being the MP for Hexham and that inept cunt in charge of "The Northern Powerhouse", which isn't even taking the North into account. (Manchester? Fuck off).

 

Osbourne couldn't run a bath. He just steals other ideas and elaborates to pass off as his own. Consistently making U-Turns and hoping the public forgets. It's a classic for this Tory government to go back on policies and making themselves look like indecisive idiots. How on earth did they get a majority? We even had Boris Johnson coming out today saying we shouldn't ban IS flags because it is a free country, since when did free countries allow Terrorism and support of Terrorism Boris? Another Tory clueless wanker.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/08/george-osborne-budget-stole-labours-election-promises-living-wage

 

Tories on other forums have held their hands up and said the Conservatives have undermined the budget somewhat with the fact working families are being punished with the tax credits, especially new mothers.

 

 

CT, please answer this though. What do you think of the TTIP? Not one Tory has answered me since last year on this. Not fucking ONE.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Anorthernsoul

[NJS 4296]

With regard to Tax Credits, they were a very cunning plan by Brown to "buy" a big chunk of the vote. Totally out of control now with 9/10 families with kids getting them.

They were meant as a short term measure to reduce unemployment by making low pay jobs viable and it worked. The problem is businesses have taken the piss by using them to keep the wages they pay low. Firms like Tesco when they were making 4bn a year still paying close to minimum wage is a disgrace especially given their cash reserves.

 

What should have been done is to raise the minimum wage by loads - 50% off the top of my head - yes it would probably cost a few "jobs" at firms taking the piss and maybe even send a few businesses down the pan but I'd take that to see the vast majority of firms who can afford it being forced to pay something a bit more decent.

 

Overall the economy would benefit.

[toonotl 2871]

CT is a Tory because everyone around him is Labour. It's probably that simple.

Almost certainly this.

[Dr Gloom 21620]

Ironically this budget pinched a lot of Miliband's ideas, the living wage thing to offset the welfare cuts. Slowing the pace pace of the cuts to smooth the impact of austerity. All the one nation talk. Osborne had the chance to get really nasty from a position of strength and a proper Tory electoral mandate without the need to haggle with the libdems. Instead we saw this attempt to appeal to the right on things like defence and welfare while occupying the centre ground on things the minimum wage. It's almost as if he's trying to position himself as a future leader.

 

Still a disgusting rolling back of the state but important to remember Labour are commited to balancing the books too and after this budget there is surprisingly little between the two parties right now.

Edited July 9, 2015 by Dr Gloom

[Christmas Tree 4547]

Pretty much it to be fair. He just casts legitimate holes in policy aside like a true Tory robot, like the MP's in TV interviews who tow the party line like they've been programmed without any considerable thought. Prime example being the MP for Hexham and that inept cunt in charge of "The Northern Powerhouse", which isn't even taking the North into account. (Manchester? Fuck off).

 

Osbourne couldn't run a bath. He just steals other ideas and elaborates to pass off as his own. Consistently making U-Turns and hoping the public forgets. It's a classic for this Tory government to go back on policies and making themselves look like indecisive idiots. How on earth did they get a majority? We even had Boris Johnson coming out today saying we shouldn't ban IS flags because it is a free country, since when did free countries allow Terrorism and support of Terrorism Boris? Another Tory clueless wanker.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/08/george-osborne-budget-stole-labours-election-promises-living-wage

 

Tories on other forums have held their hands up and said the Conservatives have undermined the budget somewhat with the fact working families are being punished with the tax credits, especially new mothers.

 

I know as much about this as I do about our potential be signings.

 

I've had a quick google and read this on The Guardian site.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/feb/16/ttip-transatlantic-trade-deal-businesses

 

I'm sure there's less favourable stuff on it which I'll have a look at.

 

It hasn't really been a big talking point in mainstream politics. Does it effect you or your work directly?

CT, please answer this though. What do you think of the TTIP? Not one Tory has answered me since last year on this. Not fucking ONE.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

Ironically this budget pinched a lot of Miliband's ideas, the living wage thing to offset the welfare cuts. Slowing the pace pace of the cuts to smooth the impact of austerity. All the one nation talk. Osborne had the chance to get really nasty from a position of strength and a proper Tory electoral mandate without the need to haggle with the libdems. Instead we saw this attempt to appeal to the right on things like defence and welfare while occupying the centre ground on things the minimum wage. It's almost as if he's trying to position himself as a future leader.

 

Still a disgusting rolling back of the state but important to remember Labour are commited to balancing the books too and after this budget there is surprisingly little between the two parties right now.

Like Ed Milliband, I just can't see Osborne as a prime minister.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

I've also now read this.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/what-is-ttip-and-six-reasons-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

 

Lots of ifs and mights but nothing that's going to concern the average Joe in the street just yet.

 

Maybe it will get more attention when we get to vote on Europe (thanks to the conservatives)

[Anorthernsoul 1221]

If the Tories had extended the living wage commitment to anyone over the age of 18 then that would have been a total vote winner. That it's only limited to those over 25 will mean most people that could have been affected by the rise, won't be. Although a benefit is that 18-25 employment might see a rise, even if it's low paid.

 

Ultimately the budget was more political than anything. There's no investment in anything and the usual giveaways to the well off and elderly. However, the people will lap it up. A national living wage is a step in the right direction and most people would agree with a higher threshold for inheritance tax.

 

The real test of this Government won't necessarily be about how it deals with benefit claimants, but how (if) it has increased accessibility to (well paid) jobs so that people have the chance to cover what they're losing through work. Both unemployment figures coming down and wages rising across the board, not just for high earners, will determine whether this budget and their term has been a success.

 

By 2020 the £9 living wage they project will be worth £5 due to current inflation.

[ChezGiven 0]

We have near 0% inflation currently. £9 won't be worth £5 in 5 years.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

And all this austerity stuff is going to be done and dusted in 4 years. The last year run upto the election will see lots of sweeteners on offer, such as better tax thresholds, rises in welfare benefit and public sector.

 

If the economy and jobs are still on an upward trend then another Conservative government will be a certainty.

 

(Particularly given the current lack of exciting candidates up for the Labour leadership).

[NJS 4296]

And all this austerity stuff is going to be done and dusted in 4 years. The last year run upto the election will see lots of sweeteners on offer, such as better tax thresholds, rises in welfare benefit and public sector.

 

If the economy and jobs are still on an upward trend then another Conservative government will be a certainty.

 

(Particularly given the current lack of exciting candidates up for the Labour leadership).

Why the fuck would they increase welfare and the public sector when the entire purpose of the cuts was to reduce them forever?

 

The only sweeteners will be higher rate tax cuts.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

Why the fuck would they increase welfare and the public sector when the entire purpose of the cuts was to reduce them forever?

 

The only sweeteners will be higher rate tax cuts.

Because they've both been frozen at 1% for 4 years. (Not 5). Pretty obvious really.

[Gemmill 43312]

God you are an idiot.

[Christmas Tree 4547]

God you are an idiot.

Of course I am. What else do you expect to happen in the last year and in the run up to an election?

 

1% Freeze on welfare and public wages will end meaning they will increase by more.

 

They will also have a nice little surplus tucked up for treats.