How do Ashley's other business deals affect us?

[PaddockLad 17660]

only time will tell if MA and DL have truly learnt from the mistakes they made in the summer, im still trying to remain optimistic though

Been said on here before mate....the deals we got in January were mostly not available in the summer....if Ashley is to be supported in the way he's running the club we're all going to need a hell of a lot more patience than CT has displayed for most of this season.

[Christmas Tree 4831]

What would you have said at Christmas CT?

 

Why won't YOU answer the question?

[Christmas Tree 4831]

Been said on here before mate....the deals we got in January were mostly not available in the summer....if Ashley is to be supported in the way he's running the club we're all going to need a hell of a lot more patience than CT has displayed for most of this season.

 

I have plenty of patience with the way Ashley is running the club.

[Happy Face 29]

 

I have plenty of patience with the way Ashley is running the club.

 

Thought you wanted Pardew sacked.

[PaddockLad 17660]

I have plenty of patience with the way Ashley is running the club.

so demanding Pardew's sacking was a display of patience? Does your brass neck set the xray machines off at airports?....

Edited February 27, 2013 by PaddockLad

[Christmas Tree 4831]

You misunderstand dear chaps.

 

I have plenty of patience with the way Ashley is running the club.

 

Under that general direction of travel there will be employees and decisions that I do not agree with.

 

Unlike some idiots I won't blame him for every negative at the club whilst ignoring everything positive he has put in place.

 

I would still prefer a better manager but as I said at the time, Ashley is probably taking the right view in not replacing him and maintaining stability.

 

Paddock Lad again dodging a question.

 

 

[BigWalrus 0]

 

 

Double the debt we had then too.

 

I'd have to say no.

 

That's not true. Maybe in terms of the "debt" on the balance sheet, but the majority of it is essentially what Ashley paid for the club (albeit immediately after he paid Hall and Shepherd).

 

It's an interest free directors loan, with no real possibility of repayment being demanded.

 

This compares with a whopping Barclays loan secured on the stadium, costing the club a fair wedge in interest every year.

 

The club had net liabilities in 2009 and was therefore technically insolvent.

 

The club is absolutely in a better state now. It has cash in the bank for a start, as opposed to surviving on the upper limits of an expensive overdraft.

[Happy Face 29]

You misunderstand dear chaps.

 

I have plenty of patience with the way Ashley is running the club.

 

Under that general direction of travel there will be employees and decisions that I do not agree with.

 

Unlike some idiots I won't blame him for every negative at the club whilst ignoring everything positive he has put in place.

 

I would still prefer a better manager but as I said at the time, Ashley is probably taking the right view in not replacing him and maintaining stability.

 

Paddock Lad again dodging a question.

 

But the only things you have been able to credit him with are intangibles.

 

You "feel better about the players" I don't know how you've quantified that. Shay Given, Nobby Solano, Steven Taylor, James Milner, Scott Parker, Stephen carr....they were all very popular, or if not popular then full internationals with careers that have improved since leaving.

 

You like "the recruitment policy, the fact we have a plan, the long contracts,". But it's based almost entirely on the eye for talent of a bloke who is almost 70 as far as you're aware. Who is picking the policy up from Carr? Long contracts are great when they are for good players...not so great for players like Xisco, Smith and Ranger who have cost a pretty packet for no reward thanks to this "policy".

 

The feel around the club, etc. Yes, it's nice to have "French Day".

 

Average crowds are down (by about 2000)

Commercial income is down (half what it was)

The debts the club has are up (to £150m)

Turnover is what it was before (despite TV income doubling)

Our league position is the same

The wage bill is the same

 

A lot of that can be ignored as long as the team are doing well.

 

What constitutes "doing well" has changed. 5th was unacceptable. You're happy as a pig in shit from 13th. It got Glenn Roeder the sack the year before Ashley arrived.

[Christmas Tree 4831]

 

But the only things you have been able to credit him with are intangibles.

 

You "feel better about the players" I don't know how you've quantified that. Shay Given, Nobby Solano, Steven Taylor, James Milner, Scott Parker, Stephen carr....they were all very popular, or if not popular then full internationals with careers that have improved since leaving.

 

You like "the recruitment policy, the fact we have a plan, the long contracts,". But it's based almost entirely on the eye for talent of a bloke who is almost 70 as far as you're aware. Who is picking the policy up from Carr? Long contracts are great when they are for good players...not so great for players like Xisco, Smith and Ranger who have cost a pretty packet for no reward thanks to this "policy".

 

The feel around the club, etc. Yes, it's nice to have "French Day".

 

Average crowds are down (by about 2000)

Commercial income is down (half what it was)

The debts the club has are up (to £150m)

Turnover is what it was before (despite TV income doubling)

Our league position is the same

The wage bill is the same

 

A lot of that can be ignored as long as the team are doing well.

 

What constitutes "doing well" has changed. 5th was unacceptable. You're happy as a pig in shit from 13th. It got Glenn Roeder the sack the year before Ashley arrived.

 

Your desperation to win an argument is constantly clouding your judgement.

 

Xisco is something that happened at the start of his reign. Nobody is denying its been a bumpy ride or that there won't ever be mistakes, but if you honestly think the club was in a better all round state then than now, your mad

[Happy Face 29]

Your desperation to win an argument is constantly clouding your judgement.

 

Xisco is something that happened at the start of his reign. Nobody is denying its been a bumpy ride or that there won't ever be mistakes, but if you honestly think the club was in a better all round state then than now, your mad

 

The only way Mike Ashley has benefitted the club is the way Walrus says. We have an owner that can afford the level of debt he has accrued, wheras before we didn't.

 

If it were to be handed back to Shepherd in it's current state it would be MUCH worse off than 2007.

 

Don't think of the relegation season as how Ashley found us. We had finished 7th very recently. We were playing European games 3 months before the deal was finalised.

[PaddockLad 17660]

Paddock Lad again dodging a question.

 

 

I've said on numerous occasions that the direction of the club is good. I actually thing we should have sold a player in the summer, Ba or Cabaye etc to keep the money coming in and inmprove our transfer options. Thats our way ahead now and I dont have a problem with it. Will I give Ashley credit for it? no, his actions pre relegation and motives for buying the club in the first place are fuckin sickening. "Mike just wanted a plaything after his divorce" He can fuck off with that shit. I dont care how far down the line we are, I dont have a problem attending games, I find it easy to move on in life in general. But Ashley remains a fuckin cunt and always will do for me. For me its simple; its our club and we'll be here long after he fucks off.

[Dr Gloom 22155]

Ashley's still a cunt at the end of the day

[BigWalrus 0]

The only way Mike Ashley has benefitted the club is the way Walrus says. We have an owner that can afford the level of debt he has accrued, wheras before we didn't.

 

 

We were in a shocking state prior to Ashley arriving. We were losing cash hand over fist.

 

Turnover and gates don't matter at all if its all bleedung out in dividends and unnecessary "operating costs". Ashley's NUFC has a much neater balance sheet and a simpler business model.

 

The level of turnover being generated by Shepherd was good, but it was based on unsustainable spending.

 

The club was heading into administration under Shepherd, which would have all but guaranteed relegation.

[BigWalrus 0]

I don't think Ashley expects to be loved or liked. I would struggle to name five owners that are well liked.

 

Even Sir John Hall was a massive cunt - its pretty much a key attribute to be able to sleep at night in a role like that.

[Christmas Tree 4831]

I've said on numerous occasions that the direction of the club is good. I actually thing we should have sold a player in the summer, Ba or Cabaye etc to keep the money coming in and inmprove our transfer options. Thats our way ahead now and I dont have a problem with it. Will I give Ashley credit for it? no, his actions pre relegation and motives for buying the club in the first place are fuckin sickening. "Mike just wanted a plaything after his divorce" He can fuck off with that shit. I dont care how far down the line we are, I dont have a problem attending games, I find it easy to move on in life in general. But Ashley remains a fuckin cunt and always will do for me. For me its simple; its our club and we'll be here long after he fucks off.

 

So thats a yes.

[Christmas Tree 4831]

Ashley's still a cunt at the end of the day

 

We are not discussing his personal qualities, simply whether the club is in all round better shape now than it was in 2007.

[Dr Gloom 22155]

But we were relegated under Ashley. For all of the previous administration's faults, of which there were many, we were never in any danger of going down. Mid table mediocrity was the worst we could expect.

 

The club might run a tighter ship now but the the old spend beyond your means approach did result in better football and better finishes. Purely from a fan's perspective observing what happened on the pitch, they were better times.

 

That's not to say we can't emulate that again if Ashley learns from his mistakes. But it always feels one step forward, two steps back with him. January transfer window was excellent, just what we needed, but why not buy those players in the previous summer. And who's to say we won't have another holocaust of a summer transfer window again this year?

[Happy Face 29]

We were in a shocking state prior to Ashley arriving. We were losing cash hand over fist.

 

Turnover and gates don't matter at all if its all bleedung out in dividends and unnecessary "operating costs". Ashley's NUFC has a much neater balance sheet and a simpler business model.

 

The level of turnover being generated by Shepherd was good, but it was based on unsustainable spending.

 

The club was heading into administration under Shepherd, which would have all but guaranteed relegation.

 

We WERE relegated....under Ashley.

[Happy Face 29]

We are not discussing his personal qualities, simply whether the club is in all round better shape now than it was in 2007.

 

If we get past the last 16 of the Europa. Yes.

[Toonpack 9961]

The only way Mike Ashley has benefitted the club is the way Walrus says. We have an owner that can afford the level of debt he has accrued, wheras before we didn't.

 

If it were to be handed back to Shepherd in it's current state it would be MUCH worse off than 2007.

 

Don't think of the relegation season as how Ashley found us. We had finished 7th very recently. We were playing European games 3 months before the deal was finalised.

 

...................... and we were making considerable losses year on year (with no-one but the banks to rely on, to bail us out and despite £10 Mill a year more commercial revenue etc), the league position trend was steadily downwards. We were stiffed.

 

To even try and argue the "now" state of the club versus "then" is the same or worse, is preposterous.

[Toonpack 9961]

But we were relegated under Ashley. For all of the previous administration's faults, of which there were many, we were never in any danger of going down. Mid table mediocrity was the worst we could expect.

 

The club might run a tighter ship now but the the old spend beyond your means approach did result in better football and better finishes. Purely from a fan's perspective observing what happened on the pitch, they were better times.

 

That's not to say we can't emulate that again if Ashley learns from his mistakes. But it always feels one step forward, two steps back with him. January transfer window was excellent, just what we needed, but why not buy those players in the previous summer. And who's to say we won't have another holocaust of a summer transfer window again this year?

 

Check the trend since KK's first coming and then overlay that with the money running out and I strongly disagree mid table mediocrity was the worst we could expect, it was more likely the best !!

[PaddockLad 17660]

.

So thats a yes.

 

 

 

Thats also being consistant, in the true sense of the word. Inconsistancy is saying you're happy with how he's running the club, 2 months after demanding the sacking of the manager he'd just awarded an 8 year contract to. We misunderstand nothing about him or you. You were told the squad was weak as piss and last season contained a large slice of luck and nothing much was different. You said the manager was all to blame, which in turn was a criticsm of Ashley for persisting with him for a whole 3 months whilst things were a bit grim. Now you're trying to make those of us who correctly said it was the squad rather than the manager give Ashley credit for how he's running the club because results have improved after the squad was strengthened last month You're like a fuckin cock on a weather veign.

 

How in the mind of christ do you have the brass neck to say you're happy with Ashley after wanting his manager sacked no more than 2 months ago? Answer the question

[Happy Face 29]

...................... and we were making considerable losses year on year (with no-one but the banks to rely on, to bail us out and despite £10 Mill a year more commercial revenue etc), the league position trend was steadily downwards. We were stiffed.

 

To even try and argue the "now" state of the club versus "then" is the same or worse, is preposterous.

 

Reported losses in 2008 for the year previous were £20m. Ashley spent £25m bringing players in though.

 

Who is to say Shepherd would have done that?

 

We'd previously made a £20m loss in 2000...Shepherd had us breaking even again in 2003 & 2004.

[Dr Gloom 22155]

 

Check the trend since KK's first coming and then overlay that with the money running out and I strongly disagree mid table mediocrity was the worst we could expect, it was more likely the best !!

 

That's just a projection though innit. Who knows what would have happened if ashley hadn't taken over?

 

The facts remain though that we never finished lower than 14th under that mob. Ashley has already taken us down once.

[BigWalrus 0]

 

 

We WERE relegated....under Ashley.

 

I'm sure you know I'm aware of that!

 

Behind the scenes however, we were losing ridiculous amounts of money and were heading for certain administration. Barclays were weeks away from pulling the plug.

 

We are now operating profitably, without silly wages, with a stringent recruitment policy and without the burden of significant external debt. We are such a strong position, comparatively, its untrue.

 

The problem is that Ashley is a long term business strategist and is thinking long term. Fans are impatient and want results now.

 

Shepherd tried the strategy of trying for instant results by throwing money (that's borrowed money, not his own cash) at big signings. It was high risk, and it failed.