Soldier killed

[aimaad22 4168]

We have a government that have been engaged in war for over a decade. Approaching twice as long as WW2. There is no exit strategy whatsoever in this war. No plan of defeating the enemy...or even any identification of the enemy, other than 'terror'. They have been remarkably succesful at keeping this war from our doorsteps.

 

When it does visit our shores we give our leaders an excuse to ignore it when we pass it off as religious fruit loops. There is a very real problem to be solved and we should pressure our governments to come up with solutions that will take our citizens out of harms way on the rare occasions they are attacked, but moreso our soldiers who face the danger much more regularly. We owe them that for their sacrifice which is greater than ours.

 

Well put. Just wish there were more people who understood this.

 

There is the world of difference between justifying something and trying to get to the roots of the problem. These arent just lunatics blowing themselves up for the heck of it, most of them have some very real grievances that we need to address.

[Renton 21746]

 

 

Well put. Just wish there were more people who understood this.

 

There is the world of difference between justifying something and trying to get to the roots of the problem. These arent just lunatics blowing themselves up for the heck of it, most of them have some very real grievances that we need to address.

 

Well it'll be interesting what the 'very real grievances' these two give for their sick actions. My guess is neither will have any real personal grievance at all.

[aimaad22 4168]

There's a lot of support here for the view that western/US actions has had grave consequences but I think ignoring the religious angle is a bit deluded as well.

 

No doubt, Im just saying its not the main reason. Injustice is, the fact that most of the people affected by this war have been left with nothing but the thought of some kind of revenge. Desperation. Its very difficult for you and me to understand, living in our comfortable homes. But a lot, a lot of innocent people have been brutally affected by this war and its been little more than politics to us. Was going to start blowing up in our faces sooner or later.

 

Almost 50,000 dead in my country already, and those are the official figures. Who can say how many more before the dust settles?

[aimaad22 4168]

Well it'll be interesting what the 'very real grievances' these two give for their sick actions. My guess is neither will have any real personal grievance at all.

 

There are no justification for it of course. Are there any justifications in war? Its all madness isnt it?

 

I hope those two get hanged for what they did. I also hope someday people like Bush and Blair get to answer for what they've put half the world through.

[SloopJohn 0]

There aren't half some thick fucks around.....

 

 

ha I know Josh Weller - he's a massive troll can't believe EDF fell for it

[Renton 21746]

Reports saying the one in the video was a devout christian until converting to Islam. I think you can read a lot into his motives from that.

[aimaad22 4168]

Reports saying the one in the video was a devout christian until converting to Islam. I think you can read a lot into his motives from that.

 

Horribly racist thing to say.

 

I wonder why this didnt cause such an uproar.

 

http://www.guardian....otivated-police

 

A 75-year-old man stabbed to death yards from his home may have been targeted in a racially motivated attack, according to police.

Mohammed Saleem, who used a walking stick, was stabbed three times in the back as he returned home from prayers at his local mosque in Small Heath, Birmingham, on Monday night.

The blows were struck with such violence they penetrated to the front of his body.

The father of seven also had no defensive wounds in what has been described as a swift, vicious and cowardly attack by the man leading the murder investigation, Detective Superintendent Mark Payne of West Midlands police.

Officers want to trace a white man, aged 25-32, of medium height and build, spotted on CCTV footage running near the scene of the attack around the time it happened, just before 10.30pm.

Police also want to trace a seven-seat people carrier captured on CCTV, driving near the mosque with the two male occupants, both white and in their 30s, who are considered "significant witnesses".

In an emotional family appeal on Thursday, two of Saleem's daughters, Shazia Khan, 45, and Nazia Maqsood, 44, called for the attackers to hand themselves in. They tearfully described their father as a "widely respected member of the community" and "much-loved".

Payne said the possibility it was a racially motivated attack was "a significant line of inquiry" and a large number of detectives were working on the case. "To the attacker I say we will find you and we will bring you to justice," he added.

Khan, who lives in London, said she believed it was "a premeditated brutal attack, pre-planned, intended to kill".

She said: "I cannot see him having any enemies being so full of hate to do this to him. He was an old man – that's what he was. He had no other agenda in his life, it's unacceptable and we just cannot believe an attack like this would happen to him. We just cannot understand it.

"We have to walk past where he was killed and we can visualise it – we have to live with that for the rest of our lives."

Describing her father, Khan said he had worked with youths at the mosque and "was a really good role model and had a great sense of humour, very tongue in cheek". She said people from all walks of life had been paying their condolences.

Khan also had a message for her father's killers: "We don't know who carried out the attack – all we can say is you will be caught and you will be punished and justice will be done, legally.

"I hope they come forward. I hope that anyone who knows this man [seen in Wyndcliffe Road] or the driver in the car, there may be mobile phone videos made of the killing – we don't know. If there's any information people are sharing, every little bit of information is vital that will help catch the killer.

"It is unusual for someone of that description to be in that area. It may not be linked, we don't know, but every avenue has to be covered. We have to all pull together and get justice for my father and anybody else, because this could happen again."

Edited May 23, 2013 by aimaad22

[Renton 21746]

 

 

Horribly racist thing to say.

 

I wonder why this didnt cause such an uproar.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/may/02/birmingham-murder-racially-motivated-police

 

Eh? How? First of all its got literally nothing to do with race. And secondly, I meant for me it suggests this was a religiously motivated killing rather than one borne out of geopolitical unrest or personal suffering.

 

Fuck off with the racist card.

[Howmanheyman 33404]

I've yet to hear a believable reason why our troops are in Afghanistan, however, as has been stated, these two cold blooded murderers do not come across as some desperate Iraqi/Afghan's fighting back after seeing a family wedding destroyed by a US bomber or a 'platoon' style massacre, they just come across as two thick as pig-shit disenfranchised Lahndan home boys who got into Islam.

 

Happy Face, we know the arguments and I'm pretty sympathetic to the idea that the US is basically an army state, (The whole country was founded on this iyam), however these two Goons apparently shouting an Islamic slogan with London accents tells me they're backing fellow Muslims and bringing religion into (someone elses) real grievances.

[Happy Face 29]

Eh? How? First of all its got literally nothing to do with race. And secondly, I meant for me it suggests this was a religiously motivated killing rather than one borne out of geopolitical unrest or personal suffering.

 

Fuck off with the racist card.

 

If they switched from Kenco to PG tips would it suggest a hot beverage motivated attack?

[Renton 21746]

 

 

If they switched from Kenco to PG tips would it suggest a hot beverage motivated attack?

 

Jesus wept. He really did.

[Howmanheyman 33404]

Jesus wept. He really did.

Maybe they killed the bloke as they hated being pressured into giving to charity and his 'help for heroes' t-shirt was the last straw and it had nothing whatsoever to do with their religion?

[aimaad22 4168]

Eh? How? First of all its got literally nothing to do with race. And secondly, I meant for me it suggests this was a religiously motivated killing rather than one borne out of geopolitical unrest or personal suffering.

 

Fuck off with the racist card.

 

Something becomes religiously motivated just because muslims are involved in it. Whereas anybody else does something crazy and its just unfortunate or a freak accident or something of that sort.

[Howmanheyman 33404]

Something becomes religiously motivated just because muslims are involved in it. Whereas anybody else does something crazy and its just unfortunate or a freak accident or something of that sort.

If they claim that Allah personally told them to do it then they're genuinely tapped. Otherwise I'd suggest they're Islamic extremists with possibly no connection to Afghanistan other than maybe having a smoke of some gear made out there once.

[Happy Face 29]

If they claim that Allah personally told them to do it then they're genuinely tapped.

 

Aye, like Bush.

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

[Dr Gloom 22023]

The identity of the suspect pictured carrying bloodied knives in the aftermath of the murder of a British soldier is Michael Olumide Adebolajo, Guardian sources have confirmed.

Adebolajo was an ordinary British schoolboy; born in Lambeth in December 1984, he grew up in Romford, travelled to school on the bus, played football and appeared to have a lot of friends.

His family – who are of Nigerian origin — were practising Christians, attending the local church. He has two siblings; a sister and a brother. Both boys went to Marshalls Park school, in the Harold Hill area of the town. At 16, Adebolajo moved to Havering sixth form college, and then at 18 attended Greenwich University, where he lived in student accommodation in 2004 and 2005.

Friends from Marshalls Park school talked of how he was an ordinary student who got the bus, played football, and "jacked" a few phones.

Speaking on social media, the friends expressed shock that the boy they went to school with was at the centre of a murder investigation after the events of Wednesday.

"We left year 2001," one said. "And he was always a good guy at school, do anything for anyone."

Another added: "They used to live … 2 minutes from marshals they had a garage on the side of the house an' [the brother] had a little telly an' that in there an' loads of people used to go round there; from what I remember they were nice boys."

A former neighbour of the family remembered them as friendly and welcoming churchgoers.

The man, who asked not to be named, said his wife used to give Adebolajo's mother – who he remembered as working for social services – a lift to church.

"They were very pleasant, a very ordinary normal family," he said.

But Graham Silverton, 63, who has lived in the street for 25 years, said neighbours had a particularly bad experience with Adebolajo when he was a teenager. He said one of the neighbours' children, a teenage girl, had gone to the Adebolajos' door to retrieve a ball kicked into their garden and was insulted and punched by Adebolajo.

The family lived in Romford until around 2004, when it is understood his parents divorced and they moved to Lincoln.

Police had sealed off Adebolajo's sister's home in Romford on Thursday and Metropolitan police officers travelled to Lincoln on Wednesday night to carry out searches at the family home in Saxilby.

Counter-terrorism officers and the security services are examining Adebolajo's links to the banned extremist group al-Muhajiroun. It is understood he was radicalised around 10 years ago, changing his name to Mujaahid, which means "one who engages in jihad".

Friends at his school said they knew nothing of his conversion to Islam.

The Guardian understands that both Adebolajo and the other suspect have featured in counter-terrorism investigations over the last eight years.

But it is understood that, while they were known to the police and security services, they were considered peripheral figures among the many extremists whose activities cross the radar of investigators.

Adebolajo was frequently seen in Woolwich handing out Islamist literature in the High Street.

Anjem Choudary, the former leader of al-Muhajiroun, has confirmed that he knew Adebolajo, who was pictured on video in the immediate aftermath of the horrific killing waving a cleaver with bloodied hands.

Choudary said Mujaahid had converted to Islam in 2003 and was a British-born Nigerian. He said he had attended meetings of al-Muhajiroun from around 2005-11, but stopped attending the meetings, and those its successor organisations, two years ago.

At the meetings he heard an interpretation of Islam preached by the group's founder, Omar Bakri Mohammed, which many Muslims would consider extreme.

Choudary said: "He was on our ideological wave-length."

He added that Adebolajo was very quiet and that Mohammed, now believed to be abroad, also remembered Adebolajo attending events held by the group.

Choudary said he was shocked by the attack, and that he believed Muslims in Britain were covered by a covenant of security, meaning that they should not wage violence here, in return for safety.

"I believe that this is not allowed for me to engage in. I would not encourage someone to do it," he said.

"I don't think it helps to condemn or condone. I condemn the hundreds of thousands slaughtered by British and American foreign policy."

Al-Muhajiroun was banned after the 7 July 2005 terrorist attacks on London, and it kept changing its name to beat the ban. The successor groups were also banned.

One of them, Islam4UK, threatened to target the military town of Royal Wootton Bassett for protests.

Bakri was banned from Britain in 2005 by the then home secretary, Charles Clarke, on the grounds that his presence in the country was "not conducive to the public good".

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/may/23/woolwich-attack-suspect-michael-adebolajo

[PaddockLad 17364]

al-Muhajiroun, founded by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anjem_Choudary

 

this is the bottom line for me, if its found that he played a part in radicalising these fuckers, does he become complicit leagally?

[CleeToonFan 1]

No offence aimaad, but you seem a rather intelligent fellow and at least coherent enough to access the Internet. Why the fuck do you believe in a ghost story?

[trophyshy 7083]

No offence aimaad, but you seem a rather intelligent fellow and at least coherent enough to access the Internet. Why the fuck do you believe in a ghost story?

 

No offence but you're a bit of a thicko and your beliefs are a fucking joke?

 

Not at all offensive, no. Almost a compliment really.

[StevenL 0]

Lee Rigby. Leaves behind a 2 year old kid.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22644857

[CleeToonFan 1]

Nope, saying the latter but not the former. Can't understand someone seriously believing in that contradictory shit in the modern age. But there's many people who are much more intelligent than I who have been indoctrinated, shows just how evil the Abrahamic religions are.

[essembeeofsunderland 811]

Its nowt to do with religion and never is.Its mans quest for power and if playing the religion card helps their quest for power,then use it they do.

[desmondTUTU 0]

Really?

[essembeeofsunderland 811]

Really

[aimaad22 4168]

No offence aimaad, but you seem a rather intelligent fellow and at least coherent enough to access the Internet. Why the fuck do you believe in a ghost story?

 

Its stares you right in the face. As far as Im concerned its a mystery to me how people cant see it.

 

Btw, 'coherent enough to access the internet' Very good. I dont take offence, I really dont. Way past that. Im just wondering though, do you talk like that way to all muslims? Or just people from developing countries if not muslims? Its a serious question, you know, if I ever get the chance to visit up there I should know what to expect from people.