Old Board vs New Board

[LeazesMag 0]

I don't give a shit about a miniscule amount for a warehouse when he backs his managers with enough money to put together teams to qualify for the Champions League and increase the clubs revenue and profile while doing it.

 

 

What about him backing Souness to rip apart that team, where does that fit into your bromance?

 

so are you saying a football club should appoint a manager and not back their appointment ?

 

Mike Ashley will love you

 

Tbf like, as much a GS destroyed a team (much like when KD followed KK), you have to let the manager do his job. You cant put a manager in place and then not buy into his vision for the team. Unless you want to run it like we tried with KK and the reason KK walked.

 

exactly. And only a total buffoon would subscribe to the theory that you appoint someone to a job in any walk of life and not support your chosen appointment.

[Guest]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

[LeazesMag 0]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

I see. So you think every club appoints trophy winners who all bring automatic success to clubs then ? Or do you think we should have found the new Alex Ferguson despite every other club in the UK also trying to do exactly the same thing.

 

At the end of the day lad, only 4 clubs did better than the Halls and Shepherd over their 15 years. End of.

[JawD 99]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

Different matter. But of course correct in the matter of GS. They had an issue with control of the younger players under SBR and sought to address the problem by hitting that small crack with a TNT tipped sledgehammer. I think the GS appointment was one of the worst in the last decade. Many have said Blackburn were weeks away from giving him the boot. What we hoped to achieve under him was boggling. But, despite what many may think, its not like we had managers beating our door down. Easy for us to say What about Houllier or ONeil et al, but who actually wanted to come? Now dont get me wrong, given where SBR had left us I think there must have been some higher calibre interest than GS, but as to who. Who knows.

 

Can't just slate FS for bringing in GS though without saying they done well getting SBR (albiet later than we would all have liked).

[Renton 21227]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

Different matter. But of course correct in the matter of GS. They had an issue with control of the younger players under SBR and sought to address the problem by hitting that small crack with a TNT tipped sledgehammer. I think the GS appointment was one of the worst in the last decade. Many have said Blackburn were weeks away from giving him the boot. What we hoped to achieve under him was boggling. But, despite what many may think, its not like we had managers beating our door down. Easy for us to say What about Houllier or ONeil et al, but who actually wanted to come? Now dont get me wrong, given where SBR had left us I think there must have been some higher calibre interest than GS, but as to who. Who knows.

 

Can't just slate FS for bringing in GS though without saying they done well getting SBR (albiet later than we would all have liked).

 

The bit in bold, why was that? Could it be because of the ridiculous timing and the appalling nature of Robson's dismissal? As for giving them credit for appointing Robson in the first place, I'd give them almost no credit for that personally. He was the absolute stand out obvious choice, yet if you read his autobiography, they very nearly fucked it up by offering him a derisory salary. For me, the Halls and Shepherd did almost nothing right from August 2004 onwards, simple as that. I blame Hall jnr most though.

 

I have absolutely no intention of getting into these same tired arguments again btw, but couldn't let this go.

[JawD 99]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

Different matter. But of course correct in the matter of GS. They had an issue with control of the younger players under SBR and sought to address the problem by hitting that small crack with a TNT tipped sledgehammer. I think the GS appointment was one of the worst in the last decade. Many have said Blackburn were weeks away from giving him the boot. What we hoped to achieve under him was boggling. But, despite what many may think, its not like we had managers beating our door down. Easy for us to say What about Houllier or ONeil et al, but who actually wanted to come? Now dont get me wrong, given where SBR had left us I think there must have been some higher calibre interest than GS, but as to who. Who knows.

 

Can't just slate FS for bringing in GS though without saying they done well getting SBR (albiet later than we would all have liked).

 

The bit in bold, why was that? Could it be because of the ridiculous timing and the appalling nature of Robson's dismissal? As for giving them credit for appointing Robson in the first place, I'd give them almost no credit for that personally. He was the absolute stand out obvious choice, yet if you read his autobiography, they very nearly fucked it up by offering him a derisory salary. For me, the Halls and Shepherd did almost nothing right from August 2004 onwards, simple as that. I blame Hall jnr most though.

 

I have absolutely no intention of getting into these same tired arguments again btw, but couldn't let this go.

 

I dont mind discussing any of this, I just stand back when people start spitting out dummies as I cant be arsed with all that As for Hall Jnr, Im not sure I can blame him for anything as I'm not sure what he actually done other than bleed the club (and his wife) of cash for salaries or dividends. I keep saying, but I think the moment everything went tits up was going out at home to Partizan. I just dont think FS had a plan B. Next followed the shocking departure (as you say, timing mainly) of SBR leaving a team that needed guidance under a father figure for some of the younger players. I've not checked, but I dont think Id be far wrong in saying thats when the finances started to tumble as well. A few new managers, transfer budgets, contract settlements, poor purchases, drop in revenue later and we're fucked. I cant slate FS for the whole period they had the club but I was one of many wanting a change by the end.

[donaldstott 0]

It's a long time since we last had a moment of unbelievable PR fuckwittery at SJP.

 

Question: If we dryhump the mackems 3-nil at the end of next month, could Ashley go and have a pint in the Bigg Market like he used to?

[Renton 21227]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

Different matter. But of course correct in the matter of GS. They had an issue with control of the younger players under SBR and sought to address the problem by hitting that small crack with a TNT tipped sledgehammer. I think the GS appointment was one of the worst in the last decade. Many have said Blackburn were weeks away from giving him the boot. What we hoped to achieve under him was boggling. But, despite what many may think, its not like we had managers beating our door down. Easy for us to say What about Houllier or ONeil et al, but who actually wanted to come? Now dont get me wrong, given where SBR had left us I think there must have been some higher calibre interest than GS, but as to who. Who knows.

 

Can't just slate FS for bringing in GS though without saying they done well getting SBR (albiet later than we would all have liked).

 

The bit in bold, why was that? Could it be because of the ridiculous timing and the appalling nature of Robson's dismissal? As for giving them credit for appointing Robson in the first place, I'd give them almost no credit for that personally. He was the absolute stand out obvious choice, yet if you read his autobiography, they very nearly fucked it up by offering him a derisory salary. For me, the Halls and Shepherd did almost nothing right from August 2004 onwards, simple as that. I blame Hall jnr most though.

 

I have absolutely no intention of getting into these same tired arguments again btw, but couldn't let this go.

 

I dont mind discussing any of this, I just stand back when people start spitting out dummies as I cant be arsed with all that As for Hall Jnr, Im not sure I can blame him for anything as I'm not sure what he actually done other than bleed the club (and his wife) of cash for salaries or dividends. I keep saying, but I think the moment everything went tits up was going out at home to Partizan. I just dont think FS had a plan B. Next followed the shocking departure (as you say, timing mainly) of SBR leaving a team that needed guidance under a father figure for some of the younger players. I've not checked, but I dont think Id be far wrong in saying thats when the finances started to tumble as well. A few new managers, transfer budgets, contract settlements, poor purchases, drop in revenue later and we're fucked. I cant slate FS for the whole period they had the club but I was one of many wanting a change by the end.

 

Well that's enough really, but again, if you read Robson's autobiography, it is clearly Hall Jnr that is the snake in the grass and the prime mover behind Robson's dismissal. Remember his ridiculous quote of (paraphrasing here) 'we would have been relegated [in 2005-2005] if we'd kept Robson, nothing could be more certain?'. Then we got Souness. Getting angry thinking about this tbh, the board's actions that year were simply unforgiveable imo.

 

Partizan was a massive set back but did it have to be terminal? If so, then why, when Shepherd had categorically stated we weren't relying on CL money? If that was the begining of the end then Souness was one fuck off nail in the coffin.

[JawD 99]

Well, I think we were relying on CL money by then. Ive nothing to base that on ofc, just my opinion.

 

could Ashley go and have a pint in the Bigg Market like he used to?

 

I throw a second question to that. Are the almighty fuck ups by Ashleys unforgivable? Mainly on KK, comments from the tribunal, relegation, etc? Or, is there a point in time when we take stock and say "you know what? we are now in a better position than we were in before he bought the club".

 

Could you go for a pint down the big market? Well, he'd deserved to be lamped for going there in the first place, but there is always some uneducated numpty wanting to be clever so I'd say probably no.

 

Does he have a future at the club? I wouldnt rule it out but every time I think he has learned from his mistakes around the corner is another almighty fuck up.

[Park Life 71]

Well, I think we were relying on CL money by then. Ive nothing to base that on ofc, just my opinion.

 

could Ashley go and have a pint in the Bigg Market like he used to?

 

I throw a second question to that. Are the almighty fuck ups by Ashleys unforgivable? Mainly on KK, comments from the tribunal, relegation, etc? Or, is there a point in time when we take stock and say "you know what? we are now in a better position than we were in before he bought the club".

 

Could you go for a pint down the big market? Well, he'd deserved to be lamped for going there in the first place, but there is always some uneducated numpty wanting to be clever so I'd say probably no.

 

Does he have a future at the club? I wouldnt rule it out but every time I think he has learned from his mistakes around the corner is another almighty fuck up.

 

While they keep quiet and while decent players come in and CH is allowed to get on with it, I'm holding fire. With them you do always wonder if there is something round the corner waiting to jump up and bite.

[TicTacWoe 0]

Well, I think we were relying on CL money by then. Ive nothing to base that on ofc, just my opinion.

 

could Ashley go and have a pint in the Bigg Market like he used to?

 

I throw a second question to that. Are the almighty fuck ups by Ashleys unforgivable? Mainly on KK, comments from the tribunal, relegation, etc? Or, is there a point in time when we take stock and say "you know what? we are now in a better position than we were in before he bought the club".

 

Could you go for a pint down the big market? Well, he'd deserved to be lamped for going there in the first place, but there is always some uneducated numpty wanting to be clever so I'd say probably no.

 

Does he have a future at the club? I wouldnt rule it out but every time I think he has learned from his mistakes around the corner is another almighty fuck up.

 

While they keep quiet and while decent players come in and CH is allowed to get on with it, I'm holding fire. With them you do always wonder if there is something round the corner waiting to jump up and bite.

 

Pretty much sums up my feelings on Ashley at the moment, sensible signings like Tiote and Ben Arfa have given me a bit more enthusiasm for the future but we'll have to wait and see, they've certainly fucked up enough in the past to make even the most optimistic fan cautious.

[LeazesMag 0]

I still want to see peaspud's response to my post BTW.

 

So do I mate.

 

This post?

 

Given those actions that were taken, how do you think we can start to operate at a profit? The difference in winnings according to the position on the league table is very small. I guess the only way would be to improve the corporate revenue. Performances on the pitch may go a large way towards doing that, but given the changes in the financial climate it's to be expected that there would be a shortfall in that area by comparison to 2007-2008 and before.

Theres two things need to be done to get us operating at a profit:

 

Firstly we need to get the advertisers and corporate sponsors back on board and the only way to do that is to give them a team that their clients will want to come and see. What you have to remember is neither of those entities have any real affiliation to the club, they are using a football team as a means to get their name out to the widest audience and/or entertain potential clients. The day we were relegated a number of corporate sponsors will have moved 10 miles down the road. What sounds better to a potential multi-million pound client "today we're taking you to see the local team play Manchester United" or "today we thought we'd treat you to the wonder of Stockport". Once they've moved and got their box with the scum then its going to be hard to get them back unless the reverse happens or we make them an offer too good to refuse but while theres the threat of relegation then they'll not want the hassle.

 

Secondly is merchandising, sales of the famous black and white stripes across the world, sales in Newcastle would not have dropped by hugely significant numbers if they had given us a shirt of the Adidas quality but as it stands some have been lost through that. Worldwide though and we've been hit heavily by the shite thats gone on. No longer are we everyones second team or the entertainers, we no longer have players the calibre of Shearer that make kids up and down the country want to replicate being them in the playground by pulling on the shirt. Same goes for abroad, its players that sell shirts to the Japanese and Africans not clubs. Man U shirts are embalzoned with Rooney (especially in Thailand ) while numerous kids in Tokyo wear LA Galaxy shirts purely for the word Beckham.

 

Have a successful team and you sell shirts, mugs, calendars, posters, branded bog roll, you name it they'll buy it. You tie up sponsorship deals with Asian network tv to launch your own channel etc etc.

 

Contrary to what you may think Im in no way a Shepherd lover, I danced a fucking jig the day Ashley took over and berated Leazes about it but I can clearly see the gulf between him and the current lot. Shepherd knew how to maximise the assets we had, yes it went to shit but not because of off the field business decisions.

 

All basic common sense, unfortunately one or two people are genuinely thick as mince so are unable to see it.

[LeazesMag 0]

Oh wait, you linked to the 2nd page of the article. Useless cunt

 

[LeazesMag 0]

You're using the wrong end point for Shepherd and the wrong starting point for Ashley. The accounts you have highlighted as the last set of accounts for Shepherd were the second last set. A year later and the profit was turned into a loss and the outlook was terrible as we didn't look like we were capable of changing anything going to a probable and well forecasted credit crunch which was certain to reduce income from the corporate sector. And before anybody claims we weren’t in a credit crunch, it was coming and the only uncertainty was when.

 

I dont believe I am.

 

Research by top football finance analysts Deloitte has revealed the club was one of only eight Premier League clubs to make a profit in the 2006/07 season – down from 16 the previous year.

 

The 2006/07 season would have ran from Aug 2006 to May 2007.

 

Ashley bought Halls shares in May 2007 and Shepherds in the June so he came into the club at the end of the 2006/07 season ie directly after the end of the season being talked about by Deloittes. If the article means to report a profit in 2006/07 then thats badly worded to say the least but again I would imagine thats not the case seeing as how it wasnt written about until May 2008.

 

I don't care what you believe or not, you're miles away and like I said a year out.

 

The accounts which you are on about are not the last set of accounts of Shepherd and I know that because I've got them all in front of me since 2004. The last set of accounts under the Hall/Shepherd regime covered up to 30th June 2007 and was signed off by Chris Mort who had just become Chairman. The accounts which you should be looking at for the end of the previous regime were available from Companies House dated 26th January 2008. Those set of accounts were showing us making a loss, not a profit, all of the figures were going south and were always going to get worse ongoing.

 

What about the profit Ashley made last season? Are these figures still current or did NUSC revise them?

 

playing in the 2nd division ? Do you [stupidly I may add] deem that to be successful ?

[LeazesMag 0]

Sums up how I feel totally. Leazes will think you're saying that Ashley will get us to the Champions League more times than the Halls did though.

 

 

Champions League? Fucking hell, were as far away from that as we are from the moon but we're no further from it than we were before Ashley came, we might even be closer to it. I'm sure of one thing, if we do get a manager who gives us our best Champions League finish ever we'll not sack the bastard because he only finishes 5th top of the league.

 

it will never happen under Ashley, or anybody else who tries to run a big club like us in the manner of a corner shop.

 

So your observation is totally, utterly irrlevant.

[LeazesMag 0]

I'm not bothered about how you correctly quantify the true level of indebtedness of the club at the point of acquisition tbh and I think people are wasting their time trying to. It's a moot point for me; if Ashley wasnt bothered to look into it himself before hand, that's entirely his fault. For all he pines on now, you could equally argue he's lucky the club weren't in even more debt if that was the extent of his inquiries at the time.

 

If the true debt now causes Ashley trouble and affects the way in which he can meaningfully take the club forward then that is his fault and he must take the blame for it. If on the other hand, through the austerity that has been forced upon him out of his own ignorance, he can somehow find a way to establish better overall management of the business, and this ultimately filters down into good value investment on the playing field then fair enough. I think that will be the extent of his virtues if he does manage that and we'd be at a stage where he truly had 'taken the club as far as he could', meaning we'd be looking for a more visionary successor, but hopefully we'd be a more attractive proposition to one by that stage for the reasons mentioned. Time will tell.

 

you have to wonder how the guy ever made his billions if we was so stupid not to do due dilligence before a takeover. i reckon he's just a barrow boy gambler type that came good and actually fluked his whole fortune. why does he never do interviews? probably because he's as thick as two short planks. the guy is a joke among City analysts

 

in a nutshell

[LeazesMag 0]

We have an owner that had a debt-ridden ridden club, but could afford to get it relegated. Therefore he's not running it dangerously.

 

Anyone care to suggest or guess what would have happened had we gone down under Shepherd/Hall? And don't say it wouldn't have happened, we were tailspinning long before Ashley came in.

 

it wouldn't have happened.

[Guest]

Perhaps, just perhaps, his criticism is being stupid enough to appoint him in the first place

 

I see. So you think every club appoints trophy winners who all bring automatic success to clubs then ? Or do you think we should have found the new Alex Ferguson despite every other club in the UK also trying to do exactly the same thing.

 

At the end of the day lad, only 4 clubs did better than the Halls and Shepherd over their 15 years. End of.

 

So Freddy thought souness might be the next sir Alex? you're a fuckin' idiot

[LeazesMag 0]

There was hardly 'cuts' before relegation was there? We sold Milner because he wanted to leave, and we got a price that everyone thought was inflated at the time. We sold Given and Insomnia because they wanted out, not to cut costs. The summer before relegation we paid big money for Colo, decent money (in the end) for Jonas, in the January we paid a canny bit for Nolan. The major 'cost cutting' came after relegation, which I think was justified.

 

Why did those players want out and why weren't they replaced once they left?

 

 

One is whingey little french prick, Shay has been releasing whinges in the press about needing to sign players to challenge for a few seasons, he'd obviously got wind of City's interest imo. Insomnia was already replaced in Jonas. Milner arguably wasn't replaced properly, though the club did sign both Guthrie and Nolan, so in terms of numbers it could have been thought that we were ok in midfield.

 

After all those years at the club, they just decided it was time? Nothing to do with being touted around by the club or having a laughing stock of a manager in Joe Kinnear hurtling us towards relegation one cringeworthy soundbite at a time?

 

 

I think if Manchester City with an oil tycoon had bid for Shay when Bellamy was throwing chairs about and calling Souness a liar... he'd have wanted out then too.

 

 

He might have.....but then any approach would have been turned down....

 

http://www.sunderlandecho.com/sport/sunder..._move_1_1118419

 

 

And that's a good thing? If a player wants out, then blocking a move isn't exactly going to best move, is it?

 

I think we're in the process now of proving that it's a much healthier team when the players actually want to be here.

 

sub standard players playing above their station, or top quality players who want to stay at the club because they think the club is trying to win trophies and play regularly in europe ?

 

You won't get this. I'm taking the view of HF, debating with you is a waste of time.

[Guest]

dream land

[Guest]

By your logic, what's wrong with signing Leon best? What about all the other clubs looking for the next pele?

[TicTacWoe 0]

is it too late to agree to disagree?

[LeazesMag 0]

By your logic, what's wrong with signing Leon best? What about all the other clubs looking for the next pele?

 

by your logic, then he would be !!!

[Guest]

By your logic, what's wrong with signing Leon best? What about all the other clubs looking for the next pele?

 

by your logic, then he would be !!!

 

 

Well it didn't take the thick cunt long to get confused

 

Discussion over

[TicTacWoe 0]

By your logic, what's wrong with signing Leon best? What about all the other clubs looking for the next pele?

 

by your logic, then he would be !!!

 

 

Well it didn't take the thick cunt long to get confused

 

Discussion over