Politics

[ChezGiven 0]

I'm a political mackem

 

[PaddockLad 17698]

Privatisation has already begun in the NHS and was started by Labour. I haven't seen or heard anything about plans for 2020.

 

Any links.

 

So it wasnt begun under Thatcher then by contracting out cleaning etc, thus making wards filthy and breeding grounds for infections?...

 

You're just as one eyed and unbalanced as those you criticise for the same thing.

[The Fish 10972]

Nowt there

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[Christmas Tree 4851]

So it wasnt begun under Thatcher then by contracting out cleaning etc, thus making wards filthy and breeding grounds for infections?...

 

You're just as one eyed and unbalanced as those you criticise for the same thing.

You always want to drag everything back to Thatcher

 

Privatisation has been creeping into the NHS since it began.

 

I think its fair to say that it was heavily increased during 13 years of the last labour government. Most people remember all the horrific PFI's deals that were done but there was also a lot more surgical procedures.

 

To get back on track, the point is whether something major is planned for 2020 or whether it is just more creeping privatisation.

 

I don't have a great problem with it as do most sensible people which is probably why all governments advance it.

Edited October 3, 2013 by Christmas Tree

[The Fish 10972]

You always want to drag everything back to Thatcher Privatisation has been creeping into the NHS since it began. I think its fair to say that it was heavily increased during 13 years of the last labour government. Most people remember all the horrific PFI's deals that were done but there was also a lot more surgical procedures. To get back on track, the point is whether something major is planned for 2020 or whether it is just more creeping privatisation. I don't have a great problem with it as do most sensible people which is probably why all governments advance it.

Yeah it's got nothing to do with the fact that there's buttloads of money in it for the politicians.

 

• 225 parliamentarians have recent or present financial private healthcare connections
• 145 Lords have recent or present financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 124 Peers benefit from the financial services sector
• 1 in 4 Conservative Peers have recent or present financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 1 in 6 Labour Peers have recent or present financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 1 in 6 Crossbench Peers have recent or present financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 1 in 10 Liberal Democrat Peers have recent or present financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 75 MPs have recent or present financial links to companies involved in private healthcare
• 81% of these are Conservative
• 4 Key members of the Associate Parliamentary Health Group have parliamentarians with financial connections to companies involved in healthcare
• 4 Patrons of the pro-reform think tank 2020health have Peers with private healthcare links
• Nearly 40% of the most powerful individuals in healthcare are from companies with links to Lords and MPs.
• 333 donations from private healthcare sources totalling £8.3 million has been gifted to the Tories.
• 4 MPs and 1 Lord have worked for Huntsworth Health, run by a Peer who gave money to Cameron’s leadership campaign
• 25 of the Finalists in the HealthInvestors Awards 2012 have parliamentarians connected to them
• 2 companies, DACBeachcroft, Cumberlege Connections., which have Lords as a partner and as an owner respectively, moved themselves into a position to make money from the reforms as the Lords voted on the bill, and before the bill became Act
• 5 organisations link to Baroness Cumberlege: Her company, Cumberlege Connections, Associate Parliamentary Health Group, 2020health, Huntsworth plc, MJM, healthcare solutions
• 19 Lords and MPs have financial links to Pharmaceutical giant GlaxoSmithKline
• 9 Lords and MPs have received payment from a company run by Baroness Cumberlege, called Cumberlege Connections, which is a healthcare training and political networking company
• 1 – the amount of times the BBC challenged Andrew Lansley in the last three years on his donation received to fund his private office when shadow health minister from John Nash the chairman of Care UK. Mr Nash was made a Lord.
• All were able to vote on the Health and Social Care bill (now Act), despite having a prejudicial interest, which would not have been allowed at local council level

Edited October 3, 2013 by The Fish

[JaMoUsE 0]

CT im currently employed by the nhs, were undergoing operation 'pacific'. we've been told all our operations will be outsourced to strategic partnerships by 2018. I'll probably be offered a position by whoever gets our contact but its still shit. I didn't mean the nhs as a whole, but effectively step by step its going private.

[Christmas Tree 4851]

CT im currently employed by the nhs, were undergoing operation 'pacific'. we've been told all our operations will be outsourced to strategic partnerships by 2018. I'll probably be offered a position by whoever gets our contact but its still shit. I didn't mean the nhs as a whole, but effectively step by step its going private.

I agree it's going step by step.

 

The debate (which is over anyway) is whether there was an alternative?

 

 

[Renton 22008]

CT, do you really that your job ad a taxi driver gives you special insight into people's finances and contentment? Would you like me to explain why this is nonsense?

 

Labour are short on policies, hence my mackem comment, I'm very disillusioned, ad I've said. You're also correct there were plenty of policies announced on the Tory conference. Tbh they've lurched further to the right than I could ever have imagined. I think too far, as it happens. I'd fucking hate to be young under this government, it's time for them to do something.

[PaddockLad 17698]

Whatever the tories policies are, the cat is out of tyhe bag now re UKIP and the tory share of the vote is fatally split. Neither could Cameron deliver the majority needed last time to kill off a bloke more unpopular than the neighbourhood paedo. It'll be another hung Parliament iyam, fuck knows the make up of it this time though.

[Renton 22008]

'You always want to drag everything back to Thatcher'.

 

Irony? Have you listened to any Tory politicians recently?

[The Fish 10972]

Whatever the tories policies are, the cat is out of tyhe bag now re UKIP and the tory share of the vote is fatally split. Neither could Cameron deliver the majority needed last time to kill off a bloke more unpopular than the neighbourhood paedo. It'll be another hung Parliament iyam, fuck knows the make up of it this time though.

 

I'd not be surprised to see a Lab/Con split. I'd expect the majority of Lib Dem voters to abstain or abandon them all together.

[ewerk 31225]

Which raises the question of who the Lib Dems will go into government with should they hold the balance of power?

[Renton 22008]

They'll whore themselves to whoever has the most seats. Assuming they have an elected MP. I don't think it will be a hung parliament fwiw.

[The Fish 10972]

Which raises the question of who the Lib Dems will go into government with should they hold the balance of power?

[Howmanheyman 33916]

'You always want to drag everything back to Thatcher'.

 

Irony? Have you listened to any Tory politicians recently?

 

On sale at the Tory conference.

[Christmas Tree 4851]

CT, do you really that your job ad a taxi driver gives you special insight into people's finances and contentment? Would you like me to explain why this is nonsense?

 

Labour are short on policies, hence my mackem comment, I'm very disillusioned, ad I've said. You're also correct there were plenty of policies announced on the Tory conference. Tbh they've lurched further to the right than I could ever have imagined. I think too far, as it happens. I'd fucking hate to be young under this government, it's time for them to do something.

You haven't explained how you see it everyday?

 

As for the young. Child poverty soared under Labour, Youth unemployment soared under Labour.

 

It's also simplistic to simply slag off this coalition given the absolute mess and debt they took over.

 

3 years in they have reduced the debt, raised the lowest paid out of paying income tax and restored the retail index link to old age pensioners.

 

That's before we give them some credit for tackling the big issues that previous governments have shirked such as public sector pensions and reforming welfare.

 

And then there's the economy. At last getting back on its feet with one and a half million private jobs created, exports at record levels and more people employed than at any time in our history.

 

Sure things arnt perfect and sure there has been casualties, but that was always going to be the case regardless of who won the last election.

 

 

[Renton 22008]

If UKIP win single seat the Tories are fucked imo.

[Renton 22008]

You haven't explained how you see it everyday?

 

As for the young. Child poverty soared under Labour, Youth unemployment soared under Labour.

 

It's also simplistic to simply slag off this coalition given the absolute mess and debt they took over.

 

3 years in they have reduced the debt, raised the lowest paid out of paying income tax and restored the retail index link to old age pensioners.

 

That's before we give them some credit for tackling the big issues that previous governments have shirked such as public sector pensions and reforming welfare.

 

And then there's the economy. At last getting back on its feet with one and a half million private jobs created, exports at record levels and more people employed than at any time in our history.

 

Sure things arnt perfect and sure there has been casualties, but that was always going to be the case regardless of who won the last election.

People on average are generally much worse off, bottom line. That's before we get into inequalities etc. I'd rather argue on facts than feelings, but if you can't immediately see why the opinions you gather from your taxi are massively biased and therefore invalid, then I give up.

[Renton 22008]

Btw, the Tories have not reduced the debt. The economy was bound to pick up eventually, with only you predicting irreversible managed decline. It's been far to slow and at much too high a cost though, we're still a smaller economy than 2008 ffs.

[Christmas Tree 4851]

People on average are generally much worse off, bottom line. That's before we get into inequalities etc. I'd rather argue on facts than feelings, but if you can't immediately see why the opinions you gather from your taxi are massively biased and therefore invalid, then I give up.

Of course people are worse off it's been 3 years of cuts. It was always going to be regardless of who won.

 

A lot of people understand this is and accept the mess needs sorting.

[Christmas Tree 4851]

Btw, the Tories have not reduced the debt. The economy was bound to pick up eventually, with only you predicting irreversible managed decline. It's been far to slow and at much too high a cost though, we're still a smaller economy than 2008 ffs.

The good old left argument. We would have done it faster and nicer bollocks.

 

Anybody who thinks the country would be a sounder safer place in with Ed Balls holding the purse strings wants shooting tbf.

[RedfernMag 0]

It's pretty obvious that the current Tory rhetoric is a direct plea to all the previous Conservative votes that have drifted off to UKIP. The Lib-Dems are fucked with (what appears to be) most of their support ditching them for Labour.

 

The crisis of capitalism will continue whichever party mans the ship.

Edited October 3, 2013 by RedfernMag

[PaddockLad 17698]

The good old left argument. We would have done it faster and nicer bollocks.

 

Anybody who thinks the country would be a sounder safer place in with Ed Balls holding the purse strings wants shooting tbf.

 

why?

 

And explain please why its a good idea for Gideon to be using public money to create another housing bubble which caused the "mess that Labour created" in the first place?

[Renton 22008]

The good old left argument. We would have done it faster and nicer bollocks.

 

Anybody who thinks the country would be a sounder safer place in with Ed Balls holding the purse strings wants shooting tbf.

Well we've had the second worst recovery out the G7 since the crash, with the economy of France and Germany growing, but with ours contracting along with Italy. Miles behind the US who decided to invest their way out of recession to an extent. In short, our economic record compared with other nations has been shit. Explain that.

[Christmas Tree 4851]

why?

 

And explain please why its a good idea for Gideon to be using public money to create another housing bubble which caused the "mess that Labour created" in the first place?

If you think a British housing bubble caused the crash you better read up.