Obertan: Earths' gravity is no match for him.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

Ps, i reckon you're the idiot if you think ba is an improvement on Carroll.

[Aeris 0]

Good in the air, strong in the tackle, quick to cover back, shite going forward.

 

 

So he's a centreback?

[ChezGiven 0]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

[OTF 7286]

I don't think Nolan could have been more anonymous than Cabaye in that match. For that reason I don't think he could have contributed less. Despite how poorly we played there was a number of times where the ball fell into open space at the top of their box and there was no-one from our team close enough to capitalise. They're the kind off spaces that Nolan hangs about in.

 

I'm thinking Cabaye was suffering a bit of a hangover from playing with the French side midweek. Granted he could have been more involved if Tiote got the ball to him more often. Tiote was largely to blame with his inability to move the ball on without first turning in a circle or taking a man on when he blatantly shouldn't, but Cabaye wasn't faultless on that front either failing to get in the right position for Tiote to make the percentage pass.

 

Forgettable game from them both. Tiote's is worryingly part of a larger pattern where as Cabaye seemed to be on the improve prior to this.

[Coggeh 0]

Why hasn't marveaux gotten a start yet? start him against forest midweek and see how he gets on, I don't rate Obertan but i certainly don't think he's crap, the potential is there alright me thinks.

 

Edit: Where is the Ba is crap thread? because he's been so damn lazy in every game for all his talk preseason.

Edited September 13, 2011 by Coggeh

[TicTacWoe 0]

Don't think we should give up on him just yet. He might just need longer to settle into playing regularly in this league. He has been utter gash so far though.

[trophyshy 7073]

Don't think we should give up on him just yet. He might just need longer to settle into playing regularly in this league. He has been utter gash so far though.

 

Sadly I have often struggled to give up on gash.

[dbsweeney 0]

Let's just remember how we all felt about Colo and Jose when they first started.

[Kitman 2204]

I was going to say Squidward seemed a bit headless to me but that's not appropriate in the circumstances. Worryingly he seems to me slower and more ineffective the more games he plays. Hopefully he will come good but like Parky I'm beginning to doubt it. Could be that the curse of Alec Ferguson strikes again.

[Guest alex]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

Tbf, Cabaye needs to get used to the holding midfield role for when Tiote leaves

[Guest alex]

I was going to say Squidward seemed a bit headless to me but that's not appropriate in the circumstances. Worryingly he seems to me slower and more ineffective the more games he plays. Hopefully he will come good but like Parky I'm beginning to doubt it. Could be that the curse of Alec Ferguson strikes again.

[Kid Dynamite 7011]

I was watching the match in desperation last night thinking what in Earth we can do with the attacking options at our disposal.

 

Marveaux has to be given a run of games to see what he can do. Ba has to be given a run of games too, his goalscoring record at all of his other clubs cant be a fluke, surely!? We may as well give Abeid, Sammy and Ferguson a run of games too. They can't possibly be any worse than what we had to endure last night.

 

Shola made Best look like a world beater last night. They managed 1 shot between them against iirc

[toonotl 2964]

Don't know if he is crap. He certainly looks it. Let's give him 10 years and see how he develops. I mean we showed patience with Shola and that really.. never mind.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

i'm not nolan's biggest fan either tbf.

[ChezGiven 0]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

Cabaye and Tiote were up against 3 players as we tried (and failed) to play with some width. This has been explained to you a few times now but you dont seem to understand it. If Nolan was asked to do that role, his lack of pace and stamina would have exposed Tiote on his own time and again.

 

I'm not interested in whether you're writing Cabaye off, am just struck by the shitness of your analysis.

[Guest alex]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

I think it would perhaps be a different kettle of fish if it was 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1 with Ben Arfa dropping off the main striker. I think you're onto something though. We're playing with two wide men who are genuine wingers (without getting into how good they actually are). So we now have Cabaye instead of Nolan, with the former seemingly more comfortable in a deeper role, and we have Obertan instead of Barton, so where you had the latter coming inside more and helping out in the middle of the park you now have a player who wants to stay on the wing. Add to this Best and Shola and (again not even assessing whether they are good enough) you have two strikers who don't really want drop off and play 'in the hole', because they know they can't basically. So the net result is a very heavy workload placed on two central mids who are still getting used to playing together.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

Cabaye and Tiote were up against 3 players as we tried (and failed) to play with some width. This has been explained to you a few times now but you dont seem to understand it. If Nolan was asked to do that role, his lack of pace and stamina would have exposed Tiote on his own time and again.

 

I'm not interested in whether you're writing Cabaye off, am just struck by the shitness of your analysis.

 

you're wrong. i remember us playing the same formation last season with tiote and nolan in a central 2 together against midfield 3s and to my surprise it worked. the main reason being was tiote had the engine to mop up behind nolan and wasn't exposed by his pack of pace. nolan taking up advanced positions and supporting the front men in turn on took midfielders with him, making tiote's job easier and giving us a link tot he front two. cabaye made the fact we were outnumbered in midfield even more of a problem by playing so deep that their midfielders had the freedom of loftus road to operate. when you play a 4-4-2 with wingers, it's suicidal to play with both your central midfielders so deep. pretty basic analysis tbh.

[Dr Gloom 21861]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

I think it would perhaps be a different kettle of fish if it was 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1 with Ben Arfa dropping off the main striker. I think you're onto something though. We're playing with two wide men who are genuine wingers (without getting into how good they actually are). So we now have Cabaye instead of Nolan, with the former seemingly more comfortable in a deeper role, and we have Obertan instead of Barton, so where you had the latter coming inside more and helping out in the middle of the park you now have a player who wants to stay on the wing. Add to this Best and Shola and (again not even assessing whether they are good enough) you have two strikers who don't really want drop off and play 'in the hole', because they know they can't basically. So the net result is a very heavy workload placed on two central mids who are still getting used to playing together.

 

agreed. if the two central midfielders are going to sit so deep, they need forward players closer to them - either one of the front men has to drop off and link the play or one of the midfielders has to take up a more advanced position. it would help if the strikers and wingers weren't as crap as ours were last night mind.

 

i reckon a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-4-1-1 are the only way tiote and cabaye are going to work playing alongside each other. unless cabaye realises that in a 4-4-2 he has to play further ahead of tiote.

[ChezGiven 0]

I haven't been that impressed by any of our new signings so far - obertan, ba and cabaye all look like poorer players than barton, Carroll and Nolan - the players they have replaced. Still early days like so time for them all to improve, particularly cabaye. Obertan does look a bit of a headless chicken though for all his pace.

 

Says it all that the player i was most excited to see warming up was shola's kid brother. He's even got his own song already too. Desperate times.

If you think Nolan would have done better than Cabaye alongside Tiote tonight then you're an idiot. That was exactly the sort of game that would have passed Nolan by. Barton is a better footballer than Obertan, dont think that needs pointing out to anyone.

 

Ba looked good when he came on, showed some nice touches.

 

Wrong. Nolan looked good alongside tiote last year in a 442 precisely because he did what cabaye didn't do tonight - took up advanced positions. We were over run in centre mid tonight not just because we were outnumbered but also because we had two players sitting deep we were just in inviting pressure on to us. It didn't help that there was no support from the wingers and fuck all to aim at up front but the point stands - cabaye and Nolan Aden never going to work as a partnership in hat formation as long as they both play sitting in front of the back four.

 

I'm not writing cabaye off, still early days and he will improve with better players around him, but we haven't seen him boss a game yet.

I never once suggested that he didnt have good games alongside Tiote. Against that pace and playing against a 3 tonight, Nolan would have been shite. You remain an idiot for a. not getting that point and b. interpreting my post as 'Ba is better than Carroll'.

 

you're wrong. nolan would have been better than cabaye was last night. at least he would understand the need to take up an advanced role. i'm not writing cabaye off btw. he might turn out to be a good player, but it seems obvious that he can't play in a 442 alongside a holding player like tiote as he wants to take take up those deep positions too.

Cabaye and Tiote were up against 3 players as we tried (and failed) to play with some width. This has been explained to you a few times now but you dont seem to understand it. If Nolan was asked to do that role, his lack of pace and stamina would have exposed Tiote on his own time and again.

 

I'm not interested in whether you're writing Cabaye off, am just struck by the shitness of your analysis.

 

you're wrong. i remember us playing the same formation last season with tiote and nolan in a central 2 together against midfield 3s and to my surprise it worked. the main reason being was tiote had the engine to mop up behind nolan and wasn't exposed by his pack of pace. nolan taking up advanced positions and supporting the front men in turn on took midfielders with him, making tiote's job easier and giving us a link tot he front two. cabaye made the fact we were outnumbered in midfield even more of a problem by playing so deep that their midfielders had the freedom of loftus road to operate. when you play a 4-4-2 with wingers, it's suicidal to play with both your central midfielders so deep. pretty basic analysis tbh.

Which game are you referring to? Nolan and Tiote played in a central 2 against a pacey 3 man midfield last season and bossed it? Talking through your arse, you didnt even account for their 3 in midfield last night until it was repeatedly pointed out to you.

[ChezGiven 0]

when you play a 4-4-2 with wingers, it's suicidal to play with both your central midfielders so deep. pretty basic analysis tbh.

Again, it was me and Parky pointing this out to you last night, now you're playing it back to me as you're own. Mug.

[Kitman 2204]

Pardew's had Ben arfa earmarked to play in the hole but hasn't had him available obviously. I'm baffled why he persisted with the formation against qpr when it so obviously wasn't working. Especially when one of the two strikers offered no more than a lump of wood.

 

Edit in fact a lump of wood has more use and doesnt give away pointless free kicks and offsides

Edited September 13, 2011 by Kitman

[Lake Bells tits 1]

Thing is, if we have cabaye and Tiote sitting deep, then whoever they pass the ball to needs to be quality. In order for it to work, we need 2 quality wingers who can link up with our striker or strikers on their own. Obertan has so far proven that hes not quite there yet, Marveax + Ben Arfa link up could work..

[ChezGiven 0]

Btw, Obertan's passing was the best of our lot last night. Completed the most passes with the highest % success. 31 passes out of 35. 1 more than Cabaye and 2 more than Tiote (29 out of 40).