LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 The article under discussion said it. See my last post. I made it clearer as i knew a few posters would be put out if i suggested it was the club pushing this line. Theres lots of journalists who are more than capable of pushing whatever troll-like line they want. Not everything that addresses issues from a perspective other than the peeved fan is Ashley propaganda. Bit of a digression but I was having a drink with a Sheff Wed fan 3 weeks ago, he says 'isnt it about time you lot layed off Ashley'. (My reply for the record was 'he fucked off Kegan, appointed Joe Kinnear and relegated the 14th biggest club financially in the world, might take a bit more than 6th place in February for people to get past that'). The point being, the perspectives of others, including journalists, doesnt always start from the same emotional place as for the majority. It could well be the club put that out there, for me they dont need to as i see us as maximum 13.2m up off Caroll anyway, not including increased operational spend. I can see why they might want people to add it up though when some muppets are still talking about 35m being missing, it doesnt exactly suggest a financially literate fan base. it seems some muppets still don't recognise the strategy of 2nd rate selling clubs whrn it hits them right between the eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 The article under discussion said it. See my last post. I made it clearer as i knew a few posters would be put out if i suggested it was the club pushing this line. Theres lots of journalists who are more than capable of pushing whatever troll-like line they want. Not everything that addresses issues from a perspective other than the peeved fan is Ashley propaganda. Bit of a digression but I was having a drink with a Sheff Wed fan 3 weeks ago, he says 'isnt it about time you lot layed off Ashley'. (My reply for the record was 'he fucked off Kegan, appointed Joe Kinnear and relegated the 14th biggest club financially in the world, might take a bit more than 6th place in February for people to get past that'). The point being, the perspectives of others, including journalists, doesnt always start from the same emotional place as for the majority. It could well be the club put that out there, for me they dont need to as i see us as maximum 13.2m up off Caroll anyway, not including increased operational spend. I can see why they might want people to add it up though when some muppets are still talking about 35m being missing, it doesnt exactly suggest a financially literate fan base. it seems some muppets still don't recognise the strategy of 2nd rate selling clubs whrn it hits them right between the eyes. You said it mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Spending 10m on Cisse Not flogging anyone Giving two of your best players new contracts Which of the above is a 2nd rate selling club strategy? I mean, lets stick to the facts here ffs. Have i missed something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Theres lots of journalists who are more than capable of pushing whatever troll-like line they want. Not everything that addresses issues from a perspective other than the peeved fan is Ashley propaganda. Bit of a digression but I was having a drink with a Sheff Wed fan 3 weeks ago, he says 'isnt it about time you lot layed off Ashley'. (My reply for the record was 'he fucked off Kegan, appointed Joe Kinnear and relegated the 14th biggest club financially in the world, might take a bit more than 6th place in February for people to get past that'). The point being, the perspectives of others, including journalists, doesnt always start from the same emotional place as for the majority. It could well be the club put that out there, for me they dont need to as i see us as maximum 13.2m up off Caroll anyway, not including increased operational spend. I can see why they might want people to add it up though when some muppets are still talking about 35m being missing, it doesnt exactly suggest a financially literate fan base. it seems some muppets still don't recognise the strategy of 2nd rate selling clubs whrn it hits them right between the eyes. You said it mate I did indeed. Meanwhile I'm pleased for you, that you appear to think NUFC are behaving like a big, ambitous club again, how much did you pay for those rose-tinted specs ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonpack 9294 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 so they sell their best players to pay the contracts of others, and this is how they are in the Champions League and their turnover has overtaken ours in the last 4 years ? Yes, they have a history of selling players for inflated fee's and building, onwards and upwards. See Carrick, Berbatov for expensive examples.(same as all the succesful clubs do). what a load of crap. 100% true and factual, yet crap in Leazes-world. Sums you up perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Spending 10m on Cisse Not flogging anyone Giving two of your best players new contracts Which of the above is a 2nd rate selling club strategy? I mean, lets stick to the facts here ffs. Have i missed something? you have indeed, if you still can't work it out, I'm not telling you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Yes, they have a history of selling players for inflated fee's and building, onwards and upwards. See Carrick, Berbatov for expensive examples.(same as all the succesful clubs do). what a load of crap. 100% true and factual, yet crap in Leazes-world. Sums you up perfectly. why don't you make football posts ? When have Spurs sold players and not backed their manager ? You're living in a dreamworld chum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted March 5, 2012 Author Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Spending £10m, signing new contracts with your best players and not selling anyone in a window are all good things which i'm happy to see. They are things any second rate club can be seen doing though. QPR spent £10m in January too, and gave Helguson a contract. Stoke spent £10m on Crouch. Fulham spent it on Ruiz. I've not seen Leazes complain about any of those things either. Just that we don't reinvest what we earn from inbound transfer fees back on outbound ones. It's an argument that can't be beaten because it's a fact. Whatever the merits of the approach, however well Spurs or Arsenal do it, whether the money is reinvested in other ways, whatever else NUFC do well outside of that, you aren't going to be able to convince Leazes the above isn't true, because it is. That's the be all and end all of his view. Edited March 5, 2012 by Happy Face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 Spending £10m, signing new contracts with your best players and not selling anyone in a window are all good things which i'm happy to see. They are things any second rate club can be seen doing though. QPR spent £10m in January too, and gave Helguson a contract. Stoke spent £10m on Crouch. I've not seen Leazes complain about any of those things either. Just that we don't reinvest what we earn from inbound transfer fees back on outbound ones. It's an argument that can't be beaten because it's a fact. Whatever the merits of the approach, however well Spurs or Arsenal do it, whether the money is reinvested in other ways, whatever else NUFC do well outside of that, you aren't going to be able to convince Leazes the above isn't true, because it is. That's the be all and end all of his view. exactly. Even in the days under McKeag, Seymour etc, they did some things which were good, and they signed and re-signed some players too, but it didn't change the fact that they were running a 2nd rate, selling club show and did not have the desire or ambition to attempt to move further and seriously challenge at the levels the club ought to be doing, the result is that when the short good run is over, you don't have the quality or mentality to sustain it, and you will go backwards. It is as certain as night becomes day, and it will happen under the current setup too for exactly these reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monroe Transfer 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 This "selling club" thing is still laughable. Who have we actually sold purely for the money? One player, for the most inflated transfer fee imaginable. Leazes' favourite argument centres around an assumption of what we might do in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 This "selling club" thing is still laughable. Who have we actually sold purely for the money? One player, for the most inflated transfer fee imaginable. Leazes' favourite argument centres around an assumption of what we might do in the future. fuck me sideways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I did indeed. Meanwhile I'm pleased for you, that you appear to think NUFC are behaving like a big, ambitous club again, how much did you pay for those rose-tinted specs ? One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? As for that tripe HF, if the rule is as you say it is then Man U are a 2nd rate selling club for not re-investing all of the Ronaldo money. No one is saying we couldnt have stretched ourselves further, the argument is simple; sometimes its prudent not to, that is the case with us based on where we are and the fact that we have 12.45m (i forgot Ben Arfa was 5.75m, not 5m) in the black column does NOT make us a 2nd rate selling club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 44491 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 What's going on in this thread, chums? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JawD 99 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 What's going on in this thread, chums? this thread? or that one? which one? any fucking one cos they feel like one bastard thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I did indeed. Meanwhile I'm pleased for you, that you appear to think NUFC are behaving like a big, ambitous club again, how much did you pay for those rose-tinted specs ? One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? I think you need to read that again, and understand the bigger long term picture. We are indeed acting like a 2nd rate selling club, we have been doing so overall for over 4 years and the sooner you understand the better and I don't have to read rose tinted rubbish saying differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 What's going on in this thread, chums? enjoy the game yesterday Gem ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JawD 99 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I did indeed. Meanwhile I'm pleased for you, that you appear to think NUFC are behaving like a big, ambitous club again, how much did you pay for those rose-tinted specs ? One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? I think you need to read that again, and understand the bigger long term picture. We are indeed acting like a 2nd rate selling club, we have been doing so overall for over 4 years and the sooner you understand the better and I don't have to read rose tinted rubbish saying differently. You know LM, I think this highlights the difference between you and others. I think you have been around so long ( ) that you look at the big picture, while the months merge in to seasons and so on. This isnt as much of a piss take as it sounds btw I on the other hand just want to enjoy each week as it comes. Who cares what happened last year and who gives a fuck about next season. Ill worry about that in the summer. I'm looking at the games just played or te one coming up. I look at the squad we have hear and now and I'll worry about next seasons squad next season. Something will fuck up and I'll go mental and be all fucked off about it, you'll say "I told you so". Neither of us are wrong I'd say, just look from a different perspective,. You go on about who we will sell in the summer etc as if they have already gone, because as you say you are looking at the big pic. I'll worry about that when and if it happens but Im too busy looking at this season and who we have now to think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I did indeed. Meanwhile I'm pleased for you, that you appear to think NUFC are behaving like a big, ambitous club again, how much did you pay for those rose-tinted specs ? One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? I think you need to read that again, and understand the bigger long term picture. We are indeed acting like a 2nd rate selling club, we have been doing so overall for over 4 years and the sooner you understand the better and I don't have to read rose tinted rubbish saying differently. Give me the argument in 3 bullet points using just the facts. No opinion, no future mystic meg shit. Just the basic tenets of your why, like i did above. It should be easy and it will help the discussion. No one is stupid on either side of this debate but the best way to get to the nub of the matter is extract all the waffle and state the basics simply and succinctly. .. .. .. Just like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? I think you need to read that again, and understand the bigger long term picture. We are indeed acting like a 2nd rate selling club, we have been doing so overall for over 4 years and the sooner you understand the better and I don't have to read rose tinted rubbish saying differently. Give me the argument in 3 bullet points using just the facts. No opinion, no future mystic meg shit. Just the basic tenets of your why, like i did above. It should be easy and it will help the discussion. No one is stupid on either side of this debate but the best way to get to the nub of the matter is extract all the waffle and state the basics simply and succinctly. .. .. .. Just like that. as you insist on this nonsensical bullet point type approach : we sell our best players we don't back our manager to the fullest of our ability, especially when withholding the cash made from selling those players that are bringing in big money that he in all probability from a playing perspective he would rather keep we operate a "sell and replace" policy rather than an "improve and build" Just like that. Time will prove me right. I haven't been saying the same thing for over 4 years for nothing, I'm still saying it because to date I am proving absolutely correct, as HF has said. You can't argue with it. Come the day the facts prove me wrong, then I can't put these points across anymore.........I won't spend years bickering on like others do about it who can't admit they were wrong, I'll admit that it has been incorrect. I've also correctly stated, that no team in the history of football has ever put together a consistent highly placed club by doing anything other than keeping its best players, and backing its managers. People can produce as many bullet points and spreadsheets as they like, but at the end of the day, football success is only achieved by the clubs who follow the policies I've explained. Just like that. Edited March 5, 2012 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted March 5, 2012 Author Share Posted March 5, 2012 As for that tripe HF, if the rule is as you say it is then Man U are a 2nd rate selling club for not re-investing all of the Ronaldo money. No one is saying we couldnt have stretched ourselves further, the argument is simple; sometimes its prudent not to, that is the case with us based on where we are and the fact that we have 12.45m (i forgot Ben Arfa was 5.75m, not 5m) in the black column does NOT make us a 2nd rate selling club. I didn't say that's the rule at all, i said that's Leazes' view. There's no tripe there whatsoever, it describes Leazes view perfectly, which he confirmed. He's made it clear repeatedly and on it goes. The only thing that will change that view is when we've spent another £25m or so without selling anyone. It makes Arsenal and Spurs second rate too. Not sure bout Man U though, They have definitely spent in excess of £90m since Ronaldo went the journey. For my part, I don't really care what the transfer deficit is. Even if we hadn't sold Carroll, and were in the hole transferwise I'd still be as annoyed that Williamson and Simpson remain first choice defenders for 5 months of our season. The fact there was a big windfall recently just rubs that salt into the wound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 So in summary over whether NUFC are a 2nd rate selling club we have: For we sell our best players we don't back our manager we operate a "sell and replace" policy rather than an "improve and build" Against Spending 10m on Cisse Not actually flogging anyone Giving two of your best players new contracts Not sure there is much more to say really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) One of us needs specs, i said we arent acting like a 2nd rate selling club. You are though and should i infer that any club not acting like Man City is a 2nd rate selling club? I think you need to read that again, and understand the bigger long term picture. We are indeed acting like a 2nd rate selling club, we have been doing so overall for over 4 years and the sooner you understand the better and I don't have to read rose tinted rubbish saying differently. You know LM, I think this highlights the difference between you and others. I think you have been around so long ( ) that you look at the big picture, while the months merge in to seasons and so on. This isnt as much of a piss take as it sounds btw I on the other hand just want to enjoy each week as it comes. Who cares what happened last year and who gives a fuck about next season. Ill worry about that in the summer. I'm looking at the games just played or te one coming up. I look at the squad we have hear and now and I'll worry about next seasons squad next season. Something will fuck up and I'll go mental and be all fucked off about it, you'll say "I told you so". Neither of us are wrong I'd say, just look from a different perspective,. You go on about who we will sell in the summer etc as if they have already gone, because as you say you are looking at the big pic. I'll worry about that when and if it happens but Im too busy looking at this season and who we have now to think about it. I accept what you say, but surely that makes my view all the more worthy of consideration ? For the record, even when I was younger, I always found the selling of our best players, coupled with lack of backing of the managers, irritating and frustrating. I realised from an early age that NUFC were a huge club selling themselves short, but then I appreciate that those who have grown up under a board who actually had different ambitions may not understand this and so have a different perspective, which of course I disagree with, and so far, everything I have said could possibly happen has happened, so I stand by everything I have said over the years, with almost 5 years of Mike Ashleys ownership now passed. Edited March 5, 2012 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) So in summary over whether NUFC are a 2nd rate selling club we have: For we sell our best players we don't back our manager we operate a "sell and replace" policy rather than an "improve and build" Against Spending 10m on Cisse Not actually flogging anyone Giving two of your best players new contracts Not sure there is much more to say really. I don't think a few good things in the short term balance out the longer term setup and ambitions at all. You will see. Edited March 5, 2012 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JawD 99 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 @LM The only reason I struggle with your perspective is that you are worry about stuff that hasnt happened. Its just a different mentality not right or wrong. I'm the same is every aspect of my life. I'll worry about something when the shit hits the fan (like in the NUFC Away bogs yesterday ) not before. To support your pov somewhat, if Im at work and I can see something is heading that way, I'll step in and put it right. Trouble is, with Pardew he has such a golden tongue you dont know what he is saying is true, or bullshit. Is he being fed lies from MA and DL or does he know the truth but he is in place as he can deliver a lie well? I've thought about this a lot. I have been so fucked off with the action of MA off the field that I gave up. I actually gave up. Now, Im trying to concentrate on football taking each week as it comes. We're in 6th, having a decent season and Im enjoying it. We have players who can play on the ball and Im enjoying watching them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 30368 Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 (edited) Leazes, to avoid much of the pointless debate and back and forth, do you care to offer some metrics by which to measure our impending doom? Rather than your statement that you will be proven right at an indeterminate point in the future. So far you have stated that we will never qualify for Europe through our league position under Ashley. Any more? Edited March 5, 2012 by ewerk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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