Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 we only got one decent striker(who is off form)now ba has gone,which was always going to happen and we have been short of decent cb cover going back to pre-season and it was then it should have been sorted out. Thought 3-5 chances Cisse applied a good finish and normally 1 or 2 would have gone in on another day. The snap volley with his right foot was a little too at gk's fav height or that would have been in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Frank Rijkaard? Fuckin yes please! Would one of the best defenders ever to put a pair of boots on work for a bloke who pays buttons for toadies to keep their gobs shut,in the midst of a relegation fight? He's fuckin Dutch man! Even if he lowered himself to speak to us the conversation with Ashley us likely to be quite short. Great shout and id love to see him here but think is highly unlikely. I deal in the highly unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) In the PL these days you need a mix of the 3 key ingredients or need to excel in at least one of them...Right now we have none of them in the squad. It didn't matter last year cause our strikers were scoring for fun and even half chances were dispatched. There is no real pace in the squad (3/4 players have to have it not just one). Swansea thrive on this as do Arsenal. There is no real power in the squad (so when Tiote is away we don't have much battling in mf). Our mf are all lightweight midgets - Bigi, Anita, Cabaye, Perch...So we get outpowered by mediocre sides - West Ham, Reading, Qpr, Wba etc... You can get away with not having much of those two if you are a crack passing/creative side with movement....err... Our one truly creative players is away watching PSG games. Edited January 20, 2013 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 7075 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) You also need an owner who backs his manager and a manager who backs his players and fans who back at least 2 out of those three. Edited January 20, 2013 by trophyshy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Ill make it simple for you too. All season we have been complaining about the negative tactics, the poor attacking, the creativity......Because...... when we play good attacking football, particularly against the lesser teams, we control the game (as we did yesterday) and they have to worry more about us than we do about them. J69 is spot on. Pardews team talk will have been all about not taking risks, sitting back, holding what we had. Thats why we played shit the first 15 minutes of the second half. Of course his answer was to throw petrol on the fire. You didn't make it simple and you ignored the fact that the problems now are not the problems we had earlier in the season. Just yesterday you were highlighting the Everton away game as representative of our problems. Basically we showed nothing other than 2 Ba goals. The problem yesterday was the opposite, we couldn't shut them out. I have every sympathy for people wanting rid of the manager, I personally fear implosion in this case but I do encourage honest debate which draws upon the actual ideas and points of view put forward. Pardew seems to have solved some problems but created others, defensive organisation would have kept a clean sheet yesterday and taken the 3 points. Defensive organisation was not the criticism earlier in the season. 'Pardew out, we are shit, look I was right' is a simpleton's argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeris 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) You can get away with not having much of those two if you are a crack passing/creative side with movement....err... Our one truly creative players is away watching PSG games. Cabaye, Marveaux, Ben Arfa, Anita (yes!), maybe Bigi (he was expected to develop into a creative playmaker before he came here), they are all trying to create in a system that doesn't allow it, how bout we start to play our squad's strength for once. The only time we see creative players in action is when they do individual stuff. Edited January 20, 2013 by Aeris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Cabaye, Marveaux, Ben Arfa, Anita (yes!), maybe Bigi, they are all trying to create in a system that doesn't allow it, how bout we start to play our squad's strength for once. The only time we see creative players in action is when they do individual stuff. Not sure you can get away in the brute force of PL midfields by playing all 4 without one healthy big black man (a Diame type) or a snarling menace like Tiote. La Liga yes with it's slower tempo and breaks for olives and chorizzo. With Ba gone this is the ideal time (and I agree with you) to play a 433 or 4411 with one mf getting ahead of the ball in posession. Under the circumstances however we need to find a more cogent and ball keeping midfield something like: ......................Cisse ...........Marveux...........Hatem ......................Cabaye............ ...............Tiote............Anita...... We're missing a beast in midfield a M'Villa or a Sissoko in place of Anita who I see as cover for Cabaye (he's a good passer with high pitch intelligence). Never a DM. Bigi isn't ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4711 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 You didn't make it simple and you ignored the fact that the problems now are not the problems we had earlier in the season. You are either arguing for the sake of it or simply hungover. Its so simple. When we are creative, control the ball and attack, the frailty of our defence is less of an issue. When we are negative, sit back and hump the ball, the frailty of our defence is an issue. Cant put it any simpler for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 You are either arguing for the sake of it or simply hungover. Its so simple. When we are creative, control the ball and attack, the frailty of our defence is less of an issue. When we are negative, sit back and hump the ball, the frailty of our defence is an issue. Cant put it any simpler for you. Is this the result of your experiments with quantum computing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj 17 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Love Parky me like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10817 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Not sure you can get away in the brute force of PL midfields by playing all 4 without one healthy big black man (a Diame type) or a snarling menace like Tiote. La Liga yes with it's slower tempo and breaks for olives and chorizzo. With Ba gone this is the ideal time (and I agree with you) to play a 433 or 4411 with one mf getting ahead of the ball in posession. Under the circumstances however we need to find a more cogent and ball keeping midfield something like: ......................Cisse ...........Marveux...........Hatem ......................Cabaye............ ...............Tiote............Anita...... We're missing a beast in midfield a M'Villa or a Sissoko in place of Anita who I see as cover for Cabaye (he's a good passer with high pitch intelligence). Never a DM. Bigi isn't ready. I do similar, but Tiote alone in front of the back four. Anita beside Cabaye ahead of Tiote. Would give Cabaye license to attack more while still having that short-pass link. I'd be worried Cabaye would push ahead, Tiote and Anita would stay too close to the back four and the gap between attack and defence would lead to long hopeful balls from the centrebacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) I do similar, but Tiote alone in front of the back four. Anita beside Cabaye ahead of Tiote. Would give Cabaye license to attack more while still having that short-pass link. I'd be worried Cabaye would push ahead, Tiote and Anita would stay too close to the back four and the gap between attack and defence would lead to long hopeful balls from the centrebacks. See what you're saying. Ideally one of Marv or Hatem should be a withdrawn striker who drops off/or gets behind when the time is right and links the mf and the attack a Dembele, Ruiz or Michu type. See Saurez will do more of that now he has a more up top partner. Fulham and Spurs really suffer when Bale/Dembele or Ruiz don't play...Even Berb couldn't quite do it (bit lazy). It's the way football has gone over the last 5 years and also why we get outnumbered in mf most games. nb Swansea often rarely attack unless the key boys are standing in the right place. They tap the ball around and then 'charge' as soon as the puzzle is complete (even faster now that Laudrup has drilled it into them)...He's got it down to 3/4 players attacking at pace when Rodgers went more sideways till almost the whole team was on its spots. Like with Cabaye in the first half is a wonderful reader of the game and was basically controlling our tempo, as soon as he tired he statered losing contact with Marv. Pardew over compensated with the subs...Should have brought Obertan on and kept their back line and holding mf more paranoid. Edited January 20, 2013 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10817 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 See what you're saying. Ideally one of Marv or Hatem should be a withdrawn striker who drops off/or gets behind when the time is right and links the mf and the attack a Dembele, Ruiz or Michu type. See Saurez will do more of that now he has a more up top partner. It's the way football has gone over the last 5 years and also why we get outnumbered in mf most games. I'd worry about a lack of width if we played either of them as a withdrawn striker. Unless you see Debuchy and Santon as wingbacks? I suppose Tiote or Anita could provide cover to which ever side is attacking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) I'd worry about a lack of width if we played either of them as a withdrawn striker. Unless you see Debuchy and Santon as wingbacks? I suppose Tiote or Anita could provide cover to which ever side is attacking? What happens on the side of the pitch has been irrelevant for at least a decade now. If you have two good CD's no amount of crossing is ever a worry. Look at WH yesterday plonking 46 crosses into the box - end result...Not much. I like active fullbacks and with our current two we have a couple of really good ones, Santon especially (he could play as a wide mf he's that talented). In the modern game the full back is there for final interchanges in the attack phase to draw def to the side but recycle the ball into the middle for the onrushing 2nd striker, attacking mifielders. Podolski althogh looking rather baffling where he plays is essentially a mf/forward (does a bit of crossing but also cuts inside when interchanging with Gibbs)...Guti used to do it very well with Enrique. I like little groups of players sticking close together in zones across the park and moving up in a fast chain. What happens at the sides is only for me to re-gig for territory...Crossing for me is a 50/50 ball with the downside of a counter attack as well. Some of it is good but it shouldn't be the cornerstone of any side nowadays. Even ManU do a lot less of it hence the retooling of Rooney. Edited January 20, 2013 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10817 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 What happens on the side of the pitch has been irrelevant for at least a decade now. If you have two good CD's no amount of crossing is ever a worry. Look at WH yesterday plonking 46 crosses into the box - end result...Not much. Isn't that more down to a lack of good CF? I'd hardly call Nelsen and Onuoha two good CD's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) Isn't that more down to a lack of good CF? I'd hardly call Nelsen and Onuoha two good CD's Think people will see a diffrence with QPR now with Harry in that the CD's will pick up players (space in front - between man and ball) where under Hughes they were marking space. Think Onuha was very highly rated in his early days and lost out to the mass influx at ManCity. By crossing I mean the old fashioned version, floating the ball in from wide positons into general areas (80's football). If you break down where crosses from the top sides actually come from they are really passes. Arsenal and ManU do more cutting back from the edge of the box than the old fashioned cross. Gervinho couldn't really do it properly and Oxo is still learning. SAF gave up with Nani who's too greedy to do it. It does work sometimes but then it's all happenned very fast and the def is less organised. Mourinho talks a lot about tempo loss when the ball goes out wide. He wants it foward quickly to (Drogba) and now Benzema/Ronaldo. Swansea right now are more dangerous than Liv or Arsenal or even Chelsea and that is ALL DOWN to tempo. Laudrup wants it crisp and quick with players ready on their marks as soon as posession changes. If Swansea had a little money they'd be in the top 4 no shadow of a doubt. Laudrup is that good. Edited January 20, 2013 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McFaul 35 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 My point is Stevie, you know fine well yourself we've had some fucking superb support throughout the years, home and away, against good teams and against dross and we've lost loads of times. We lost a game v Sheff Wed at home in a relegation cunch match, it was one of the biggest gates of the season. Was that the fans fault? A few boos don't help but they shouldn't be brought up in mitigation otherwise what's the excuse when they've had great backing in the past? Fucking we, of all clubs, should know this? I agree with that. Pardew is a plum mate, I'm the only one on here who's consistently said he's an arsehole even when we were 5th. At the same time, I don't think he's a shit manager, my two major problems with Pardew are his rimming of the board, no manager in world football praises their directors more than him, and his patronising way towards toon fans, which started with his lie about see a full kit wanker in a petrol station on his first visit to Tyneside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 You are either arguing for the sake of it or simply hungover. Its so simple. When we are creative, control the ball and attack, the frailty of our defence is less of an issue. When we are negative, sit back and hump the ball, the frailty of our defence is an issue. Cant put it any simpler for you. So when we attack like at Arsenal and Man U the frailty of our defence is not an issue but when we are negative and sit back like at Norwich we let loads of goals in? Just pipe down fatty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hostile_statue 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 My main problem with Pardew is that he's uninspiring. The complete opposite of KK or Sir Bobby in that respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10817 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 My main problem with Pardew is that he's uninspiring. The complete opposite of KK or Sir Bobby in that respect. Love to see a new right hand man come in, iih Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeris 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 (edited) So when we attack like at Arsenal and Man U the frailty of our defence is not an issue but when we are negative and sit back like at Norwich we let loads of goals in? Just pipe down fatty. You are dumb Chez, Arsenal and Man U was not anything like Norwich, as Arsenal and Man U was probably all out attacking themselves because they thought we were an easy win. Sitting behind is never a good thing as it overloads the pressure on defense, and with our defense even against the weakest of teams...well, we need defenders who actually offers something defensively to do that.. didnt Pardew order the team to sit behind against Arsenal right before the goals started raining the fuck in? Edited January 20, 2013 by Aeris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 10817 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 You are dumb Chez, Arsenal and Man U was not anything like Norwich, as Arsenal and Man U was probably all out attacking themselves because they thought we were an easy win. Sitting behind is never a good thing as it overloads the pressure on defense, and with our defense even against the weakest of teams...I say no more. Oh, how I wish I could believe you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeris 0 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Oh, how I wish I could believe you. never liked you or chez tbh. bastards both of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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