***Official Mike Ashley Euro express thread***

[LeazesMag 0]

 

We are artificially supported now though in a different but still very real sense.

 

If we got a run in the CL we'd probably shoot right up again automatically on turnover (to what exact level I dont know). If Ashley managed that on a shoestring I doubt he'd be getting credit for it though from Leazes, even though Leazes is only arsed about turnover to begin with.

 

The uplift in turnover is only realistically available if you get in the CL from where we are now. What's being advocated now is spend more for the prospect of that. Ashley's not arsed to because he's already nuts deep to the tune of 100's millions of debt and 'financing' a CL push might not come off. His exposure is massive already whereas S&H's exposure was about a million.

 

Ashley's fortune is 'linked' to the club in a way Shepherd and Hall's never was. Ashley could still easily afford to do something now as his wealth is so great, but he's not going to because it's not worth the risk (to him). Turnover means fuck all to him because it could be massive and still cost him in real terms as long as theres more out than in and no external financing. For S&H when turnover is in the 10's of millions on a 1 million £ investment and theres lots of external financing you're laughing, frankly. If it fails, what the fuck have you lost?

Nah that's a good post. I will say although he did well for NUFC I always thought John Hall was a cunt. I mind when we signed Andy Cole every interview for weeks he mentioned he and Lady May were guarantors for the £1.75m transfer fee. So fuck! He got £80m out of the club.

 

Thing is it's not even said as a criticism of one lot or an exultation of the other, it's just highlighting a very different set of factors. And yet despite all that, and the cerebral talk of high finance, the main factor is still (and all it boils down to for me) that Ashley isn't a fan. ie it doesn't make his cock twitch enough. Shepherd on the other hand was a fan, I'm sure of that. That said would he have been fan enough to put 100's of millions of his own tax paid savings on the line for the thrill of a Champions League run now? My guess is not in a million years.

 

In a sense it's a bit like the criticism of the bankers now. Like it or not Ashley is a real capitalist whereas Shepherd and Hall for a £1 million investment are more akin to the bankers/ phoney capitalists because of the limit of their exposure. That's going too far and is overly harsh on S&H because the bankers dont risk a penny of their own money, whereas S&H did but it still serves to demonstrate how much more cavalier people are happy to be with risk when your level of exposure doesnt keep you awake at night.

 

That's why it's a completely pointless debate for me.

 

you're getting warmer.

 

About time too.

[LeazesMag 0]

Well, whether we like it or not, the media are now focussing on the race for fourth and due to our excellent position we are being included in the clubs chasing fourth.

 

The table doesnt lie and we are currently 5th, 3 points off Champions League qualification. Come Sunday evening we could well be joint fourth with 14 games left!

 

Now I know some will want to stick their heads in the sand and not contemplate its possibility, but we are still hanging in give injuries, suspensions and missing ANC players.

 

Unless we have a sudden crash of form, we are going to remain within touching distance all the way to the end.

 

As we have played some crap football and still achieved results, a crash of form would have to be pretty spectactular.

 

And lets consider our competitors. Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are not the untouchable forces they have been previously.

 

And we face these last 15 games with a new striker.

 

Pretty exciting run in for quite a while.

 

I'm with you CT. We've come this far and there is no reason it can't continue. We'd have to perform very very well in the run in but its not impossible.

 

except that the owner won't attempt to make the final jump and continue the selling and cheaper replacement policy.

 

So it will NEVER happen.

 

You will see.

[LeazesMag 0]

I'm just enjoying the ride for what it is.

 

We may not get anywheres but it's been one of the most enjoyable seasons i've experienced for some time.

 

short term-ism

[The Fish 10972]

Well, whether we like it or not, the media are now focussing on the race for fourth and due to our excellent position we are being included in the clubs chasing fourth.

 

The table doesnt lie and we are currently 5th, 3 points off Champions League qualification. Come Sunday evening we could well be joint fourth with 14 games left!

 

Now I know some will want to stick their heads in the sand and not contemplate its possibility, but we are still hanging in give injuries, suspensions and missing ANC players.

 

Unless we have a sudden crash of form, we are going to remain within touching distance all the way to the end.

 

As we have played some crap football and still achieved results, a crash of form would have to be pretty spectactular.

 

And lets consider our competitors. Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are not the untouchable forces they have been previously.

 

And we face these last 15 games with a new striker.

 

Pretty exciting run in for quite a while.

 

I'm with you CT. We've come this far and there is no reason it can't continue. We'd have to perform very very well in the run in but its not impossible.

 

except that the owner won't attempt to make the final jump and continue the selling and cheaper replacement policy.

 

So it will NEVER happen.

 

You will see.

I don't disagree, but it seems we've a genuine chance of finishing 7th, despite Ashley's reticence to spend. Is it not possible (I agree it's not probable) that with Carr unearthing players that Ashley will spend money on, we could very well make a decent push of the CL spots?

[trophyshy 7084]

I'm just enjoying the ride for what it is.

 

We may not get anywheres but it's been one of the most enjoyable seasons i've experienced for some time.

 

short term-ism

 

Enjoying being a fan with fuck all say in the running of the club-ism.

[LeazesMag 0]

I'm with you CT. We've come this far and there is no reason it can't continue. We'd have to perform very very well in the run in but its not impossible.

 

except that the owner won't attempt to make the final jump and continue the selling and cheaper replacement policy.

 

So it will NEVER happen.

 

You will see.

I don't disagree, but it seems we've a genuine chance of finishing 7th, despite Ashley's reticence to spend. Is it not possible (I agree it's not probable) that with Carr unearthing players that Ashley will spend money on, we could very well make a decent push of the CL spots?

 

have you noticed the many liars that have been posting lately ?

 

Thought not.

 

edit.

 

Credit where its due for an attempt at a reasonable post. Carr will not stike lucky all the time like this, its impossible. Even Peter Taylor and Brian Clough couldn't do it forever and they were the masters, and even they ended up having to bust transfer records to go the whole distance. Besides, NUFC are a completely different profile to Forest and Derby, while NUFC supporters put their anti-Shepherd hat on and pretend they hate these "trophy signings", the reality is that its a big profile footballing city and the club thrives on them, as do most of the big clubs who have the biggest resources.

Edited February 3, 2012 by LeazesMag

[LeazesMag 0]

I'm just enjoying the ride for what it is.

 

We may not get anywheres but it's been one of the most enjoyable seasons i've experienced for some time.

 

short term-ism

 

Enjoying being a fan with fuck all say in the running of the club-ism.

 

of course, but its short term-ism all the same. Nowt wrong with looking at the long term prospects of the setup as it stands.

[The Fish 10972]

have you noticed the many liars that have been posting lately ?

 

Thought not.

 

To be honest, while you've been rattling your sabre a fair bit today, you've yet to rely on your normal lies to get by so I've got to give you that.

[Davey Dave 0]

I'm just enjoying the ride for what it is.

 

We may not get anywheres but it's been one of the most enjoyable seasons i've experienced for some time.

 

short term-ism

 

Who asked you?

[trophyshy 7084]

 

of course, but its short term-ism all the same. Nowt wrong with looking at the long term prospects of the setup as it stands.

 

No, nothing wrong with perpetually analysing it to death, but what can you or I or the others do about it?

[Park Life 71]

I predicted 7th at the start and truth be told I'd be a little dissapointed with that now.

Where and when? Deano prediccted 7th, i predicted 8th, dont remember you on the bandwagon of positivity last summer.

 

Can't find the one on here, might have been a HF thread..

 

But on the other forum I agreed 7th was possible..

 

 

Parky

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Re: The Battle for 7th

 

« Reply #141 on: Sunday 25 September 2011, 09:48:59 AM »

 

 

 

Quote from: Dr Venkman on Sunday 25 September 2011, 09:34:52 AM

With a bit of defensive cover and a top class striker we'd be shoe ins for 7th given our form so far. Bit of a shame,if defensive injuries hit we'll nose dive

 

 

Agreed.

 

Think the league is quite tame outside the top 3/4.

 

 

http://www.newcastle...,89764.125.html

Edited February 3, 2012 by Park Life

[Park Life 71]

We have 8 or 9 possibly 10 players good enough to play in the CL, either because they've played there already, qualified for it or their form is objectively good enough (e.g. Krul).

 

I really think it's about 6/7 mate. If you're talking CL proper.

 

To sustain a top 4 challege is really difficult as even Arsenal and Liv are finding and they have better squads/ we have 3 standout players who I'd rather have than theirs. Tiote, Ba and Collo. Then there is Santon and Hatem who once they play half a season or so solidly would also be good CL material...Neither has played much recently. Ideally they would come through as well of course.

 

Look, Kranjar, Bassong and that right back (who'd all get into our side) can't even get into the Spurs first 11 and I think they're got about 12-13 true PL/CL players. They are a couple of seasons ahead of us.

 

Think if we keep this side together and add in the summer then of course the picture changes. My gut feeling is that we aren't a million miles behind Liv and the spendthrift Wenger...I started a thead on the latters demise a couple of years ago if my positivity is being questioned It's in the GOLD SECTION ON NO.

Edited February 3, 2012 by Park Life

[JawD 99]

of course, but its short term-ism all the same. Nowt wrong with looking at the long term prospects of the setup as it stands.

 

No, nothing wrong with perpetually analysing it to death, but what can you or I or the others do about it?

 

Indeed. I enjoy football, or I try to. Why know its more than just a game, it tribal. Way I see it is that you have those like LM who can see the doom and history repeating, the potential collapse around the corner. Sure we might win a game, but we might lose the next 5. Sure we sign what might be a decent forward, but we might sell three players next season and so on. Or you have those like I think most of us here where who knows what will happen next season, who gives a fuck about last season let alone 5 seasons ago. They are gone now. Sure we might sell Colo, Tiote or Ba. But, fact is they are here now. We are in 5th at the moment. So I dont watch a game and worry about next week. Surely you have to enjoy the moment (without getting all poetic about it).

 

If you were given 1 year to live. Would you enjoy the time you had left, or sit at home moping because you knew it was coming to an end?

[Park Life 71]

The facts are that both Chelsea and ManC couldn't sutain themselves without oil money. Chelsea and ManC are running at loses of 100's millions a season. As recently as 2 years ago Abramovich had to lend them 200m (as a loan) to keep up their challenge.

[toonotl 3116]

Well, whether we like it or not, the media are now focussing on the race for fourth and due to our excellent position we are being included in the clubs chasing fourth.

 

The table doesnt lie and we are currently 5th, 3 points off Champions League qualification. Come Sunday evening we could well be joint fourth with 14 games left!

 

Now I know some will want to stick their heads in the sand and not contemplate its possibility, but we are still hanging in give injuries, suspensions and missing ANC players.

 

Unless we have a sudden crash of form, we are going to remain within touching distance all the way to the end.

 

As we have played some crap football and still achieved results, a crash of form would have to be pretty spectactular.

 

And lets consider our competitors. Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are not the untouchable forces they have been previously.

 

And we face these last 15 games with a new striker.

 

Pretty exciting run in for quite a while.

 

I'm with you CT. We've come this far and there is no reason it can't continue. We'd have to perform very very well in the run in but its not impossible.

 

except that the owner won't attempt to make the final jump and continue the selling and cheaper replacement policy.

 

So it will NEVER happen.

 

You will see.

 

What does selling players have to do with anything now?

[Baggio 0]

Played 24 Points 43

 

That was the first time I've seen Cisse yesterday apart from highlights and he looks like a player made for the Premiership, he's got pace, great control and his movement in the final third was excellent.

 

A really impressive debut.

 

I also had a look at our remaining fixtures for the season the other day and without putting too optimistic scores I had us finishing on 57 points, that was including giving us a draw yesterday.

 

W5

D3

L7

 

Now a quick scan back through league tables over the past decade show some clubs having 70 points to get into the top 4, but there were a few occasions where 60 and 61 points were enough, now I'm not going to get my hopes up but with seeing what Cisse can do, Cabaye and Tiote to return and none of the other clubs that are expected to be challenging for 4th showing any sort of consistency then maybe we can still dream.

[Guest alex]

Think the games against Chelsea away, Liverpool at home and Arsenal away will be big factors on whether we can somehow come 4th. Can't see it like but if we don't lose any of those 3 we'll have a chance. All about players staying fit really. A better side than Villa would be too strong for Perch and Guthrie in the middle.

[Baggio 0]

Think the games against Chelsea away, Liverpool at home and Arsenal away will be big factors on whether we can somehow come 4th. Can't see it like but if we don't lose any of those 3 we'll have a chance. All about players staying fit really. A better side than Villa would be too strong for Perch and Guthrie in the middle.

 

I agree with Perch but I honestly don't think we would suffer too much if we had to go with Tiote and Guthrie in the middle, it just seems to have really clicked for the lad this season and saying we wouldn't miss Cabaye if he had to fill in as about the highest compliment I can give him.

 

I was reading an interview with Pardew in the week and he was talking about us playing the 4-3-3 due to the lack of holding man while Tiote was away, it seems crazy that we went so long without a quality DM yet now we've got one we've got no sort of capable understudy for what you would think would be a low cost position to fill, someone to do a similar job like Acuna did for us under Sir Bobby.

[LeazesMag 0]

I'm just enjoying the ride for what it is.

 

We may not get anywheres but it's been one of the most enjoyable seasons i've experienced for some time.

 

short term-ism

 

Who asked you?

 

who asked you ?

[Guest alex]

Think the games against Chelsea away, Liverpool at home and Arsenal away will be big factors on whether we can somehow come 4th. Can't see it like but if we don't lose any of those 3 we'll have a chance. All about players staying fit really. A better side than Villa would be too strong for Perch and Guthrie in the middle.

 

I agree with Perch but I honestly don't think we would suffer too much if we had to go with Tiote and Guthrie in the middle, it just seems to have really clicked for the lad this season and saying we wouldn't miss Cabaye if he had to fill in as about the highest compliment I can give him.

 

I was reading an interview with Pardew in the week and he was talking about us playing the 4-3-3 due to the lack of holding man while Tiote was away, it seems crazy that we went so long without a quality DM yet now we've got one we've got no sort of capable understudy for what you would think would be a low cost position to fill, someone to do a similar job like Acuna did for us under Sir Bobby.

I agree. It wasn't a dig at Guthrie who I've stuck up for in the past. Thought he was excellent yesterday especially seeing as he took on so much responsibility (even taking the set-pieces after Taylor went off) due to Perch's limitations.

[trophyshy 7084]

who asked you ?

 

What do you think of our new striker Leazes?

[Baggio 0]

I agree. It wasn't a dig at Guthrie who I've stuck up for in the past. Thought he was excellent yesterday especially seeing as he took on so much responsibility (even taking the set-pieces after Taylor went off) due to Perch's limitations.

 

If Guthrie was some unknown that we had signed from France in the summer I think people would be raving about the lad, the thing is where he's been here a few years and we've seen him put in some shocking performances and look like a passenger sometimes he doesn't get the credit he deserves.

 

I'm not sure if he's lost weight but his fitness seems to be a lot better and he seems to be dominating the midfield more now rather than being on the edge of the game with his sleeves down over his hands like a young kid who's new to men's football.

[Guest alex]

I agree. It wasn't a dig at Guthrie who I've stuck up for in the past. Thought he was excellent yesterday especially seeing as he took on so much responsibility (even taking the set-pieces after Taylor went off) due to Perch's limitations.

 

If Guthrie was some unknown that we had signed from France in the summer I think people would be raving about the lad, the thing is where he's been here a few years and we've seen him put in some shocking performances and look like a passenger sometimes he doesn't get the credit he deserves.

 

I'm not sure if he's lost weight but his fitness seems to be a lot better and he seems to be dominating the midfield more now rather than being on the edge of the game with his sleeves down over his hands like a young kid who's new to men's football.

I think he's definitely fitter this season. I think he's realised he needs to look after himself since he's a good 'footballer' but without a great engine (i.e. natural fitness) so he needs to be in peak condition to compete with other CMs in the Premier League. I think he was messed about a lot in the past too though as he's never a wide player. Thought a big part of our successful Championship season was Smith getting injured and him going alongside Nolan in the middle. Nolan got a new lease of life. Obviously the January signings helped too.

[Dr Gloom 22186]

The more weeks that go by and we remain where we are, the less ridiculous this thread looks. Talk of 4th is still a pipe dream but I'd be a little disappointed if we didn't finish top 6 now as we've been up there all season. You've got to be able to dream as a football fan. Otherwise what's the point?

[LeazesMag 0]

who asked you ?

 

What do you think of our new striker Leazes?

 

isn't it a shame that we haven't spent the rest of the Carroll money on a couple more players like that - or even kept Enrique for instance ? This isn't rocket science mate. Is it ?

 

Do you seriously not understand this ?

 

You know and I know, and everybody knows, our best players will be gone when acceptable bids come in for them, and more money will disappear.

 

Can anybody tell me how you can be a progressive club aiming to challenge where NUFC ought to be, and behave like this ?

 

Somehow, I think one or two of the younger element wil just hurl abuse at me, and one or two of the stupid element will actually believe such a thing is possible despite every successful football club there has ever been, has done this by backing their managers.

 

How many more times do people need to have this explained ?

 

At the moment we are doing very well because of a good manager making the most of having his hands tied behind his back, we had occasional good runs under McKeag, Seymour etc too but it was thrown away through not attempting to go further and the same will happen again, the attitude stands out a mile, it is obvious and has been obvious for years.