Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's been pretty clear to some of us that he's never been great. He has however made the best out of being quite athletic. Last year was his renaissance year and he did well at times adding a bit more defensive cover to midfield. Great against the bigger clubs but a waste of a position against the lesser clubs when attack was needed. This season he has continually looked finished. Zero end product, atrocious crossing and not even 30 yard runs that result in us winning a free kick. He is also becoming less effective as a defensive player as displayed when he cost us a goal against Southampton. Surely his time with us is at an end? He is not really even the sort of player you would use as an impact sub. I genuinely get stunned hearing some of the comments about him still playing well for us and can only put them down to wummery, rose tinted glasses or limited vision of his game due to watching on a stream. Yesterday he again received groans from the crowd for his poor positional play, lack of ambition going forward and general standard of play. Be interested to hear some genuine views from others who watch him live this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44804 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Someone needs some attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21912 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21912 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's been pretty clear to some of us that he's never been great. He has however made the best out of being quite athletic. Last year was his renaissance year and he did well at times adding a bit more defensive cover to midfield. Great against the bigger clubs but a waste of a position against the lesser clubs when attack was needed. This season he has continually looked finished. Zero end product, atrocious crossing and not even 30 yard runs that result in us winning a free kick. He is also becoming less effective as a defensive player as displayed when he cost us a goal against Southampton. Surely his time with us is at an end? He is not really even the sort of player you would use as an impact sub. I genuinely get stunned hearing some of the comments about him still playing well for us and can only put them down to wummery, rose tinted glasses or limited vision of his game due to watching on a stream. Yesterday he again received groans from the crowd for his poor positional play, lack of ambition going forward and general standard of play. Be interested to hear some genuine views from others who watch him live this season. Down there with your Ben Arfa posts from last season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aimaad22 4156 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 So we're leaving Pardew alone now then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeys Fist 42378 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Doesn't matter since we're all dead on the 21st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj 17 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 His biggest asset has always been his ability to alleviate pressure due to his running with the ball, winning us free-kicks in dangerous areas and of course his fantastic engine and work ethic. Sadly it looks like his legs are starting to go which is why we are seeing a decline in his performances. Fantastic professional and he seems like a top bloke as well which is why I find it hard to stomach some of the over the top criticism towards him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aimaad22 4156 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Everyone's been down on form, him included. The fact he's had to play in different positions and roles to cover up the holes left by other players' absences have not helped. No doubt his legs are starting to go but I think once we have a semblance of our first team back together and some sort of momentum going we'll see him get better again. He's got plenty of offer us still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2204 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17239 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I'd like to ask what posistion Joans was playing last night?...didnt see the game.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 I'd like to ask what posistion Joans was playing last night?...didnt see the game.... I think he was meant to be playing as the right of the 3 behind Ba. It was however his usual sort of right midfield role where operates in front of the left back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17239 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I think he was meant to be playing as the right of the 3 behind Ba. It was however his usual sort of right midfield role where operates in front of the left back. So you're saying he ended up in front of Santon/Ferguson?.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 So you're saying he ended up in front of Santon/Ferguson?.... Just the same sort of role hes played all year imo. I think in fairness he knows the game is up which is why its usually the left back doing all the attacking. As Tooj says he has certainly been a great professional, but that shouldnt get in the way of discussing his performances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35059 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 His biggest asset has always been his ability to alleviate pressure due to his running with the ball, winning us free-kicks in dangerous areas and of course his fantastic engine and work ethic. Sadly it looks like his legs are starting to go which is why we are seeing a decline in his performances. Fantastic professional and he seems like a top bloke as well which is why I find it hard to stomach some of the over the top criticism towards him. Yeah, pretty much. Can't do him much good having to play virtually every game when he's fit coupled with what he puts into games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's difficult to reflect your true opinion when discussing something with CT. His arguments tend to get so extreme, so black and white, you inevitably look like you're arguing the opposite view, when you really just want to temper one of his flights of fancy. For example, most would agree Pardew has been found wanting a bit this season...but CT has to go overboard and tout the sack. There's no concetrns about Jonas being raised that weren't clear when he arrived. I think the points raised in the Jonas thread from 2008 are as valid now as they were then... http://www.toontastic.net/board/topic/21786-guti-for-me-is-an-enigma/ The effort he has continued to put in since then though, whatever shit was going down, has to be applauded. He's a reliable if limited pro. Well worthy of a place ahead of any other left wing options we currently have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 Hardly a ridiculous post when his form is one of the seasons talking points. Certainly within the ground and elsewhere on the net the majority seem to think he is now past it. Obviously if you just read views on here then you would be right in thinking he is one of our star performers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Manson 0 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Are his legs starting to go or are all the games catching up with him and he needs a rest? He'd be a big miss. I hope that when he ultimately can't play at Premiership level anymore then we can move him (and Colo) onto the coaching staff. You can tell they have a positive influence in the club that has seen us start up on the right track again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 35059 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's difficult to reflect your true opinion when discussing something with CT. His arguments tend to get so extreme, so black and white, you inevitably look like you're arguing the opposite view, when you really just want to temper one of his flights of fancy. For example, most would agree Pardew has been found wanting a bit this season...but CT has to go overboard and tout the sack. There's no concetrns about Jonas being raised that weren't clear when he arrived. I think the points raised in the Jonas thread from 2008 are as valid now as they were then... http://www.toontasti...e-is-an-enigma/ The effort he has continued to put in since then though, whatever shit was going down, has to be applauded. He's a reliable if limited pro. Well worthy of a place ahead of any other left wing options we currently have. Aye. Exactly the same as LBT tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammynb 3355 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 I'd would not be surprised if he's still carrying whatever injury allegedly was going to keep him out of the team until the new year. Some players are willing to go that extra yard for the team, even if their legs are failing beneath them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21912 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's difficult to reflect your true opinion when discussing something with CT. His arguments tend to get so extreme, so black and white, you inevitably look like you're arguing the opposite view, when you really just want to temper one of his flights of fancy. For example, most would agree Pardew has been found wanting a bit this season...but CT has to go overboard and tout the sack. There's no concetrns about Jonas being raised that weren't clear when he arrived. I think the points raised in the Jonas thread from 2008 are as valid now as they were then... http://www.toontasti...e-is-an-enigma/ The effort he has continued to put in since then though, whatever shit was going down, has to be applauded. He's a reliable if limited pro. Well worthy of a place ahead of any other left wing options we currently have. agreed. he's generally been a top performer for us since signing despite there being obvious limitations to his game in terms of crossing. it's all very well knocking him but at the moment we don't have anyone better in that position, and we look a poorer team when he's out of the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 It's difficult to reflect your true opinion when discussing something with CT. His arguments tend to get so extreme, so black and white, you inevitably look like you're arguing the opposite view, when you really just want to temper one of his flights of fancy. For example, most would agree Pardew has been found wanting a bit this season...but CT has to go overboard and tout the sack. There's no concetrns about Jonas being raised that weren't clear when he arrived. I think the points raised in the Jonas thread from 2008 are as valid now as they were then... http://www.toontasti...e-is-an-enigma/ The effort he has continued to put in since then though, whatever shit was going down, has to be applauded. He's a reliable if limited pro. Well worthy of a place ahead of any other left wing options we currently have. Dear me. I think I was the one very early in the season who was blaming Pardews formation / tactics for costing us points and that it would demoralise the team and injuries / europe would get the blame. It did. I haven't called for him to go, simply pointed out that if he didnt change, there would come a time where it would be inevitable. Change he has, however how much of that is down to his free will and how much has been caused by injuries / facing the chop is another matter. We will see. As for Jonas, I have only ever complained about his lack of end product. Not my type of player. However now, the other parts of his game that subsidised his poor end product seem to also have gone, hence a very simple topical question. The only over the top reaction seems to be from others, not myself, as usual I might add. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 17239 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 So, in January its now a right back, centre half, striker AND a midfielder who can run all day, play on both flanks and fill in at fullback now and then. Over to you Mike, am sure you won't let us down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monroe Transfer 0 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 Aw, someone wants attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4725 Posted December 4, 2012 Author Share Posted December 4, 2012 Aw, someone wants attention Not from you, stand down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 The only over the top reaction seems to be from others, not myself, as usual I might add. Asking if he's finished when he's played more than any other player this season except Santon? Despite his injury keeping him out of a few games. When he's 29 year old. Calm! Down! Lynn! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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