Monkeys Fist 41318 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Those men and women made the same sacrifice, even for a manifestly unjust cause, and their descendants - members of an open and tolerant society - should be able to honour their fallen relatives without shame. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! True though. The German army was largely made up of conscripts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I'm not massively fussed about this purely on the basis that it's a recent phenomenon. ie the debate's only come about because we've now started embroidering poppies on shirts, which we never used to do. If it had been some sort of retrospective attack by FIFA on a longstanding tradition then it'd warrant a Daily Mail shitstorm but it's not. The poppy has never traditionally been an item for sportswear, but more a symbol for quiet reflection and is synonymous with minutes silences rather than blood and thunder sliding tackles. Players have worn it (and can no doubt continue to wear it) before and after matches so the tradition in as much as it applies to football wont have changed at all. Â Having said that I'd be equally comfortable with the FA taking the view that Alex expresses, ie fuck them and wear it anyway if it feels that important. I'm just not so sure it is on a personal level. That's said from someone who has a very deep respect for those commemorated by the poppy btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeys Fist 41318 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I personally think an impeccably observed minute's silence is a much more powerful act of remembrance than an embroidered poppy on the shirt would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I personally think an impeccably observed minute's silence is a much more powerful act of remembrance than an embroidered poppy on the shirt would be. Â Incredibly powerful tbh when a raucous crowd just falls completely silent for a minute. Especially when it's a game that really matters and both sides (players and fans) are essentially about to 'go to war' (in a manner of speaking) but it gets put into the correct context by that brief shared moment before the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Those men and women made the same sacrifice, even for a manifestly unjust cause, and their descendants - members of an open and tolerant society - should be able to honour their fallen relatives without shame. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! True though. The German army was largely made up of conscripts. Not sure where you've read that, I know they made up a significant proportion but at least 6m GERMAN military died in WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeys Fist 41318 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) Those men and women made the same sacrifice, even for a manifestly unjust cause, and their descendants - members of an open and tolerant society - should be able to honour their fallen relatives without shame. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! True though. The German army was largely made up of conscripts. Not sure where you've read that, I know they made up a significant proportion but at least 6m GERMAN military died in WW2. Hitler re-introduced conscription in 1935, which had previously been banned in Germany under the Treaty of Versailles. The figure of 6million includes casualties as well as fatalities, nearly 75% of which occured on the Eastern Front in the final two years of the War. Â Edit; btw, I'm not saying that every German soldier was innocent of Nazi beliefs, certainly the Officers were actively encouraged to be Party members, just pointing out that a large number of the men who served and died for Germany had little choice in the matter. Edited November 9, 2011 by Monkeys Fist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 They had bairns fighting for them by the end of the war ffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayatollah Hermione 13590 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Also conscription was basically sold as "Join the army and help us make this nation great again" with no real indication that the Nazi party was as sinister as it eventually became. The foreign volunteers who signed up later were probably wronguns like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6579 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 FA statement: Remembrance Day  The FA would like to clarify that the organisation and England players at all levels will be showing their respect and marking Remembrance Day in a number of ways.  We have been working closely with the Royal British Legion who have welcomed our support. We can confirm that: The England players will wear black armbands during the Spain game on Saturday The FA will place a poppy wreath on the pitch during the national anthems There will be a one-minute silence ahead of kick-off Players will wear training tops with embroidered poppies on match day Players will wear poppy-embossed anthem jackets during the national anthems Military representatives will be in the presentation party prior to kick-off The FA has donated 500 England v Spain tickets to 'Tickets for Troops', for members of the armed forces, and 1,000 tickets for the England v Sweden game on Tuesday (this is standard FA policy for Wembley matches) The England senior squad will train at Wembley on Friday ahead of the Spain game. They will observe the two-minute silence at 11am, all wearing training tops embossed with poppies. This session will be broadcast live The training tops embossed with poppies will be passed onto forces' charities post-match as auction items for fund raising The poppy will be visible around Wembley on Saturday, on the scoreboards and advertising boards, and poppy sellers will be in the stadium to allow supporters to donate to the poppy fund and show their support On Thursday, England Under-21s play Iceland in Colchester and England U19s play Denmark in Brighton. All players and staff will be wearing poppies pre- and post-match Both the Under-21s and U19s will observe a one-minute silence, too, at their games - the Under-21s will do so alongside troops from Colchester barracks Source: http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/NewsAndFeatures/2011/Remembrance-Day-2011  In short, the FA are doing everything possible to display the poppy except wear it on the shirt. Up yours Blatter.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 FA statement: Remembrance Day  The FA would like to clarify that the organisation and England players at all levels will be showing their respect and marking Remembrance Day in a number of ways.  We have been working closely with the Royal British Legion who have welcomed our support. We can confirm that: The England players will wear black armbands during the Spain game on Saturday The FA will place a poppy wreath on the pitch during the national anthems There will be a one-minute silence ahead of kick-off Players will wear training tops with embroidered poppies on match day Players will wear poppy-embossed anthem jackets during the national anthems Military representatives will be in the presentation party prior to kick-off The FA has donated 500 England v Spain tickets to 'Tickets for Troops', for members of the armed forces, and 1,000 tickets for the England v Sweden game on Tuesday (this is standard FA policy for Wembley matches) The England senior squad will train at Wembley on Friday ahead of the Spain game. They will observe the two-minute silence at 11am, all wearing training tops embossed with poppies. This session will be broadcast live The training tops embossed with poppies will be passed onto forces' charities post-match as auction items for fund raising The poppy will be visible around Wembley on Saturday, on the scoreboards and advertising boards, and poppy sellers will be in the stadium to allow supporters to donate to the poppy fund and show their support On Thursday, England Under-21s play Iceland in Colchester and England U19s play Denmark in Brighton. All players and staff will be wearing poppies pre- and post-match Both the Under-21s and U19s will observe a one-minute silence, too, at their games - the Under-21s will do so alongside troops from Colchester barracks Source: http://www.thefa.com...brance-Day-2011  In short, the FA are doing everything possible to display the poppy except wear it on the shirt. Up yours Blatter....  I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammynb 3150 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 (edited) Not that they are likely to score a goal but they all should be wearing it on shirts under their England shirt, mass 11 player celebration of lifting the shirt over the head to display it. Watch the referee booking all 11 over the event. Edited November 9, 2011 by sammynb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Steve Foster They were all the rage weren't they, and Hansen with his wrist bands, I got toon wrist bands as stocking filler one year. Eric Young's head band was like camouflaged in to his head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Steve Foster They were all the rage weren't they, and Hansen with his wrist bands, I got toon wrist bands as stocking filler one year. Eric Young's head band was like camouflaged in to his head. Always looked like it was blocking his vision too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 9577 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 FA statement: Remembrance Day  The FA would like to clarify that the organisation and England players at all levels will be showing their respect and marking Remembrance Day in a number of ways.  We have been working closely with the Royal British Legion who have welcomed our support. We can confirm that: The England players will wear black armbands during the Spain game on Saturday The FA will place a poppy wreath on the pitch during the national anthems There will be a one-minute silence ahead of kick-off Players will wear training tops with embroidered poppies on match day Players will wear poppy-embossed anthem jackets during the national anthems Military representatives will be in the presentation party prior to kick-off The FA has donated 500 England v Spain tickets to 'Tickets for Troops', for members of the armed forces, and 1,000 tickets for the England v Sweden game on Tuesday (this is standard FA policy for Wembley matches) The England senior squad will train at Wembley on Friday ahead of the Spain game. They will observe the two-minute silence at 11am, all wearing training tops embossed with poppies. This session will be broadcast live The training tops embossed with poppies will be passed onto forces' charities post-match as auction items for fund raising The poppy will be visible around Wembley on Saturday, on the scoreboards and advertising boards, and poppy sellers will be in the stadium to allow supporters to donate to the poppy fund and show their support On Thursday, England Under-21s play Iceland in Colchester and England U19s play Denmark in Brighton. All players and staff will be wearing poppies pre- and post-match Both the Under-21s and U19s will observe a one-minute silence, too, at their games - the Under-21s will do so alongside troops from Colchester barracks Source: http://www.thefa.com...brance-Day-2011  In short, the FA are doing everything possible to display the poppy except wear it on the shirt. Up yours Blatter....  So it's more a message to FIFA as to remember fallen soldiers. Don't know how this goes with the original idea of the poppy...  It probably gives Mike and Dekka hundreds of new ideas how to exploit the Sports direct logo...  and btw - evading conspription was a criminal offence in Germany. Don't know what was more comfortable - a winter in Stalingrad or a prison run by the Gestapo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Steve Foster They were all the rage weren't they, and Hansen with his wrist bands, I got toon wrist bands as stocking filler one year. Eric Young's head band was like camouflaged in to his head. Always looked like it was blocking his vision too. iirc he had to wear it as a result of some obtuse medical condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 29484 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 FA statement: Remembrance Day  The FA would like to clarify that the organisation and England players at all levels will be showing their respect and marking Remembrance Day in a number of ways.  We have been working closely with the Royal British Legion who have welcomed our support. We can confirm that: The England players will wear black armbands during the Spain game on Saturday The FA will place a poppy wreath on the pitch during the national anthems There will be a one-minute silence ahead of kick-off Players will wear training tops with embroidered poppies on match day Players will wear poppy-embossed anthem jackets during the national anthems Military representatives will be in the presentation party prior to kick-off The FA has donated 500 England v Spain tickets to 'Tickets for Troops', for members of the armed forces, and 1,000 tickets for the England v Sweden game on Tuesday (this is standard FA policy for Wembley matches) The England senior squad will train at Wembley on Friday ahead of the Spain game. They will observe the two-minute silence at 11am, all wearing training tops embossed with poppies. This session will be broadcast live The training tops embossed with poppies will be passed onto forces' charities post-match as auction items for fund raising The poppy will be visible around Wembley on Saturday, on the scoreboards and advertising boards, and poppy sellers will be in the stadium to allow supporters to donate to the poppy fund and show their support On Thursday, England Under-21s play Iceland in Colchester and England U19s play Denmark in Brighton. All players and staff will be wearing poppies pre- and post-match Both the Under-21s and U19s will observe a one-minute silence, too, at their games - the Under-21s will do so alongside troops from Colchester barracks Source: http://www.thefa.com...brance-Day-2011  In short, the FA are doing everything possible to display the poppy except wear it on the shirt. Up yours Blatter....  Looks like the Daily Mail have won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 FA statement: Remembrance Day  The FA would like to clarify that the organisation and England players at all levels will be showing their respect and marking Remembrance Day in a number of ways.  We have been working closely with the Royal British Legion who have welcomed our support. We can confirm that: The England players will wear black armbands during the Spain game on Saturday The FA will place a poppy wreath on the pitch during the national anthems There will be a one-minute silence ahead of kick-off Players will wear training tops with embroidered poppies on match day Players will wear poppy-embossed anthem jackets during the national anthems Military representatives will be in the presentation party prior to kick-off The FA has donated 500 England v Spain tickets to 'Tickets for Troops', for members of the armed forces, and 1,000 tickets for the England v Sweden game on Tuesday (this is standard FA policy for Wembley matches) The England senior squad will train at Wembley on Friday ahead of the Spain game. They will observe the two-minute silence at 11am, all wearing training tops embossed with poppies. This session will be broadcast live The training tops embossed with poppies will be passed onto forces' charities post-match as auction items for fund raising The poppy will be visible around Wembley on Saturday, on the scoreboards and advertising boards, and poppy sellers will be in the stadium to allow supporters to donate to the poppy fund and show their support On Thursday, England Under-21s play Iceland in Colchester and England U19s play Denmark in Brighton. All players and staff will be wearing poppies pre- and post-match Both the Under-21s and U19s will observe a one-minute silence, too, at their games - the Under-21s will do so alongside troops from Colchester barracks Source: http://www.thefa.com...brance-Day-2011  In short, the FA are doing everything possible to display the poppy except wear it on the shirt. Up yours Blatter.... For once I applaud the FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 They are making it into a political football now, so to speak, which is a bit distasteful tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14000 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I imagine that the F.A would have done most of those things anyway - apart from the training shirts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 It's beyond silly this, but can't say i'm surprised. Not as silly as not allowing it. The poppy on the shirt IS NOT a political statement. Fucking cunts at FIFA, half their grandads probably died off a bomb made in Wakefield, that's where the problem lies. Don't kid yourselves Switzerland, Austria...those places remain firmly under the German sphere of influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Steve Foster They were all the rage weren't they, and Hansen with his wrist bands, I got toon wrist bands as stocking filler one year. Eric Young's head band was like camouflaged in to his head. Always looked like it was blocking his vision too. iirc he had to wear it as a result of some obtuse medical condition. Â Steve Foster syndrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I was thinking of ways round it to get it on the pitch (lawyer in me) and they could all wear it embroidered onto headbands (ala Steve Foster) but then I thought that from a distance that might look a bit like a kamikaze pilot, which is a conflicting message on balance. Â Steve Foster They were all the rage weren't they, and Hansen with his wrist bands, I got toon wrist bands as stocking filler one year. Eric Young's head band was like camouflaged in to his head. Always looked like it was blocking his vision too. iirc he had to wear it as a result of some obtuse medical condition. Â Steve Foster syndrome. Steve Foster was fucking class. It's ridiculous how many good players Luton had. Newell was excellent, the two Stein's, Ricky Hill, they were often a lot better than us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Mick Harford as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Mick Harford as well. Aye an animal to play against too, Sealey, and Mal Donaghy went to Man Utd too after years there, Danny Wilson etc... The 1988 League Cup Final was one of my favourite ever games to watch on telly as a kid, much better than the 87 FA Cup Final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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