Politics

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3860]

The thing is Russia has a point albeit a small one in that the new Ukraine government has far right extremists on it.

[TobamorisRevenge 0]

`the new Ukraine government has far right extremists on it.`

 

your contacts in the ROmanian secret service have informed you of this have they?

Edited March 4, 2014 by TobamorisRevenge

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3860]

`the new Ukraine government has far right extremists on it.`

 

your contacts in the ROmanian secret service have informed you of this have they?

 

 

The BBC but much the same thing really.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26415508

[Ken 119]

`the new Ukraine government has far right extremists on it.`

 

your contacts in the ROmanian secret service have informed you of this have they?

I thought you were a futuroligist, whatever the fuck that means. Why didn't you factor this in to your predictions? It's not goodies versus baddies anymore is it child?

Edited March 4, 2014 by Ken

[Ken 119]

Let Russia have Crimea. Or more accurately speaking, Russia will have Crimea without serious repercussions elsewhere.

[Ausman 0]

Well Russia isn't with out it's far right extremists, just ask the ethnic populations that live there. Anyway even if Ukraine has far rightest politicians, it's still no excuse to occupy their territory.

[Ken 119]

Well Russia isn't with out it's far right extremists, just ask the ethnic populations that live there. Anyway even if Ukraine has far rightest politicians, it's still no excuse to occupy their territory.

It is if you have a large naval base there. And it is if you feel others are attempting to cut your grass.

[Ausman 0]

Yes they have a large naval base there, and I don't see it as problem considering Russia pays Ukraine a yearly rent for them to use it. Still no excuse to occupy it. It's just Russia playing the big bully boy and I'm sure Putin would love to have the old Soviet Union empire back under Russia's control, after all he's former KGB.

[Ken 119]

It is a problem for Russia if Ukraine became fully fledged pro-Western. What would the US do if SK became pro-China? Or Saudi Arabia pro-Russian? Wouldn't go down too well...no?

[Ausman 0]

Don't see your point there, whether Ukraine are pro western or not. It wouldn't be the first country on their borders that's pro western. It's still no excuse.

[Ken 119]

You don't do you? Tell me another nation in this day and age who is home to another nation's major military base that allows open oppositon to it by an adversary.

[ChezGiven 0]

It is a problem for Russia if Ukraine became fully fledged pro-Western.

In what way?

 

Gazprom is one of the most important parts of the Russian economy, 50% of Gazprom's business is in Europe. Since the 'gas wars' of 2006, the gas stocks of EU companies are at a record high, shale gas is now being exported from the US, Norway's gas exports to the EU are growing exponentially, the liquefied gas exports from the middle east (Qatar) are also rising. All this undermines Russia's economic hand. Russia (more specifically Gazprom) need the west increasingly more than the West needs Gazprom. Whilst Putin is playing zero-sum diplomacy and land grabs, the EU bloc has been building an energy policy that anticipated these moves for nearly a decade.

 

Its a problem for Putin's dick if Ukraine becomes integrated into the EU, its not a problem for Gazprom's shareholders.

[Park Life 71]

This is the Brzezinski model of destabilization at play and the Russians know it. American and UK and others have been pumping money into the Ukraine to fund the current shenanigans. This is ultimately aimed at softening up Russian and its sphere of influence. Russia ain't gonna have it.

[Sonatine 11329]

[Park Life 71]

In what way?

 

Gazprom is one of the most important parts of the Russian economy, 50% of Gazprom's business is in Europe. Since the 'gas wars' of 2006, the gas stocks of EU companies are at a record high, shale gas is now being exported from the US, Norway's gas exports to the EU are growing exponentially, the liquefied gas exports from the middle east (Qatar) are also rising. All this undermines Russia's economic hand. Russia (more specifically Gazprom) need the west increasingly more than the West needs Gazprom. Whilst Putin is playing zero-sum diplomacy and land grabs, the EU bloc has been building an energy policy that anticipated these moves for nearly a decade.

 

Its a problem for Putin's dick if Ukraine becomes integrated into the EU, its not a problem for Gazprom's shareholders.

Russia will just nuke Belgium and everyone will shit their pants.

[Meenzer 15467]

Hey, it'd solve their language divide issues.

[Park Life 71]

 

Swiss choc will take over the shortfall.

[ChezGiven 0]

Russia will just nuke Belgium and everyone will shit their pants.

 

Something good may come of all this then.

[Ausman 0]

 

Something good may come of all this then.

 

 

So long as they don't touch the beer. That's okay with me.

[Park Life 71]

Micro nukes twinned with micro brewery is win.

[Rayvin 5189]

The real risk with the Russia-Ukraine crisis is that Russia doesn't have a 'soft power' option. It's all stick with Putin, he has no carrots that carry as much weight as US money. That means any escalation will be war.

 

With that said, someone mentioned earlier that we need to find a solution that involves both sides not losing face. I think that would only apply if Putin charged in without expecting the international reaction. So far there's barely been a coherent thing said about it internationally.

 

It's encouraging that China isn't backing it, but then they never would given their domestic political situation.

 

Not sure where Russia goes from here... or anyone for that matter.

[The Fish 10822]

I've thought about this quite a bit and thought that my most substantive contribution is this:

 

 

 

That is all.

Edited March 4, 2014 by The Fish

[Park Life 71]

The real risk with the Russia-Ukraine crisis is that Russia doesn't have a 'soft power' option. It's all stick with Putin, he has no carrots that carry as much weight as US money. That means any escalation will be war.

 

With that said, someone mentioned earlier that we need to find a solution that involves both sides not losing face. I think that would only apply if Putin charged in without expecting the international reaction. So far there's barely been a coherent thing said about it internationally.

 

It's encouraging that China isn't backing it, but then they never would given their domestic political situation.

 

Not sure where Russia goes from here... or anyone for that matter.

We need to find a solution that will stop the west meddling everywhere fucking where on the planet.

[Ken 119]

In what way?

 

Gazprom is one of the most important parts of the Russian economy, 50% of Gazprom's business is in Europe. Since the 'gas wars' of 2006, the gas stocks of EU companies are at a record high, shale gas is now being exported from the US, Norway's gas exports to the EU are growing exponentially, the liquefied gas exports from the middle east (Qatar) are also rising. All this undermines Russia's economic hand. Russia (more specifically Gazprom) need the west increasingly more than the West needs Gazprom. Whilst Putin is playing zero-sum diplomacy and land grabs, the EU bloc has been building an energy policy that anticipated these moves for nearly a decade.

 

Its a problem for Putin's dick if Ukraine becomes integrated into the EU, its not a problem for Gazprom's shareholders.

As I've said before, Crimea is of vital strategic importance to Russia. They aren't going to have a government who favours relations with the West over Russia right on its doorstep, especially when they interests in it.

 

Interesting points you've made about Gazprom and its situation with the EU. I don't think Putin cares enough about to influence him either way though and this talk about possible economic sanctions imposed by the US I question whether European nations will follow with them. Something else to factor in here is Japan's need for fossil fuel since the Fukushima incident. Where once 75% of its energy needs came from its nuclear industry they have become totally reliant on gas and oil. It has been noted that Putin and the Japanese PM were quite chummy during the Olympics and they have been chummy for quite a while. Now I'm not sure what market share Russian oil interests have in Japan and in Asia as a whole but I think it's safe to say that it will be significantly increasing over the next decade. Where one market is a risk of closing another large one opens up.

[Park Life 71]

Russia and its zone of influence have 20% of the planets oil and gas. This doesn't include the untapped and under analyzed stuff lying around in places like Uzbekistan and Azerbaijan. This is what the people who have been pumping billions into de-stabalising Ukraine and other Russian satellites are up to. The US and EU agenda in Eurasia is to decouple and Balkanize vulnerable states and get at the stuff in the ground especially also minerals and so on..Reagans National Endowment for Democracy has pumped in $5 billion to destabalise Ukraine and other satellite states to bring about such regime change. Putin is well aware of the greater game and will not back down this time under any circumstances. Russia has no fear of war whatsoever and much less to lose than McDonalds land.