Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 (edited) Trevor brooking was brought in to sort that sort of thing out 3 tournaments ago. Yet to see any difference "It is now a requirement for all Bundesliga and Bundesliga.2 clubs to have Youth Academies which meet certain criteria. In the top league, these academies must have development groups at all ages and a written development programme. In the 2008/2009 season, 91 players from academies in the Bundesliga and Bundesliga.2 managed to get on to the field for the first time. Professional clubs in Germany maintained over 270 youth teams with over 5,000 players and there are 121 national football centres in the country. As of 2007/2008, over €70m was being spent into Youth Development per year, that figure will have increased due to the thriving economy of the Bundesliga." We're about 3 decades behind. Edited June 25, 2012 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2204 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If there were decent English youngsters coming through grass roots football and the academies, maybe there wouldn't be so many foreigners in English football? The FA have got to take some blame for this, from what I've read they've neglected grassroots football for years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Cos they spend more time filling jobs that the feckless English cant be arsed to.? Cos they spend more time filling jobs that the feckless English cant be arsed to.? Ah aye, I'm sure they'd much rather be cleaning bogs in McDonalds than being paid £80000 a week to kick a ball about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTF 7295 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If there were decent English youngsters coming through grass roots football and the academies, maybe there wouldn't be so many foreigners in English football? The FA have got to take some blame for this, from what I've read they've neglected grassroots football for years I'd say they're starved for chances at the top levels which makes it very tough for them to develop fully. Big clubs buy them young and if they're not exceptionally talented at a very young age they're stuck in youth or reserve sides and eventually bugger off to a lower placed team a ruined prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7025 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Ah aye, I'm sure they'd much rather be cleaning bogs in McDonalds than being paid £80000 a week to kick a ball about. How do you propose we change it? Im not sure the governments immigration policy gives much thought to individual countries records of producing good footballers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21915 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 i wasn't surprised by the italian's superior technical ability on the ball or them being able to retain possession in a way the england team can only dream of. i was surprised by how unfit our lads looked compared to them. we seemed to run out of steam shortly into the second half - gerrard getting cramp at 60 odd minutes, rooney and parker looking like they were running through mud. i do kind of see what stevie's saying as this group of players never look so shite playing for their clubs but then they're all playing alongside better quality foreign players who know the value off ball retention. i think the big issue for the national team is the premier league - the most exciting to watch in the world with some of the globe's top players but it seems incompatible with a national football devlopment strategy. nothing will change as long as long as english players make up less than half of the top flight pool. at least we weren't over-hyped as usual this time. that made it more enjoyable when we put in some battling performances. and the lads seemed to care a bit more than in previous tournaments. some positives to take forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTF 7295 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 How do you propose we change it? Im not sure the governments immigration policy gives much thought to individual countries records of producing good footballers? Immigration skills Challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 (edited) How do you propose we change it? Im not sure the governments immigration policy gives much thought to individual countries records of producing good footballers? If the DFB were in charge here every talented Scot, Welsh, Irish, Jamaican, HK chinese, any former colonial African would be qualified for Eng. It's what the Germans have been doing quietly for a decade now. Meanwhile the FA fuck about at garden parties, building projects, sponsorhip deals with Mars and expensive promo videos about blind kids or summink... Edited June 25, 2012 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2204 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I'd say they're starved for chances at the top levels which makes it very tough for them to develop fully. Big clubs buy them young and if they're not exceptionally talented at a very young age they're stuck in youth or reserve sides and eventually bugger off to a lower placed team a ruined prospect. I think it's a complex mix of problems. There used to be a conveyor belt of kids coming through, it doesn't seem to happen anymore. I understand schools offer less sport to kids, playing pitches have been sold off and teachers don't want to teach PE in their spare time. Culturally there;s less support for sport and there's the rise of video games etc. Plus kids have skills coached out of them and the emphasis is on producing mediocre workhorses. This has been coming for a long time. What's the FA been doing about it? Sitting in committee rooms talking about building a national centre for football. Hopefully the penny's dropped now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 i wasn't surprised by the italian's superior technical ability on the ball or them being able to retain possession in a way the england team can only dream of. i was surprised by how unfit our lads looked compared to them. we seemed to run out of steam shortly into the second half - gerrard getting cramp at 60 odd minutes, rooney and parker looking like they were running through mud. i do kind of see what stevie's saying as this group of players never look so shite playing for their clubs but then they're all playing alongside better quality foreign players who know the value off ball retention. i think the big issue for the national team is the premier league - the most exciting to watch in the world with some of the globe's top players but it seems incompatible with a national football devlopment strategy. nothing will change as long as long as english players make up less than half of the top flight pool. at least we weren't over-hyped as usual this time. that made it more enjoyable when we put in some battling performances. and the lads seemed to care a bit more than in previous tournaments. some positives to take forward. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7025 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 If the DFB were in charge here every talented Scot, Welsh, Irish, Jamaican, HK chinese, any former colonial African would be qualified for Eng. It's what the Germans have been doing quietly for a decade now. Meanwhile the FA fuck about at garden parties, building projects, sponsorhip deals with Mars and expensive promo videos about blind kids or summink... Which would leave us with who? Gareth Bale is about the only one worth claiming. As I said, the number of foreigners in the country has nowt to do with it. Its what we are doing with the people we do have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 (edited) Which would leave us with who? Gareth Bale is about the only one worth claiming. As I said, the number of foreigners in the country has nowt to do with it. Its what we are doing with the people we do have So the whole premise of the German system is wrong? Looks like it.. I was involved with some marketing for the FA about a decade ago and in all honesty Lancaster Gate was like the House of Lords. Nobody it seemed had a clue about football in that place. True story. Edited June 25, 2012 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Look if we had the same amount of Cathy Burke's as have Pakistani's it would make a difference, it's not the amount of immigrants, it's the type of immigrants. If say 10% of the pop. is Pakistani in 15 years time, basically you're removing 10% of the population base as a football country. Instead of your predictably dour response, why has the vast Asian community in this country never produced a decent footballer? As you say, the argument that immigrants = bad team is no good as Germany accept more immigrants than most. In its State of World Population 2006 report, the United Nations Population Fund lists Germany with hosting the third-highest percentage of the main international migrants worldwide, about 5% or 10 million of all 191 million migrants The type of immigrants is interseting, Gomez being of German/Spanish descent was bound to make him a genetic God of European football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 How do you propose we change it? Im not sure the governments immigration policy gives much thought to individual countries records of producing good footballers? I have no idea. My question was why does a huge portion of the population contribute absolutely fuck all to our footballing potential? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I think it's a complex mix of problems. There used to be a conveyor belt of kids coming through, it doesn't seem to happen anymore. I understand schools offer less sport to kids, playing pitches have been sold off and teachers don't want to teach PE in their spare time. Culturally there;s less support for sport and there's the rise of video games etc. Plus kids have skills coached out of them and the emphasis is on producing mediocre workhorses. This has been coming for a long time. What's the FA been doing about it? Sitting in committee rooms talking about building a national centre for football. Hopefully the penny's dropped now. There's always the back up plan. Build another national center!!!!!!! These are just meaningless edifices and white elephants there is little interest in the grass roots and little thought or intelligence goes into it. It's all about branding now and money making. Germany are spending nearly a 100m a year now supporting youth football in Germany, Czech, Poland and any other fucking country they can hive players from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7025 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 So the whole premise of the German system is wrong? Looks like it.. I was involved with some marketing for the FA about a decade ago and in all honesty Lancaster Gate was like the House of Lords. Nobody it seemed had a clue about football in that place. True story. Please, enlighten me as to which foreigners with could have claimed as our own? Its nee use getting James McLean, kris boyd and rob earnshaw to sign up is it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 As you say, the argument that immigrants = bad team is no good as Germany accept more immigrants than most. In its State of World Population 2006 report, the United Nations Population Fund lists Germany with hosting the third-highest percentage of the main international migrants worldwide, about 5% or 10 million of all 191 million migrants The type of immigrants is interseting, Gomez being of German/Spanish descent was bound to make him a genetic God of European football. Big diff and I suspect the core of Stevie's point is that the Turks and Eastern Europeans that move to Germany love and play football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 (edited) Please, enlighten me as to which foreigners with could have claimed as our own? Its nee use getting James McLean, kris boyd and rob earnshaw to sign up is it We don't know cause we've made nil effort to do it. You can't say the soup is crap if you haven't even bought the ingredients. If we were germany there'd be training camps in all of our former colonies with quick fix passports for all 14-15 year olds. It's what GERMANY IS DOING. Can you get that into your head? Off the top of me head Arteta would have been beside Gerrard. Edited June 25, 2012 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTF 7295 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I think it's a complex mix of problems. There used to be a conveyor belt of kids coming through, it doesn't seem to happen anymore. I understand schools offer less sport to kids, playing pitches have been sold off and teachers don't want to teach PE in their spare time. Culturally there;s less support for sport and there's the rise of video games etc. Plus kids have skills coached out of them and the emphasis is on producing mediocre workhorses. Clubs want to buy the finished product instead of developing it themselves which takes away the chances at the top level. In terms of the league if there was a higher percentage of English players it would no longer be the best league in the world. At the same time the national side would improve as a result. It is a weak time in English football though, the core of the team is underperforming and past it. Is Wilshere the next big hope? Playing with who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 21915 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 as far as hodgson goes, we were organised and difficult to beat but he didn't do himself any favours with the squad he selected. lennon, adam johnson and carrick should have all made the squad ahead of downing, milner and henderson. there was also a complete lack of pressure on the ball last night. i lost count of the amoutn of times pirlo was able to collect the ball in space, turn and face no pressure at all. you expect an england side to be poorer than an italian side in terms of technique. but we usually make up for that by playing a high tempo pressing game. i think that's a better tactic than defending in your own penalty box. we were way too deep in every game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 I have no idea. My question was why does a huge portion of the population contribute absolutely fuck all to our footballing potential? Germany have mmore immigrants, more eu immigrants and more non-eu immigrants. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_Germany#Comparison_with_other_countries_from_European_Union They seem to cope with the higher numbers ok. I think it's an FA thing really. The FA are separate to, and have different interests from the Premier League. As long as that's the situation the national team will suffer from a lack of joined up thinking on what the structure of the game should be from grass roots through to top flight. Which should all be focused on British and immigrant players with the potential to represent the national team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Anyone would think Germany were amazing the way people are going on. They'll win fuck all, their club teams win fuck all and that's it. If they get to the final Spain will hump them anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 7025 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 And where are our former colonies? India, Australia? Veritable hot beds of footballling talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2204 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 There's always the back up plan. Build another national center!!!!!!! These are just meaningless edifices and white elephants there is little interest in the grass roots and little thought or intelligence goes into it. It's all about branding now and money making. Germany are spending nearly a 100m a year now supporting youth football in Germany, Czech, Poland and any other fucking country they can hive players from. When the conveyor belt's broken, it might be an idea to see about fixing it. The FA are a bunch of useless fuckers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted June 25, 2012 Share Posted June 25, 2012 Clubs want to buy the finished product instead of developing it themselves which takes away the chances at the top level. In terms of the league if there was a higher percentage of English players it would no longer be the best league in the world. At the same time the national side would improve as a result. It is a weak time in English football though, the core of the team is underperforming and past it. Is Wilshere the next big hope? Playing with who? The clubs got overidden by the German fa. Change was top down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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