Europe --- In or Out

[SpaceCadet 5]

7 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Oh, it sounds like you are a cunt. Well done. 

 

I was referring to the dipshits who were protesting austerity in their full figures and overpriced clobber.

[PaddockLad 17262]

1 hour ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

What the EU is to you and what it is to the majority of us are obviously two different things, otherwise the referendum would have gone your way.

 

Or, you're gullible, easily lead and your emotions on certain  issues are easy to manipulate. But hey ho, we're all different

 

 

[SpaceCadet 5]

2 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

Or, you're gullible, easily lead and your emotions on certain  issues are easy to manipulate. But hey ho, we're all different

 

 

 

We're all different, you're right. There is no collective. People had their individual reasons for voting leave and they had their individual reasons for voting remain. Ultimately the arguments for remain failed to convince people and lost but that's democracy, sometimes we get our way and sometimes we don't and when we don't we just have to suck it up as we're all adults.

[Rayvin 5223]

6 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

I was referring to the dipshits who were protesting austerity in their full figures and overpriced clobber.

 

Given that it was a lie, what is to stop anyone protesting it. Even the arch-capitalists are calling it a lie:

 

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2018/03/06/john-redwood-admits-it-there-never-was-a-reason-for-austerity/

[Alex 35083]

I won, you lost. Na, na, na, na, naa. Very adult.

[Rayvin 5223]

14 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

We're all different, you're right. There is no collective. People had their individual reasons for voting leave and they had their individual reasons for voting remain. Ultimately the arguments for remain failed to convince people and lost but that's democracy, sometimes we get our way and sometimes we don't and when we don't we just have to suck it up as we're all adults.

 

Out of interest, what in your view, is the appropriate response Remainers should be taking to a political action that has made the country unrecognisable for many of us, and which we fear will damage the standard of living for our children?

 

Pointless argument. This is an adult conversation and no one is throwing punches. We're entitled to think the people who voted out were ill-informed and no one on here doesn't understand the reasons for the vote or what people were thinking - we went through this in tremendous detail at the time. But take immigration as one point - say 25% of the people who voted out did so to curb immigration - I think it's over 30% actually but let's keep it conservative since it doesn't matter. We have David Davis here claiming that immigration could fall to almost zero in the weeks before the referendum:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/26/immigration-could-fall-to-almost-zero-if-uk-leaves-eu-says-david-davis

 

And then we have Amber Rudd saying that it won't actually change, months afterwards:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/feb/26/immigration-will-not-dramatically-fall-after-brexit-says-amber-rudd

 

So, the people who voted to curb immigration clearly aren't getting what they want, and immigration will continue as normal. Those people's reasons for voting out are now moot. 25-30% of the overall Brexit vote is enough to lose the referendum on. That's just one issue. The fact is, you can take every single 'reason' for voting out, demonstrate the fallacy of the argument, and take it apart - with the sole exception of sovereignty. And even then it's not going to be anywhere near the level of autonomy that people seemed to think they would get.

Edited April 19, 2018 by Rayvin

[Renton 21626]

11 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

the sole exception of sovereignty.

 

That's also not an issue. The government admitted we always had full sovereignty in their Brexit white paper.

 

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/brexit-white-paper-sovereignty_uk_5893457fe4b0302a153d4b6e

 

There's a very strong argument we will lose our influence if we get a norway type Brexit (a real possibility because of NI issue, which won't go away). Taking back control my arse. 

[Dr Gloom 21924]

1 hour ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

The austerity stuff was hilarious 

 

Terrific entertainment 

How do you work that out? 

 

[SpaceCadet 5]

20 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

Out of interest, what in your view, is the appropriate response Remainers should be taking

 

Not every remain supporter are the same so that isnt an easy question to answer, it would depend on the individual.

 

Those of Remain who are complaining about the decision which the British people have chosen I would say there are plenty of countries where democracy won't effect you in the slightest but I would not recommend a single one of them.

[SpaceCadet 5]

1 minute ago, Dr Gloom said:

How do you work that out? 

 

 

As I explained, full figured college kids in overpriced clobber complaining about austerity. I was watching and couldn't help but chuckle.

[Monkeys Fist 42449]

What a throbber. 

[Rayvin 5223]

2 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

Not every remain supporter are the same so that isnt an easy question to answer, it would depend on the individual.

 

Those of Remain who are complaining about the decision which the British people have chosen I would say there are plenty of countries where democracy won't effect you in the slightest but I would not recommend a single one of them.

 

I lived in China for a year and they seemed to get along just fine tbh. Democracy is grand farce in my view anyway since so many people don't understand what they're voting for, but I thought that before the referendum and have little interest in it generally. More interested in what is actually best for people. That said, I don't want to overturn the referendum result - I just want the government to come and tell people that they've been lying to them about what the benefits are and be honest about the reality. You know, as you might expect in an actual democracy.

 

 

[ewerk 30611]

7 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

As I explained, full figured college kids in overpriced clobber complaining about austerity. I was watching and couldn't help but chuckle.

So only those directly affected are allowed to complain?

[SpaceCadet 5]

2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

I lived in China for a year and they seemed to get along just fine tbh. Democracy is grand farce in my view anyway since so many people don't understand what they're voting for, but I thought that before the referendum and have little interest in it generally. More interested in what is actually best for people. That said, I don't want to overturn the referendum result - I just want the government to come and tell people that they've been lying to them about what the benefits are and be honest about the reality. You know, as you might expect in an actual democracy.

 

 

Congratulations on leaving China with your organs in tact.

[SpaceCadet 5]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

So only those directly affected are allowed to complain?

 

I would recommend that people stop blaming others such as politicians and immigrants and take their own steps to change their own lives.

 

I am responsible for nobody elses failuresor successes just as nobody else is responsible for my own.

[Alex 35083]

12 minutes ago, Monkeys Fist said:

What a throbber. 

[SpaceCadet 5]

57 minutes ago, Alex said:

I won, you lost. Na, na, na, na, naa. Very adult.

 

Yes, that is exactly what I've been saying. If I ever need a spokesman, yours will be the first CV I ask for.

[ewerk 30611]

2 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

I would recommend that people stop blaming others such as politicians and immigrants and take their own steps to change their own lives.

 

I am responsible for nobody elses failuresor successes just as nobody else is responsible for my own.

You sound like a right cunt.

[adios 717]

2 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

I would recommend that people stop blaming others such as politicians and immigrants and take their own steps to change their own lives.

 

I am responsible for nobody elses failuresor successes just as nobody else is responsible for my own.

It's called empathy fwiw.

[Rayvin 5223]

4 minutes ago, SpaceCadet said:

 

I would recommend that people stop blaming others such as politicians and immigrants and take their own steps to change their own lives.

 

I am responsible for nobody elses failuresor successes just as nobody else is responsible for my own.

 

I agree with this for me personally, as a middle class, well educated individual. But then I also see and work with many working class people who work solidly at their jobs, every bit as hard (or moreso) than me, and I know for a fact that they will never get as far in life as I could. There are class barriers to equality of opportunity, and we should all aim to change that. It's the only fair solution.

 

Why should feckless rich kids get an easy ride through life? Why shouldn't they have to be responsible for themselves?

Edited April 19, 2018 by Rayvin

[Alex 35083]

Just now, SpaceCadet said:

 

Yes, that is exactly what I've been saying. If I ever need a spokesman, yours will be the first CV I ask for.

I was paraphrasing but it's basically it. You can get back to trying out your stand up routine now

[Renton 21626]

4 minutes ago, adios said:

It's called empathy fwiw.

I called it first. 

 

The evidence from this board is the correlation between being a Brexiter and a cunt is 100%. Admittedly data is a bit scant. 

 

Edit: that was meant for the cunt comment.

Edited April 19, 2018 by Renton

[ewerk 30611]

I imagine he'll be seeing a private doctor and paying full whack for his valium seeing as he doesn't rely on anyone else and is in favour of tiny government.

[adios 717]

1 minute ago, Renton said:

I called it first. 

Like anyone reads your posts.   

[SpaceCadet 5]

1 minute ago, ewerk said:

I imagine he'll be seeing a private doctor and paying full whack for his valium seeing as he doesn't rely on anyone else and is in favour of tiny government.

 

I would usually pay for prescriptions but I'm currently on ESA.