Europe --- In or Out

[Renton 21592]

38 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

This enduring notion of Soros being some kind of left-wing kingpin is absurd. Even if he is everything they say he is, he's one rich guy against many rich guys. At worst he's an isolated example of a Left wing version of people like Rees Mogg himself.

Not to mention he is a philanthropist, the utter cunt.

[Howmanheyman 33146]

On 03/10/2019 at 14:02, Rayvin said:

At the end of the day, they're doing what they have to do to save their party. That's all any of them care about anyway.

 

It's transparent - if the British public fall for it then they're a pack of fucking morons, but in the end there's only so long we can avoid asking them what they think.

The British public is largely made up of swathes of England who have, (with honourable exceptions), in my life done nothing but put hideous conservative governments into power bar the Blair years. Hard to be trusting of the little England cunts to do the right thing.

[RobinRobin 11262]

On 10/4/2019 at 21:54, Rayvin said:

Surely that's literally treason. Engaging a foreign power to undermine the strategic position of your own realm?

Trump does it all the time - so it should be fine for Boris

[Meenzer 15518]

 

[Rayvin 5217]

Rebel Tories now working against the opposition to seize control of daily business. Small win for Boris.

[ewerk 30569]

But aye, they’ll have no problem putting Corbyn into No.10.

[Rayvin 5217]

9 minutes ago, ewerk said:

But aye, they’ll have no problem putting Corbyn into No.10.

 

I don't think we're heading that way anyway. Feels to me more like we're going to run the gauntlet to October 31st.

[ewerk 30569]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/07/revealed-the-eus-point-by-point-rejection-of-johnsons-brexit-plan

But apart from that the deal looks like a real goer.

[ewerk 30569]

Worth reading: https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/10/how-number-10-view-the-state-of-the-negotiations/

[wykikitoon 20118]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49970267

Shocked................not

[ewerk 30569]

It's almost as if literally everything leavers have told us four the last four years has been utter nonsense.

[Meenzer 15518]

It's almost as if it was obvious all along that they were going to try and shift the blame onto the EU and hope the plebs are thick enough to buy it. Which they will be.  

[ewerk 30569]

And to illustrate my point:

On 10/3/2017 at 22:37, Christmas Tree said:

Once the money is agreed this will all fall into place very quickly. In fact I predict that buy Jan / Feb next year the negotiation atmosphere will have totally changed for the better.

 

uncertainty will subside, the economy will boom and you’ll wonder why we didn’t do this years ago.

On 10/4/2016 at 12:14, Christmas Tree said:

Of course this is where you start. Both sides setting out immovable positions.

 

There will be some compromises and a deal will be done.

 

Even at the worst case scenario we are talking about very low tarrifs on the majority of goods.

 

I honestly believe common sense will prevail from the Germans and French.

 

Let's not also forget the general travel of opinion on free movement. A lot more could change given forthcoming elections in Germany and France.

On 9/22/2016 at 11:03, Christmas Tree said:

They didn't get what they wanted on June 23rd.

 

I still think we'll pull off a cracking deal.

 

On 7/11/2016 at 13:11, Christmas Tree said:

Like we said all along. Germans don't want Tarrifs, neither do the French.

 

A deal will be done and I think a lot quicker than 2 years.

 

On 6/24/2016 at 18:50, Christmas Tree said:

Honestly, I'm fairly certain that our relationship with Europe over the coming weeks will get stronger and stronger leading to a deal within 12 months.

 

On 7/31/2019 at 15:43, Christmas Tree said:

 

You’ll thank me when the cracking deal is done, the trade deals are pouring in, North Shields fish market is returned to glory and the economy is booming. 

 

Enjoy your hols.

 

[Meenzer 15518]

Yeah but Cornish wine and pork pies. BELIEFE IN BRITAN

[Renton 21592]

Well this is great. Not only gunning for  no deal the large percentage of the country don't want, but now actively threatening EU countries (defence and security) if they vote to extend. 

 

I expect Johnson and Cummings et al. will massively ratchet up the jingoistic rhetoric so not only we end up with no deal, but we end up with a truly acrimonious split. Literally the worst outcome possible. Brilliant. 

[Rayvin 5217]

26 minutes ago, Renton said:

Well this is great. Not only gunning for  no deal the large percentage of the country don't want, but now actively threatening EU countries (defence and security) if they vote to extend. 

 

I expect Johnson and Cummings et al. will massively ratchet up the jingoistic rhetoric so not only we end up with no deal, but we end up with a truly acrimonious split. Literally the worst outcome possible. Brilliant. 

 

The EU are not reactionary, I think they can see Johnson for what he is.

[Gemmill 44814]

Tusk's tweet was pretty reactionary tbf. 

 

If they are going for no deal, and they end up getting it, it'll be the end of the Tories forever. All the dipshits that think they want no deal will sharp change their mind when they can't get diesel for their Volvo. 

 

I have to say though, I could not be less impressed with Swindon and Corbyn. Johnson should have been moved out of No. 10 long before now but for those two dickheads playing political games. 

[Rayvin 5217]

1 minute ago, Gemmill said:

Tusk's tweet was pretty reactionary tbf. 

 

If they are going for no deal, and they end up getting it, it'll be the end of the Tories forever. All the dipshits that think they want no deal will sharp change their mind when they can't get diesel for their Volvo. 

 

I have to say though, I could not be less impressed with Swindon and Corbyn. Johnson should have been moved out of No. 10 long before now but for those two dickheads playing political games. 

 

I still think the best outcome is for him not to be removed and for the Benn gambit to work out. It's a risk but is the ideal outcome.

[Gemmill 44814]

If you think no deal is going to be a genuine disaster, I fail to see how it's a risk worth taking. 

[Rayvin 5217]

Just now, Gemmill said:

If you think no deal is going to be a genuine disaster, I fail to see how it's a risk worth taking. 

 

Legally he has to get that extension though. And we're talking about No Deal now or later at this point. Removing him from power doesn't guarantee that we don't end up right back here with a hard right wing government off the back of "the people" feeling like their "will" has been frustrated.

 

Letting the Benn act play out means Johnson loses credibility with the electorate and potentially ends up strangled by the Brexit Party in any subsequent election. Taking him out now and replacing him with a GNU looks like a coup, and IMO is actually what he wants.

[Rayvin 5217]

It's also only really a risk because there's a chance Johnson could do something illegal. But Parliament still have a last minute revoke in their arsenal should they choose to use it.

[Renton 21592]

1 hour ago, Rayvin said:

 

The EU are not reactionary, I think they can see Johnson for what he is.

 

Naive I think. There is increasing enmity now between us and many EU states, not least France and Ireland. They have their own agendas. Don't expect the EU to come to the rescue when the proverbial hits the fan. 

 

Put it this way, since the day pig fucker announced this referendum, every single day the situation just gets worse. You think we are near the bottom yet? We haven't seen anything yet. This is just the beginning.

[Rayvin 5217]

5 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Naive I think. There is increasing enmity now between us and many EU states, not least France and Ireland. They have their own agendas. Don't expect the EU to come to the rescue when the proverbial hits the fan. 

 

Put it this way, since the day pig fucker announced this referendum, every single day the situation just gets worse. You think we are near the bottom yet? We haven't seen anything yet. This is just the beginning.

 

I think we might well be near the bottom depending on how things go from here. If the remain wing are playing this right then we end up at a second referendum and I genuinely think this whole fiasco gets knocked on the head, Britain does a bit of diplomatic courtship, and we move on. The EU isn't exactly unaware of why this has happened, or indeed blind to the fact that it's actually very much a "there but for the grace of god" situation.

 

The EU has reacted firmly, I believe, because it no longer suits their interests to pull punches on Johnson. But if we get to the point where another UK government is formed then I think the situation can be salvaged. No one wants a feud, and this has largely been a British fiasco that occasionally spills onto the EU's doorstep so far. Granted it won't remain that way if it goes through, but for now I don't think there is too much reason for us to believe that lasting damage has been done (in terms of relationships - in terms of global standing it's been a lasting damage from the word go).

Edited October 8, 2019 by Rayvin

[ewerk 30569]

 

[Rayvin 5217]

That is shameful. I'm absolutely embarrassed for this country.

 

Yet again.

Edited October 8, 2019 by Rayvin