The En-ger-land Thread

[desmondTUTU 0]

Still good fun though. Making sly digs at England on an English football forum. What a twat.

[desmondTUTU 0]

They may well be

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3894]

Still good fun though. Making sly digs at England on an English football forum. What a twat.

And how long have you been a member on here?

[desmondTUTU 0]

And how long have you been a member on here?

 

 

My Dad's bigger than yours

[The Fish 10857]

 

 

My Dad's bigger than yours

 

Yet you still manage to accomodate him? I don't know whether to be impressed or appalled, cos I've heard KCG's Dad is packing a table leg

[desmondTUTU 0]

 

Yet you still manage to accomodate him? I don't know whether to be impressed or appalled, cos I've heard KCG's Dad is packing a table leg

 

You should know shouldn't you

[The Fish 10857]

 

You should know shouldn't you

That you get bum fucked by your Dad? Yeah I'd know, I had to listen to you cry & complain about it for fucking hours.

[Monkeys Fist 42459]

Your a jock sympathiser though aren't you.

 

And your going and getting all personal again, are you going to hit me with your keyboard?

"Plumbing" the depths there Desmond.

Business quiet in Warwickshire is it?

[desmondTUTU 0]

Allegedly they don't work on Sundays.

[Tooj 17]

http://www.thejournal.co.uk/sport/sport-opinion/mark-douglas-can-fa-stop-5849191

 

 

There was much to admire about the oratory delivered by Greg Dyke on Wednesday as he confronted the looming crisis about to flatten the England football team.

It was forthright, honest and didn’t shy away from the obvious problems that cling to the English game. And while his target of winning the World Cup by 2022 was subject to ridicule, it also made a refreshing change from Sir Trevor Brooking’s mealy-mouthed promise that his grass-roots changes might have an effect in a generation or two.

 

For all that his speech had me nodding my head in agreement, there was a part that had me arching my eyebrow. This would be the section where Newcastle and Sunderland were highlighted for their part in weakening the England team.

 

For clarity, we should recap exactly what he said. Halfway through his speech, Dyke explained the paucity of options available to the England manager with three examples.

Here, his words are reproduced exactly: “A second example, Sunderland have signed 14 players during the summer transfer window. They are made up of four Italians, three Frenchmen, one Swiss, one Czech, one American, one Greek, one Swede, one South Korean and a sole Englishman.

 

“In fact, in Sunderland’s first game of the season against Fulham there were only four players on the pitch at the start of the game who were actually qualified to play for England.

“Mind you, in the Newcastle team beaten 4-0 by Manchester City on that same opening weekend it was even worse – there was only one English player in their starting line-up.”

Unfortunately, these are the arguments of someone who has failed to delve deeper than the merest glance at the two club’s respective team-sheets. Next time he speaks, I hope Dyke has been set straight about the slow corroding of the North East’s relationship with the England football team – and exactly why English talent is failing to break through in this region.

 

For a start, both clubs had wanted to add English players to their squads over the summer. At Sunderland, Paolo Di Canio had Danny Rose and Tom Huddlestone – both in the England set-ups – on his hit-list but Tottenham did not want to sell their left-back to the Black Cats.

 

The reason for this was not because they worried that Sunderland’s cosmpolitan revolution might be harming the England team. Far from it: they now believe he is good enough to start games. Even so, they still signed Vlad Chiriches for £8.5m in the full knowledge that the

Romanian can play left-back when required.

 

So the problem here is not a foreign manager and owner prioritising Italian talent. It is a Premier League elite that can afford to stockpile English talent, thus preventing it from filtering through when it is not being utilised.

 

Newcastle’s summer scouting saw them look at English talent, too. They were quoted more than £10m for Tom Ince while another, richly-promising 17-year-old is being scouted extensively by the club.

 

When the lower-league owner spotted a Newcastle official at the club he quietly informed him not to bother taking their interest past the gentle enquiry that had been made. “We don’t need to sell him – and we won’t unless you pay well over the odds,” he chuckled.

 

Who’s to blame here? Not the selling club, surely. It is the prerogative of Blackpool and the League One club in question to demand a premium for their talent. But are Newcastle to be chided for not bringing in players when even the selling club admits they are charging over the odds?

 

Solving this poser is Dyke’s biggest challenge. A huge premium is placed on English talent that is just not there when it comes to shopping in France, Italy or Latin America. What does Dyke reasonably suppose the clubs do?

 

It would be nice for Dyke to challenge the mentality of young English players, too. There have been countless regional examples of rising stars getting far too big for their coloured boots after a sprinkling of first-team appearances.

 

Nile Ranger is the man who springs most instantly to mind but he is by no means alone. I know that there was a dressing down for James Tavernier when he celebrated his first professional contract by buying an expensive car. He is a decent player but his personalised numberplate was parked in a car-park at League One Shrewsbury Town at the start of this season.

 

Graham Carr is quoted in Nowhere Men – the wonderful new book by Michael Calvin about scouts – as praising the professionalism and application of the French players he has scouted. It is in stark contrast to the lifestyles led by some English players.

 

A final point for Dyke is the way the North East has been ignored by England. Fabio Capello didn’t bother to come to St James’ Park or the Stadium of Light once in his tenure – and consistently overlooked thenSunderland striker Darren Bent despite his prolific record.

 

Roy Hodgson had made noises about changing that but is yet to visit either. What does it say of the England set-up when they can’t even be bothered to pay lip service to such a fine footballing region?

 

I wish Dyke well in his gargantuan task. I also hope that he is willing to engage with the North East in the future, rather than just listing the problems we face.

[Kid Dynamite 7030]

Connor Whickham drives a white £170k ferrari fwiw

[desmondTUTU 0]

Connor Whickham drives a white £170k ferrari fwiw

 

No wonder some of them end up bankrupt. Disgraceful given the money they earn. May as well have Robert Maxwell advising them on finances.

[Kid Dynamite 7030]

Or maybe he should wait until he's scored more than one goal for Sunderland before he gives it the full P Diddy treatment

[Tooj 17]

 

 

Rooney’s time running short

Despite his talismanic status for England, Wayne Rooney has yet to make his mark on a World Cup. 2014 could be his last chance

Graeme Souness Published: 13 October 2013

AT THE 2010 World Cup in South Africa, Wayne Rooney might as well have stayed at home because he contributed next to nothing. In 2006, he was sent off in the quarter-final against Portugal when England needed him. He was suspended for the first two games of Euro 2012 after another silly red card.

Although he is closing in on the England scoring record, he has gone missing too often in big games to be regarded as an England great. Yet he can remedy that next summer by turning games in his country’s favour against the big teams — Spain, Germany, Brazil, Argentina and Italy.

And Brazil 2014 could be his last chance. He’s been around for a long time, playing at international level since he was 17. Although you can see him playing in the 2018 World Cup, he may be in a more withdrawn position by then. In the position he is playing now, this might be his last go at it. He will be desperate to get to another World Cup to prove himself after South Africa.

Playing well at a World Cup is not a prerequisite of greatness. Leo Messi has proved that by consistently excelling in the Champions League against the same defenders he would face in one, but it helps. Although Rooney has played well in qualifiers, it is not against the stiffest opposition. He’s a fabulously talented footballer and will go down as a Manchester United great but he needs to do well in a World Cup to achieve the same status with England.

He won’t do it by scoring goals against Moldova or Montenegro. I remember Malcolm Macdonald scoring five goals against Cyprus for England in the 1970s — but he only managed one more in his other 13 international appearances. There have been too many big games where Rooney has not turned up since emerging on the international scene at Euro 2004, nearly a decade ago, and he has to address that.
He is clearly England’s lead striker, but right now there is no candidate out there screaming to partner him. There’s nothing between Daniel Sturridge and Rooney or Danny Welbeck and Rooney, while Rickie Lambert offers a completely different option. The Southampton striker has scored twice in two games but at the highest level you must show you are much more than a target man.

It is their wide players who could transform England in an attacking sense. If Andros Townsend was to carry forward Friday night’s form and play like that consistently for England against the better teams, they would carry a hell of a threat, especially if Theo Walcott could do the same on the other flank. England would be transformed into a very different team if those two could be a constant threat with the ridiculous pace they both have. Townsend certainly enjoyed a good debut but we shouldn’t get carried away because this was England with the ball all the time. I have not seen how Townsend deals with play when he has to do a bit going back toward his own goal. He was good, but there are still large questions and stiffer tests ahead for him.

The Montenegro game was tailor-made for someone who looks to run and dribble at people. When you play well against a Germany or an Italy, teams who are tactically bright, that is when you can say you are a true international.
Yet Roy Hodgson picked the right man for Friday because it was a game they had to win and one where Townsend didn’t have to do anything other than get the ball and run forward.

I know Harry Redknapp likened Townsend to Arjen Robben last week but I wouldn’t compare him to anyone yet because he has done nothing in the game. He’s exciting to watch because he’s a dribbler and has fantastic pace but Robben, in the past two years, has become the ideal wide man because he can do all that yet is also very much aware, when his team don’t have the ball, of where he should be and what he has to do. Both he and Franck Ribery do both aspects for Bayern Munich and that’s what Townsend and Walcott have to become as wide players. If they can, they would give England something they have not had for years — a proper threat from the flanks. There have been no standout candidates there and if these two can become like Robben and Ribery what a difference it would make.
I expect England to close out qualification on Tuesday night against a Poland side with nothing to play for. Yet one interesting aspect will be observing how Gary Cahill and Phil Jagielka cope with Robert Lewandowski.

I suspect they are two good Premier League defenders who will be found out at the highest level and maybe Lewandowski can expose that. Yes, they will stand up and fight with anyone in a physical encounter, but that’s not Lewandowski’s only asset. He can be strong with someone because he has a physical presence, but he’s cute and clever and his technique is far better than anything Montenegro could offer on Friday.

When I have seen him play, he looks as if he’s a proper lad. He might come full of pride and passion because he is a top player, but most of the Poland players who turn up on Tuesday night will not have a lot of that. They will be looking at it as a game they have to play in before they get back to their clubs.

[The Fish 10857]

 

Rooney’s time running short

 

Despite his talismanic status for England, Wayne Rooney has yet to make his mark on a World Cup. 2014 could be his last chance

 

Graeme Souness Published: 13 October 2013

 

AT THE 2010 World Cup in South Africa, Wayne Rooney might as well have stayed at home because he contributed next to nothing. In 2006, he was sent off in the quarter-final against Portugal when England needed him. He was suspended for the first two games of Euro 2012 after another silly red card.

 

Although he is closing in on the England scoring record, he has gone missing too often in big games to be regarded as an England great. Yet he can remedy that next summer by turning games in his country’s favour against the big teams — Spain, Germany, Brazil, Argentina and Italy.

 

And Brazil 2014 could be his last chance. He’s been around for a long time, playing at international level since he was 17. Although you can see him playing in the 2018 World Cup, he may be in a more withdrawn position by then. In the position he is playing now, this might be his last go at it. He will be desperate to get to another World Cup to prove himself after South Africa.

 

Playing well at a World Cup is not a prerequisite of greatness. Leo Messi has proved that by consistently excelling in the Champions League against the same defenders he would face in one, but it helps. Although Rooney has played well in qualifiers, it is not against the stiffest opposition. He’s a fabulously talented footballer and will go down as a Manchester United great but he needs to do well in a World Cup to achieve the same status with England.

 

He won’t do it by scoring goals against Moldova or Montenegro. I remember Malcolm Macdonald scoring five goals against Cyprus for England in the 1970s — but he only managed one more in his other 13 international appearances. There have been too many big games where Rooney has not turned up since emerging on the international scene at Euro 2004, nearly a decade ago, and he has to address that.

He is clearly England’s lead striker, but right now there is no candidate out there screaming to partner him. There’s nothing between Daniel Sturridge and Rooney or Danny Welbeck and Rooney, while Rickie Lambert offers a completely different option. The Southampton striker has scored twice in two games but at the highest level you must show you are much more than a target man.

 

It is their wide players who could transform England in an attacking sense. If Andros Townsend was to carry forward Friday night’s form and play like that consistently for England against the better teams, they would carry a hell of a threat, especially if Theo Walcott could do the same on the other flank. England would be transformed into a very different team if those two could be a constant threat with the ridiculous pace they both have. Townsend certainly enjoyed a good debut but we shouldn’t get carried away because this was England with the ball all the time. I have not seen how Townsend deals with play when he has to do a bit going back toward his own goal. He was good, but there are still large questions and stiffer tests ahead for him.

 

The Montenegro game was tailor-made for someone who looks to run and dribble at people. When you play well against a Germany or an Italy, teams who are tactically bright, that is when you can say you are a true international.

Yet Roy Hodgson picked the right man for Friday because it was a game they had to win and one where Townsend didn’t have to do anything other than get the ball and run forward.

 

I know Harry Redknapp likened Townsend to Arjen Robben last week but I wouldn’t compare him to anyone yet because he has done nothing in the game. He’s exciting to watch because he’s a dribbler and has fantastic pace but Robben, in the past two years, has become the ideal wide man because he can do all that yet is also very much aware, when his team don’t have the ball, of where he should be and what he has to do. Both he and Franck Ribery do both aspects for Bayern Munich and that’s what Townsend and Walcott have to become as wide players. If they can, they would give England something they have not had for years — a proper threat from the flanks. There have been no standout candidates there and if these two can become like Robben and Ribery what a difference it would make.

I expect England to close out qualification on Tuesday night against a Poland side with nothing to play for. Yet one interesting aspect will be observing how Gary Cahill and Phil Jagielka cope with Robert Lewandowski.

 

I suspect they are two good Premier League defenders who will be found out at the highest level and maybe Lewandowski can expose that. Yes, they will stand up and fight with anyone in a physical encounter, but that’s not Lewandowski’s only asset. He can be strong with someone because he has a physical presence, but he’s cute and clever and his technique is far better than anything Montenegro could offer on Friday.

 

When I have seen him play, he looks as if he’s a proper lad. He might come full of pride and passion because he is a top player, but most of the Poland players who turn up on Tuesday night will not have a lot of that. They will be looking at it as a game they have to play in before they get back to their clubs.

 

@@Gemmill You swooning yet?

[trophyshy 7083]

This England game is actually enjoyable. Bizarre.

[desmondTUTU 0]

this a.townsend is something special

[Christmas Tree 4725]

This England game is actually enjoyable. Bizarre.

Aye, very enjoyable.

[JaMoUsE 0]

Welbeck and sturridge aren't clinical enough. We miss a proper number 9, too many number 10s

[ADP 0]

In Andros Townsend and Leighton Baines I have two England players I actually want to do well. They seem like they actually give a shit, refreshing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Still a bunch of divvies though

[Monroe Transfer 0]

this a.townsend is something special

 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves, he's looked decent for Spurs at times, and played well against two inferior nations in Montenegro and Poland.

[desmondTUTU 0]

i'm sure graham carr would agree

[desmondTUTU 0]

who do we fancy then, the overpaid english or the hard working poles?

[Dr Gloom 21924]

Joe Hart never has a good haircut

[desmondTUTU 0]

his hair is quite thick