ChezGiven 0 Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 William Blake's hardly ruling class! He was a Romantic poet and thus hated the industrial revolution for ruining our "green and pleasant land." Yes but the rulers and the artistic classes forget it made the country rich and allowed the fuckers to live the way they did/do, The rulers lived much the same before, it just made them even richer. After all, Capitalists made the factories/industries and they were mostly ruling class. After socialism fucked up our country and someone couldn't breathe in the wrong direction without a strike being called I think they just went "Fuck it, what's the point?" And no I don't think it necessarily helped workers because America's industries are stronger (albeit only slightly) than ours and their GDP per capita pisses all over ours. The state of education today. Unionism does not = socialism. If socialism is so bad, how come China is driving the global economy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 The cartoon in today's times. Hmmm... canny offensive of them trying to use that to regain the moral highground imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Very offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 William Blake's hardly ruling class! He was a Romantic poet and thus hated the industrial revolution for ruining our "green and pleasant land." Yes but the rulers and the artistic classes forget it made the country rich and allowed the fuckers to live the way they did/do, The rulers lived much the same before, it just made them even richer. After all, Capitalists made the factories/industries and they were mostly ruling class. After socialism fucked up our country and someone couldn't breathe in the wrong direction without a strike being called I think they just went "Fuck it, what's the point?" And no I don't think it necessarily helped workers because America's industries are stronger (albeit only slightly) than ours and their GDP per capita pisses all over ours. Fuck me you're ignorant - more strike days were lost under Thatcher than under Wilson and if you think we all now benefit from a union-less world you don't give a fuck about the working class. The US GDP might be larger but the country is much more divided rich versus poor - I suppose that's because they'd never had socialism fucking it up with mad ideas like the NHS. No, but it goes both ways. Before Thatcher people striked over EVERYTHING. The unions take the piss out of the power they have. The unions are just as corrupt as political parties. The right to strikes all right and good, but if people overdo it and strike over everything the point of it goes away. Yes you're right, although the Liberal Party started most of our socialist policies, not the Labour tramps. NHS is indeed an impressive policy, and the only good Labour has ever done to our country. I don't "not give a fuck about the working class" the same way I don't "not give a fuck about the upper classes". They're all people, stop dividing everyone, nowadays most people can rise up (or down), and your class isn't about what you earn but where you come from. Bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 No there are no unions so the employer has all the power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 The Labour tramps comment sort of rules out any sense of objective perspective on your part like. There were virtually no strikes under the last Labour government btw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 William Blake's hardly ruling class! He was a Romantic poet and thus hated the industrial revolution for ruining our "green and pleasant land." Yes but the rulers and the artistic classes forget it made the country rich and allowed the fuckers to live the way they did/do, The rulers lived much the same before, it just made them even richer. After all, Capitalists made the factories/industries and they were mostly ruling class. After socialism fucked up our country and someone couldn't breathe in the wrong direction without a strike being called I think they just went "Fuck it, what's the point?" And no I don't think it necessarily helped workers because America's industries are stronger (albeit only slightly) than ours and their GDP per capita pisses all over ours. The state of education today. Unionism does not = socialism. If socialism is so bad, how come China is driving the global economy? You've brought age into it AGAIN, after I downed your argument earlier, irrelevent of age? Fuck it, let's all act like we should do because of our age. LOL I GESS DAT CHYNA IS DRIVIN IT BECAUS OF DA CHEEP LABOR ND DA FACT DAT DEY PEGG DER CURRENCEH DOWN TO ATRACT FOREIN BUSINESS INNIT BLAD. China is not true socialism, workers rights are worse there than most places on earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 You'll forget all about this stuff once you have sex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 The Labour tramps comment sort of rules out any sense of objective perspective on your part like. There were virtually no strikes under the last Labour government btw Of course not, why would there need to be when we're borrowing that much money that everyone thinks life will be perfect? Let's put too much money into the civil service and then when the shit hits the fan we can blame everyone else, genius! No offence to any civil servants btw, it's not your fault you got such an easy ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 I just hope the conservatives are trying to sort out our manufacturing/producing, be more like Germany and all that. Thanks for that - best laugh for a while. You should watch Evan Davies's Made in Britain. Episode 2 was on last night, it describes where in the production process you generate the most value added. Its not in manufacturing. The example he uses is a $300 iPod and how that money is distributed. Its designed and innovated by Apple and made in China. Once all the parts suppliers have been paid, Apple gets $80 for its invention and the Chinese manufacturer gets $5. Do you invest $billions into manufacturing plants or into research and innovation? The UK was correct to move away from manufacturing but is not now well balanced, so there is a problem but its not fundamental, its more a question of needing a better mix. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b012brrc It makes sense as an investor (obviously) and I know what I'd prefer to be involved in if I was punting my money about, but presumably manufacturing employs more people than design and innovation. Or at least more than design and innovation actually needs to. The counterpoint to that is obviously how much corporation tax ends up getting paid to the government by design and innovation vs manufacturing companies, but largely I'd say your point is of concern to the private investor rather than governments looking to generate sustainable employment for their people. As you say though, from a governmental point of view its probably a question of a better mix/balance. Will give that a watch either way though, find all that shit fascinating. Spot on that. When i first moved to France i used to use the example of Saint Gobain as an example of socialist company. They make about $1-2bn a year in profit on sales of $50-60bn. The company i worked for at the time made the same sales but had profits of $10bn+ a year. The difference between the two companies? The french one employed 300,000 and the other 100,000. 200,000 extra families supported by the same financial sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 You'll forget all about this stuff once you have sex. What is this sex you talk of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 The Labour tramps comment sort of rules out any sense of objective perspective on your part like. There were virtually no strikes under the last Labour government btw Of course not, why would there need to be when we're borrowing that much money that everyone thinks life will be perfect? Let's put too much money into the civil service and then when the shit hits the fan we can blame everyone else, genius! No offence to any civil servants btw, it's not your fault you got such an easy ride. The Civil Service did not cause the banking crisis so you can see why they're pissed off at having to pay for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 What is this sex you talk of? You get two fishing, rods, 4 cans of lager and some chicken and then just walk about as far as I can tell. Fun though and the women always moan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 7083 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 The Labour tramps comment sort of rules out any sense of objective perspective on your part like. There were virtually no strikes under the last Labour government btw Of course not, why would there need to be when we're borrowing that much money that everyone thinks life will be perfect? Let's put too much money into the civil service and then when the shit hits the fan we can blame everyone else, genius! No offence to any civil servants btw, it's not your fault you got such an easy ride. The Civil Service did not cause the banking crisis so you can see why they're pissed off at having to pay for it. You're right. However, they still get too many benefits and perks as it is (i'm not saying they should have changed it for those who already signed up to those deals). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 What is this sex you talk of? You get two fishing, rods, 4 cans of lager and some chicken and then just walk about as far as I can tell. Fun though and the women always moan. Thank you, oh wise one. Hopefully one day I can do this, and be just like you old people. Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14011 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 (edited) The Labour tramps comment sort of rules out any sense of objective perspective on your part like. There were virtually no strikes under the last Labour government btw Of course not, why would there need to be when we're borrowing that much money that everyone thinks life will be perfect? Let's put too much money into the civil service and then when the shit hits the fan we can blame everyone else, genius! No offence to any civil servants btw, it's not your fault you got such an easy ride. The Civil Service did not cause the banking crisis so you can see why they're pissed off at having to pay for it. You're right. However, they still get too many benefits and perks as it is (i'm not saying they should have changed it for those who already signed up to those deals). Debatable imo. If it was so fucking great and such an easy ride all the people moaning about it would've left their current jobs and worked for them ages ago, surely. It's only since the current government have started spouting their thinly-veiled ideological bollocks that people have suddenly noticed the situation. Plenty saps seem to lap it up though as it plays on the jealous, solidarity lacking society we now seem to live in. All imho that is. Edited July 21, 2011 by alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 7083 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I like Cleetoonfan, at least he can be arsed to add to a debate, unlike myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I like Cleetoonfan, at least he can be arsed to add to a debate, unlike myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Haha yeah. Just like the opposite of sports/appearances I guess. Not that i'm athletic/aesthetic. And to be honest alex, I genuinely believe the current government is going at the situation rightly (this coming from a student). The IMF have praised our way of sorting ourselves out, and we avoid the problems of most of Europe, the Greeks being primary examples of people that have spent too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 (edited) Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Haha yeah. Just like the opposite of sports/appearances I guess. Not that i'm athletic/aesthetic. And to be honest alex, I genuinely believe the current government is going at the situation rightly (this coming from a student). The IMF have praised our way of sorting ourselves out, and we avoid the problems of most of Europe, the Greeks being primary examples of people that have spent too much. The IMF don't care about the people whose lives are wrecked in the process though. The situation in Greece is nothing like the situation in the UK either. Edited July 21, 2011 by alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Haha yeah. Just like the opposite of sports/appearances I guess. Not that i'm athletic/aesthetic. And to be honest alex, I genuinely believe the current government is going at the situation rightly (this coming from a student). The IMF have praised our way of sorting ourselves out, and we avoid the problems of most of Europe, the Greeks being primary examples of people that have spent too much. The IMF don't care about the people whose lives are wrecked in the process though. The situation in Greece is nothing like the situation in the UK either. Of course it's not, but it's still good to judge on. The nations slowly growing, and we're getting out of our mess bit by bit. Rome wasn't built in a day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Haha yeah. Just like the opposite of sports/appearances I guess. Not that i'm athletic/aesthetic. And to be honest alex, I genuinely believe the current government is going at the situation rightly (this coming from a student). The IMF have praised our way of sorting ourselves out, and we avoid the problems of most of Europe, the Greeks being primary examples of people that have spent too much. The IMF don't care about the people whose lives are wrecked in the process though. The situation in Greece is nothing like the situation in the UK either. Of course it's not, but it's still good to judge on. The nations slowly growing, and we're getting out of our mess bit by bit. Rome wasn't built in a day. Have the cuts in Greece helped stimulate growth there? Are they doing the same here or are they preventing growth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleeToonFan 1 Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 Then I may be respected by the world because age is the only factor in whether your views on anything is valid. As you get older, you'll realise this more & more. Haha yeah. Just like the opposite of sports/appearances I guess. Not that i'm athletic/aesthetic. And to be honest alex, I genuinely believe the current government is going at the situation rightly (this coming from a student). The IMF have praised our way of sorting ourselves out, and we avoid the problems of most of Europe, the Greeks being primary examples of people that have spent too much. The IMF don't care about the people whose lives are wrecked in the process though. The situation in Greece is nothing like the situation in the UK either. Of course it's not, but it's still good to judge on. The nations slowly growing, and we're getting out of our mess bit by bit. Rome wasn't built in a day. Have the cuts in Greece helped stimulate growth there? Are they doing the same here or are they preventing growth? With Greece it's too early days to judge. With us stimulating growth and slightly reducing that fucking huge deficit Labour decided would be a good idea. "Let's get all those tramps and wankers and give them more money than minimum wage on the dole, then they can have more kids and cans, brilliant idea!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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