LeazesMag 0 Posted August 17, 2010 Share Posted August 17, 2010 Aye, they were always close games when Sheppy was around Fuck off man have you anything constructive to add here, regarding what is required at the football club to improve and attempt to challenge the top clubs ? We won't challenge the top clubs for a long time. We got up there, dropped out, and wasted too much money ontoo many shit managers trying to get back in. No club can mount a continuous challenge to the top clubs for years and years, and when it slips away you have to pick up the pieces and start again. in other words, it could take a long time before someone comes in and matches what the Halls and Shepherd did ? Fine. I can accept that. Thanks for admitting it at last. Back to the thread............. Any owner who does not harbour the highest of ambitions and is prepared to back their managers is basically not good enough or suitable enough for Newcastle United. And when we have someone who does not have these aspirations we should make it quite clear that this is the case and all be in total agreement that the sooner they fuck off the better, accepting they make mistakes of course, in what is a knife edge high profile sport where there are very few "winners". No, in other words, what the Halls and Shepherd did before they left, blowing a massive wad of cash trying and failing to claw back into the top 4 has restricted what we aim for now. Where do you expect investment to come from? The previous owners weren't investing money, in fact they were taking money out of the club when they joined, we had 1 foot in the 3rd division. You obviously don't realise this. Now you are being told. If you don't want to listen to people with more knowledge than you, don't, this is the last time I try to educate you. You're a waste of space lad. Stick with Ashley and the no hopers if you prefer. Like I said, your absurd argument is tantamount to saying Keegan was shit because he didn't sustain a 12 point lead at the top of the premiership. Gan to bed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 17, 2010 Share Posted August 17, 2010 Tbf we haven't been competing with Man Utd for years. At least 6. The cup semi-final in 2005 was no better than yesterday's performance. Last time we were competing with them was under Robson (probably the game where Keane was sent off having tried to lamp Shearer) and even then they always just had the edge. We have had a few beatings by them, but the difference was that we had a quality enough to have a go and think we had a chance to give as good as we got. The worst thing of all is just to sit back and accept inferiority and be happy to keep the score down. That 2-6 game was a freak, we always had a chance against them, and if we'd not missed a sitter at 1-0 after 30 mins we'd have been 2-0 up instead of 1-4 down at half time. The difference is SBR was an intelligent man, but it doesn't take a genius to build a good team. Your teams need five things which largely only a manager can provide: Character: It seemed every week we'd go behind in the good days under Robson, we did against Leeds four times in that era to my mind, we even did it at Highbury we fought for 90 minutes Ability/spotting ability: Classic case with Bellers, absolutely ridiculed at Coventry, FFS questioned SBR's desire to bring him in, but he knew he wasn't a winger which is where he was employed there, brung him in the middle and he was sensational for us at times, a real success. You need a team of talented players. Pace: I'm a firm believer that at least 6 of your players have to be exceptionally quick, we had Dyer, Bellamy, Robert was quick, Jenas, Bernard had pace, and that pace made the difference we were as quick as Arsenal were then for a while. Team Spirit: You can have all of the above but if you don't have this you underperform massively Respect for the club: There wasn't too many of them who were wanting to be away we were viewed with respect we had players who we couldn't even dream of now who were linked with us, and we could attract them To be honest, I don't care how many times I hear what a great bunch of lads there are at the toon, and how good the team spirit is, I was in the motor earlier listening to Super Alc, and he was spot on. Barton last night played like he genuinely didn't care, and there were one or two others, but particularly Barton. I don't think the team spirit is as good as it's made out, and that is the only one of those five facets you could even put an argument up for saying we have across the side, the squad and the club. SBR got the lot, KK got the lot, and until we have a manager who can get these five assets back in the team then I'm afraid the best we can hope to be is a massively supported Bolton. I can't understand managers who sign slow players. Look at Vieira, a magnificent player for Arsenal for years, but everyone knows he's finished because he can't run, Mancini isn't a brilliant manager and he'll be gone. If I was a chairman of a football club I'd judge my managers performance over three years with those criteria I've listed above, and if we're all honest we have none of them. Very good mate. I don't believe the spirit is as good as it's painted out to be either, they are on the crest of a wave at the moment after a good campaign last year having stepped down a level to a level that suited some of them, we know who they are. A few more early defeats and the cracks will appear quite quickly. I totally agree with your comments about pace and running, football is a game for highly trained men who need to perform like top athletes. Players such as Bellamy have such desire they transform poor or average balls into good ones through sheer determination and desire, these sort of attributes are much undervalued by people who see players do fancy things with a football but lack heart and disappear when the going gets tough. I don't like losing as much as the next guy, but give me a team who attempts to win the game more than one who sits back and tries to keep the score down anyday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTF 7485 Posted August 17, 2010 Share Posted August 17, 2010 Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where old timers can argue about things in the past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4856 Posted August 17, 2010 Share Posted August 17, 2010 Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where old timers can argue about things in the past? +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohhh_yeah 2991 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where old timers can argue about things in the past? +1 Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where haters request changes made about things they hate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 We've never beaten Man U at Old Trafford in the Prem btw. That's how close we've come to 'matching them'. Sad reality check for the rose tinters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 And for the record, those that have: Chelsea x 5 Liverpool x 4 Arsenal x 3 Middlesbrough x 3 Derby x 2 West Ham x 2 Bolton x 2 Wimbledon Notts Forest Leicester Aston Villa Blackburn Fulham Mcr City Everton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Aye, they were always close games when Sheppy was around Fuck off man have you anything constructive to add here, regarding what is required at the football club to improve and attempt to challenge the top clubs ? We won't challenge the top clubs for a long time. We got up there, dropped out, and wasted too much money ontoo many shit managers trying to get back in. No club can mount a continuous challenge to the top clubs for years and years, and when it slips away you have to pick up the pieces and start again. in other words, it could take a long time before someone comes in and matches what the Halls and Shepherd did ? Fine. I can accept that. Thanks for admitting it at last. Back to the thread............. Any owner who does not harbour the highest of ambitions and is prepared to back their managers is basically not good enough or suitable enough for Newcastle United. And when we have someone who does not have these aspirations we should make it quite clear that this is the case and all be in total agreement that the sooner they fuck off the better, accepting they make mistakes of course, in what is a knife edge high profile sport where there are very few "winners". No, in other words, what the Halls and Shepherd did before they left, blowing a massive wad of cash trying and failing to claw back into the top 4 has restricted what we aim for now. Where do you expect investment to come from? The previous owners weren't investing money, in fact they were taking money out of the club when they joined, we had 1 foot in the 3rd division. You obviously don't realise this. Now you are being told. If you don't want to listen to people with more knowledge than you, don't, this is the last time I try to educate you. You're a waste of space lad. Stick with Ashley and the no hopers if you prefer. Like I said, your absurd argument is tantamount to saying Keegan was shit because he didn't sustain a 12 point lead at the top of the premiership. Gan to bed Mental hospital. How the fuck does what they did in the 90s change where we were at the end? At the end we spent a lot of money by trying and failing to get back into the top 4. This is where the club was at during the takeover. Do you think Shepherd could have just pulled another 50 million from somewhere and tried again? The answer you're looking for is no. Shepherd blew that opportunity, and that's why he appointed fat sam, a manager with a reputation of results on a shoestring. Again I repeat, Ashley took over the club in 2007, which is not, I repeat, is not, in the fucking 1990s. Again I ask this, and hope for an answer this time. Do you think Shepherd would have been able to keep spending if Ashley had not bought the club, and if so, where would the money have came from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohhh_yeah 2991 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 And for the record, those that have: Chelsea x 5 Liverpool x 4 Arsenal x 3 Middlesbrough x 3 Derby x 2 West Ham x 2 Bolton x 2 Wimbledon Notts Forest Leicester Aston Villa Blackburn Fulham Mcr City Everton pipe down idiot. Nobody is talking about beating manu in any one game, but how many of those clubs qualified for europe more than we did ? Take a reality check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tuco Ramirez Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? We lost 3-0 you big Stoke cunt, and you're happy to go to such a "brilliant stadium". Absolutely seriously here, I think we've reached rock bottom. Rock bottom. Hughton clearly has no clue about this club when his players are coming out with remarks like this and he's allowing his players to beg to swap shirts with the "United" players after a humiliation. Rock bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolly Potter MD 0 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Aye, they were always close games when Sheppy was around Fuck off man We held our own at Old Trafford, in 01/02. Apart from one ultimately deciding moment - where from a cross Van Nistleroy found the slightest of spaces in the box: Distin [playing in the centre] lost his footing - we held our own with a similar tactical mindset. We still had the necessary cattle [at least during the SBR years] to pull of that so-called smash & grab away performance ie. comfortable/assured at the back, with the weapons/outlets needed to hit them on the break. BTW you seem to forget that Shepherd [even during the Keegan years], along with Fletcher/Hall Jr, was at the forefront of the club's running at the front-office level. Shepherd's involvement still unfairly underrated, when speaking of the days were punching with Man United. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 22143 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Mods, can there be a sub-forum created where old timers can argue about things in the past? +1 +2 it is a bit tedious the way almost every thread is derailed into a pro/anti shepherd debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? We lost 3-0 you big Stoke cunt, and you're happy to go to such a "brilliant stadium". Absolutely seriously here, I think we've reached rock bottom. Rock bottom. Hughton clearly has no clue about this club when his players are coming out with remarks like this and he's allowing his players to beg to swap shirts with the "United" players after a humiliation. Rock bottom. Talking like a Premier league tourist as if he plays for Barnsley or Reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JawD 99 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? We lost 3-0 you big Stoke cunt, and you're happy to go to such a "brilliant stadium". Absolutely seriously here, I think we've reached rock bottom. Rock bottom. Hughton clearly has no clue about this club when his players are coming out with remarks like this and he's allowing his players to beg to swap shirts with the "United" players after a humiliation. Rock bottom. Agree with your sentiment here like. Do we really want our players getting all starry eyed when going to places like OT? Have we really fell that far? Actually, dont answer that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tuco Ramirez Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? We lost 3-0 you big Stoke cunt, and you're happy to go to such a "brilliant stadium". Absolutely seriously here, I think we've reached rock bottom. Rock bottom. Hughton clearly has no clue about this club when his players are coming out with remarks like this and he's allowing his players to beg to swap shirts with the "United" players after a humiliation. Rock bottom. Agree with your sentiment here like. Do we really want our players getting all starry eyed when going to places like OT? Have we really fell that far? Actually, dont answer that.... I remember Premiership days where opposition players were getting stary eyed coming to St James'. Year zero we got battered in 01/02 at OT 5-3 flattered us. The one season we were the better side was that 0-0 draw when Woody played like Bobby Moore, and Jenas hit the bar in the last minute. 03/04 I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 22143 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 calm down lads. we'll learn more after the next couple of home games. i've got my finger hovering over the panic button but am going to give it until at least after the transfer window shuts, and then if we sign a couple of decent players until autumn time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 (edited) calm down lads. we'll learn more after the next couple of home games. i've got my finger hovering over the panic button but am going to give it until at least after the transfer window shuts, and then if we sign a couple of decent players until autumn time. I'm not too pacicked to tell you the truth. Looking at the performances over the weekend we're no worse than Wigan, West Ham, West Brom, Bolton, Fulham, the Mackems and Birmingham. I'm sure Blackpool won't keep up that form either. I think the stability is worth another 9 points we threw away with our mind on other things when we went down. Doesn't mean anyone should have enjoyed anything about Monday night. Edited August 18, 2010 by Happy Face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 ---Mike Williamson--- "It was my first game in the Premier League, and I was happy to come to such a brilliant stadium," Williamson told the Gazette. "The adrenaline was going, and it was amazing, but it's been overshadowed by the result a little bit. "It was unbelievable – it's what dreams are made of – but at the end of the day, we need to stay in the league. We're not here just to turn up for one season. "I suppose you need to recap and look at the negatives, take the positives, and kick on for next week." "It's one of the best teams in England, and we always knew it was going to be a tough test, but the boys are disappointed," added Williamson. "In patches, we showed resilience, and we defended well. "Andy had a good chance in the first half, but all in all we didn't really create too many chances and got sloppy in our defending. "Overall, we're very disappointed. I know it was a big occasion, but we came here to get something from the game, not just turn up. "I don't think it's going to get any tougher than Old Trafford on the opening day. "You take the positives, keep working, and make sure you get a result next week. We need to get the points on the board. "We'll recover, regroup and go again." http://www.shieldsgazette.com/nufc/William...-for.6479246.jp? We lost 3-0 you big Stoke cunt, and you're happy to go to such a "brilliant stadium". Absolutely seriously here, I think we've reached rock bottom. Rock bottom. Hughton clearly has no clue about this club when his players are coming out with remarks like this and he's allowing his players to beg to swap shirts with the "United" players after a humiliation. Rock bottom. Agree with your sentiment here like. Do we really want our players getting all starry eyed when going to places like OT? Have we really fell that far? Actually, dont answer that.... spot on but too subtle for some Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FCUM 1 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Match went pretty much as expected for me. Man Ud dominated without being really able to turn their superiority into goals. For you I think there were some positive signs. Carroll will be a handful for a lot of teams this year, I was particularly impressed with his workrate. His finishing will improve with experience but he could do with a bit more pace down the flanks pinging in the crosses. Your problems, for me, are identical to the problems you had 2 years ago. That midfield triumverate of Barton, Nolan & Smith are past their sell by date. No energy or passion. The pace of premiership football passes them by. You need rid of them all but they are not going anywhere because of the money, you're stuck with them until their contracts expire. The time Man Utd's midfield had on the ball was frightening. You need some younger blood in midfield harrying the opposition. As far as Man Utd go, they will be thereabouts again this season but they really need to offload Berbatov quickly, he's killing their game. He's a tidy footballer but he wants to slow everything down 'continental style'. Man Utd are at their best attacking with pace and it all grinds to a halt when Berbatov puts his foot on the ball. Good luck for the season. Guthrie and Rodwell later in the season might just give you the midfield energy you need provided Hughton has the balls to drop the has beens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 14013 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 The important part of that article is ''It was my first game in the Premier League''. You're being very harsh to him and some people need a reality check. Yes long term our aspirations should be much higher than just staying in the league but at the moment we are a newly promoted club and for a couple of players It will be something new and a step up. Williamson put in a good performance and without a serious amount of investment which we clearly dont have it's hard for any newly promoted club to go to Old Trafford and play one of the best teams in the country and pick up anything other than a lashing. 3-0 isn't as bad as it could have been and a lot of other clubs in this division who go there and even get that same result wont be half as arsed about it as us just because we happened to be in with a chance of beating them in the 90's. Seriously man wake up! There are a lot of teams in this division who could beat us 3-0 comfortably but our aim is to stay in the league. Expectations have fallen dramatically but that was over a year ago now and I don't think under Ashley we can have any decent expectations and with the money being banded about it's not surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Your problems, for me, are identical to the problems you had 2 years ago. That midfield triumverate of Barton, Nolan & Smith are past their sell by date. No energy or passion. The pace of premiership football passes them by. You need rid of them all but they are not going anywhere because of the money, you're stuck with them until their contracts expire. The time Man Utd's midfield had on the ball was frightening. You need some younger blood in midfield harrying the opposition. Joe Kinnear saw Nolan as our Premier League saviour when he bought him 2 years ago. He was meant to improve our midfield from the limitations of Butt, Smith, Geremi and Duff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2207 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Your problems, for me, are identical to the problems you had 2 years ago. That midfield triumverate of Barton, Nolan & Smith are past their sell by date. No energy or passion. The pace of premiership football passes them by. You need rid of them all but they are not going anywhere because of the money, you're stuck with them until their contracts expire. The time Man Utd's midfield had on the ball was frightening. You need some younger blood in midfield harrying the opposition. Spot on, sadly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tuco Ramirez Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 Match went pretty much as expected for me. Man Ud dominated without being really able to turn their superiority into goals. For you I think there were some positive signs. Carroll will be a handful for a lot of teams this year, I was particularly impressed with his workrate. His finishing will improve with experience but he could do with a bit more pace down the flanks pinging in the crosses. Your problems, for me, are identical to the problems you had 2 years ago. That midfield triumverate of Barton, Nolan & Smith are past their sell by date. No energy or passion. The pace of premiership football passes them by. You need rid of them all but they are not going anywhere because of the money, you're stuck with them until their contracts expire. The time Man Utd's midfield had on the ball was frightening. You need some younger blood in midfield harrying the opposition. As far as Man Utd go, they will be thereabouts again this season but they really need to offload Berbatov quickly, he's killing their game. He's a tidy footballer but he wants to slow everything down 'continental style'. Man Utd are at their best attacking with pace and it all grinds to a halt when Berbatov puts his foot on the ball. Good luck for the season. Guthrie and Rodwell later in the season might just give you the midfield energy you need provided Hughton has the balls to drop the has beens. You know something we don't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted August 18, 2010 Share Posted August 18, 2010 And for the record, those that have: Chelsea x 5 Liverpool x 4 Arsenal x 3 Middlesbrough x 3 Derby x 2 West Ham x 2 Bolton x 2 Wimbledon Notts Forest Leicester Aston Villa Blackburn Fulham Mcr City Everton pipe down idiot. Don't cry. The truth isn't always nice to hear but it's the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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