Back to the future

[peasepud 59]

"We are going up" range, Now out!

 

http://www.medocmall.co.uk/cgi-bin/live/ec...;sub_dept_id=10

 

 

I'll put that in pride of place alongside the Relegation 2009 plate.

 

 

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

 

They ARE the fuckin doom mongers !!! What else would you call people with LOW horizons?

[Guest alex]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

 

They ARE the fuckin doom mongers !!! What else would you call people with LOW horizons?

Good point that like.

[acrossthepond 877]

The bottom line is there is far too much hysteria....

 

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

On the other side is a group of fans who have accepted we were heading for the drop and are just delighted to now be REBUILDING. They are not expecting a great deal from next season other than to strengthen the squad and try and stabalise ourselves around mid table. They then see the rebuilding continuing year on year so that this time we build on solid foundations.

 

With regard to players age and wage structures. Can someone link to where anyone from the club has said this is the case and will not be veered from?

 

It seems to be taken as fact yet I cant quite recall it being fact.

 

The sooner everyone comes to terms with the fact that the spend spend days are gone the better. The only route back to the top is by graduaL improvement.

 

You just got done telling us it was a blip! http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?...st&p=727701

 

Can you not stick to a position for longer than 5 minutes (besides "I love Mike" and "Chris is great")? Seems like you've got your constants but you'll argue black is white on anything else and come back the next week to do the reverse. Contrary doesn't begin to cover you.

[Guest alex]

Tucked himself in again. Hospital corners, the works. What a fucking tool

[Christmas Tree 4725]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

 

They ARE the fuckin doom mongers !!! What else would you call people with LOW horizons?

 

 

Realistic

 

Lets hear what you THINK will happen next year?

[Christmas Tree 4725]

The bottom line is there is far too much hysteria....

 

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

On the other side is a group of fans who have accepted we were heading for the drop and are just delighted to now be REBUILDING. They are not expecting a great deal from next season other than to strengthen the squad and try and stabalise ourselves around mid table. They then see the rebuilding continuing year on year so that this time we build on solid foundations.

 

With regard to players age and wage structures. Can someone link to where anyone from the club has said this is the case and will not be veered from?

 

It seems to be taken as fact yet I cant quite recall it being fact.

 

The sooner everyone comes to terms with the fact that the spend spend days are gone the better. The only route back to the top is by graduaL improvement.

 

You just got done telling us it was a blip! http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?...st&p=727701

 

Can you not stick to a position for longer than 5 minutes (besides "I love Mike" and "Chris is great")? Seems like you've got your constants but you'll argue black is white on anything else and come back the next week to do the reverse. Contrary doesn't begin to cover you.

 

 

Hey Hey its stalker man!

 

Your weekly hour on the prison PC I take it.

 

Come on, have a go this week and tell us your opinion for a change.

[ewerk 30620]

The bottom line is there is far too much hysteria....

 

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

On the other side is a group of fans who have accepted we were heading for the drop and are just delighted to now be REBUILDING. They are not expecting a great deal from next season other than to strengthen the squad and try and stabalise ourselves around mid table. They then see the rebuilding continuing year on year so that this time we build on solid foundations.

 

With regard to players age and wage structures. Can someone link to where anyone from the club has said this is the case and will not be veered from?

 

It seems to be taken as fact yet I cant quite recall it being fact.

 

The sooner everyone comes to terms with the fact that the spend spend days are gone the better. The only route back to the top is by graduaL improvement.

 

You just got done telling us it was a blip! http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?...st&p=727701

 

Can you not stick to a position for longer than 5 minutes (besides "I love Mike" and "Chris is great")? Seems like you've got your constants but you'll argue black is white on anything else and come back the next week to do the reverse. Contrary doesn't begin to cover you.

 

 

At this point I take Attain's posts more seriously than CT's.

[ChezGiven 0]

There are two things going on here. One is how much money we expect the club to invest over the summer. The figure will either be above (quite a few have said they will be surprised if he spends anything) or below (i reckon 15 -20m) expectations.

 

Once he has spent that amount (there will be uncertainty over how much he could have spent - i reckon he could spend 30m if he gambles a bit), then you have to judge where the resulting squad and manager could be if they put 100% in and play to their potential.

 

Another way of looking at this is to ask what would we need to spend over the summer to have a realistic chance of Europe? 60m for me, maybe more. To be honest, arguing the toss about where we think we ought to be aiming for is just message board drivel.

 

Do we have 60m to spend? No.

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

"Realism "...the 1st refuge of the scoundrel ..... That isnt realism ..its called having no fuckin ambition ...Get any more "realistic" and you'll be calling for us to stay in the Championship ...cos its "realistic" ..Well fuck that point of view right in the eye ! Anything that smells of compromise needs to be shot in the knee and sent home to Mama .... We need to aim for top ten ... and we need to keep on Ashleys case ..otherwise eejits like you will convince him he can get away with turning another profit in the next transfer window.

[Christmas Tree 4725]

"Realism "...the 1st refuge of the scoundrel ..... That isnt realism ..its called having no fuckin ambition ...Get any more "realistic" and you'll be calling for us to stay in the Championship ...cos its "realistic" ..Well fuck that point of view right in the eye ! Anything that smells of compromise needs to be shot in the knee and sent home to Mama .... We need to aim for top ten ... and we need to keep on Ashleys case ..otherwise eejits like you will convince him he can get away with turning another profit in the next transfer window.

 

 

So amongst all that waffle, your view on what you think will happen next year boils down to "lets aim for the top 10".

 

insightful, thanks.

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

Im not Nostradamus ...are you? Im telling you what i expect from NUFC ..and what i expect is ambition ... Want me to walk you through it again?

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

[ChezGiven 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

 

What does that mean? That everyone goes around saying it? Pointless.

 

You mean you want Mike to spend the sorts of money that would get us 10th rather than 17th dont you?

 

So, how much would that be then?

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

Oh , its "Mike" now is it? ...All girls together ....

[TheGreatNUFCSwindle 0]

We aim for tenth ..and if , at the end of the season we finish 17th ..its a disappointment ...if we aim to finish 17th ...then i'll be disappointed ..at the START of the season ... Thats the diff between ambitious yet realistic fans ..and eejits who cheer every ambitionless pronouncement out of SJP ...

[LeazesMag 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

 

What does that mean? That everyone goes around saying it? Pointless.

 

You mean you want Mike to spend the sorts of money that would get us 10th rather than 17th dont you?

 

So, how much would that be then?

 

 

As a good poster etc which you are Chez, I won't make an issue of "Mike"............but it isn't a case of spending money to finish 10th rather than 17th, its because he has sold players who could have put us in the top 6 anyway with a little more money and quality added.

 

What is the cost of his sales ? I would accept the financial position more readily, and any reasonable constraints, if he hadn't shown himself to be a total idiot in the vast majority of his actions already.

[ewerk 30620]

It would make sense for Ashley to stick in his own money in order to protect his investment from relegation next year and the subsequent reduction in income that would come with it. If he is aiming for 17th then that doesn't give us a lot of room for error.

 

This is the mistake he made last time.

[acrossthepond 877]

The bottom line is there is far too much hysteria....

 

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

On the other side is a group of fans who have accepted we were heading for the drop and are just delighted to now be REBUILDING. They are not expecting a great deal from next season other than to strengthen the squad and try and stabalise ourselves around mid table. They then see the rebuilding continuing year on year so that this time we build on solid foundations.

 

With regard to players age and wage structures. Can someone link to where anyone from the club has said this is the case and will not be veered from?

 

It seems to be taken as fact yet I cant quite recall it being fact.

 

The sooner everyone comes to terms with the fact that the spend spend days are gone the better. The only route back to the top is by graduaL improvement.

 

You just got done telling us it was a blip! http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?...st&p=727701

 

Can you not stick to a position for longer than 5 minutes (besides "I love Mike" and "Chris is great")? Seems like you've got your constants but you'll argue black is white on anything else and come back the next week to do the reverse. Contrary doesn't begin to cover you.

 

 

Hey Hey its stalker man!

 

Your weekly hour on the prison PC I take it.

 

Come on, have a go this week and tell us your opinion for a change.

 

My opinion hasn't changed. Fat Mike will try to scrape by again, just like he did in Jan 2009. He'll give Hughton 8-10mil to spend, we'll aim for 17th and we'll get relegated. Again. And it'll be his fault. Again.

 

If we want to progress, we need to survive. And if we want to survive, we need to compete. Look at Birmingham's spend and look at Burnley's spend. Pretty obvious difference there, right? And a pretty obvious difference in their league position too.

 

And if we want to compete, we need to spend proper money. Nothing less than 20mil - if we keep the current squad minus deadwood - will do, and if we sell any key players it'll need to be more than that. I'm a "doom monger" because I don't think Fat Mike will open up the chequebook to the tune of 20mil when he wouldn't spend 10 to keep us up in 2009. I don't call that a doom monger, call that someone who has two fucking brain cells to rub together.

[ChezGiven 0]

We aim for tenth ..and if , at the end of the season we finish 17th ..its a disappointment ...if we aim to finish 17th ...then i'll be disappointed ..at the START of the season ... Thats the diff between ambitious yet realistic fans ..and eejits who cheer every ambitionless pronouncement out of SJP ...

Waffle.

[ChezGiven 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

 

What does that mean? That everyone goes around saying it? Pointless.

 

You mean you want Mike to spend the sorts of money that would get us 10th rather than 17th dont you?

 

So, how much would that be then?

 

 

As a good poster etc which you are Chez, I won't make an issue of "Mike"............but it isn't a case of spending money to finish 10th rather than 17th, its because he has sold players who could have put us in the top 6 anyway with a little more money and quality added.

 

What is the cost of his sales ? I would accept the financial position more readily, and any reasonable constraints, if he hadn't shown himself to be a total idiot in the vast majority of his actions already.

 

Not sure what sort of issue you could make seeing as i backed you for years against the idiots who used daft names to refer to Shepherd

 

It is what it is. Wherever we have come from is irrelevant now, my point has been our expectations for next year start with the money he invests. You cant wish the club up the league.

 

He's a knacker so i shouldnt be too surprised if he fails to invest over the summer but he would be insane to do that and i dont think he will. I dont expect him to put the sort of money in that will turn that starting 11 into a team that can realistically pick up 50+ points. A good season will have us in the high 40s.

 

Where we have pace, we lack strength on the ball; where we have strength on the ball, we lack pace and guile. To resolve all the issues in the squad will require significant funds. Thats the reality.

[LeazesMag 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

 

What does that mean? That everyone goes around saying it? Pointless.

 

You mean you want Mike to spend the sorts of money that would get us 10th rather than 17th dont you?

 

So, how much would that be then?

 

 

As a good poster etc which you are Chez, I won't make an issue of "Mike"............but it isn't a case of spending money to finish 10th rather than 17th, its because he has sold players who could have put us in the top 6 anyway with a little more money and quality added.

 

What is the cost of his sales ? I would accept the financial position more readily, and any reasonable constraints, if he hadn't shown himself to be a total idiot in the vast majority of his actions already.

 

Not sure what sort of issue you could make seeing as i backed you for years against the idiots who used daft names to refer to Shepherd

 

yes I know that.

 

It is what it is. Wherever we have come from is irrelevant now, my point has been our expectations for next year start with the money he invests. You cant wish the club up the league.

 

He's a knacker so i shouldnt be too surprised if he fails to invest over the summer but he would be insane to do that and i dont think he will. I dont expect him to put the sort of money in that will turn that starting 11 into a team that can realistically pick up 50+ points. A good season will have us in the high 40s.

 

Where we have pace, we lack strength on the ball; where we have strength on the ball, we lack pace and guile. To resolve all the issues in the squad will require significant funds. Thats the reality.

 

I actually don't wish to him spend 60m quid or whatever either, even though I agree with your last statement. I would like him to show me that he understands what it takes to be successful. To do this we need to bring at least a couple of players who step straight into the team and pay the rate they may demand. That will do for the moment, along with not bringing in cheap players who have not proved themselves in the premiership and/or are too old to do it now. And he must keep Enrique, Guittierez, and Carroll if someone tries to buy them.

 

Then the same again next year, unless he has sold out by then.

 

Question. How much do you think preserving premiership status is worth ? [i'm not saying this as a target, just wondering if he will actually sit and work out that it is worth keeping this time instead of gambling with it]

Edited April 14, 2010 by LeazesMag

[ChezGiven 0]

Id rather aim for tenth than fuckin 17th

 

What does that mean? That everyone goes around saying it? Pointless.

 

You mean you want Mike to spend the sorts of money that would get us 10th rather than 17th dont you?

 

So, how much would that be then?

 

 

As a good poster etc which you are Chez, I won't make an issue of "Mike"............but it isn't a case of spending money to finish 10th rather than 17th, its because he has sold players who could have put us in the top 6 anyway with a little more money and quality added.

 

What is the cost of his sales ? I would accept the financial position more readily, and any reasonable constraints, if he hadn't shown himself to be a total idiot in the vast majority of his actions already.

 

Not sure what sort of issue you could make seeing as i backed you for years against the idiots who used daft names to refer to Shepherd

 

yes I know that.

 

It is what it is. Wherever we have come from is irrelevant now, my point has been our expectations for next year start with the money he invests. You cant wish the club up the league.

 

He's a knacker so i shouldnt be too surprised if he fails to invest over the summer but he would be insane to do that and i dont think he will. I dont expect him to put the sort of money in that will turn that starting 11 into a team that can realistically pick up 50+ points. A good season will have us in the high 40s.

 

Where we have pace, we lack strength on the ball; where we have strength on the ball, we lack pace and guile. To resolve all the issues in the squad will require significant funds. Thats the reality.

 

I actually don't wish to him spend 60m quid or whatever either, even though I agree with your last statement. I would like him to show me that he understands what it takes to be successful. To do this we need to bring at least a couple of players who step straight into the team and pay the rate they may demand. That will do for the moment, along with not bringing in cheap players who have not proved themselves in the premiership and/or are too old to do it now. And he must keep Enrique, Guittierez, and Carroll if someone tries to buy them.

 

Then the same again next year, unless he has sold out by then.

 

Question. How much do you think preserving premiership status is worth ? [i'm not saying this as a target, just wondering if he will actually sit and work out that it is worth keeping this time instead of gambling with it]

 

Completely agree, i dont think he can resolve all the problems so bringing in a top quality midfielder and striker have to be the priority. If you want to see the value of investing good money in the latter, look no further than Bent.

 

We'll see if he has learnt anything, fucking hope so.

[ChezGiven 0]

The value of preserving premiership status all depends on the cost base you generate getting there.

[David Kelly 1245]

People need to understand the difference between what we expect of Ashley and what we believe Newcastle United should be going for. I expect that that Ashley will make an arse of things again and show no ambition. I believe though that this is not acceptable for a club of our size. We should be looking to get back into the top ten and beyond. If we don't manage it and we finish fourteenth or whatever fine then fine but it should not be because of a belief that we can't be better than the likes of Stoke or Birmingham (two much smaller clubs who have managed to be mid to top half of the premier league in their first season in the top flight).

Finishing just above the bottom three should be the ambitions of clubs the size of Burnley, Hull, Watford, Barnsley etc who don't have our stature or revenue streams and only make it into the top division once every god knows how many years.

There can be no guarantees of success and there is no expectation that we will be able to acheive a European finish (or even a top ten) but a lack of ambition to even try for that is a crime just as bad as forcing Keegan to sign players he didn't want to appease some foreign agent or appointing Joe Kinnear as his replacement. We should expect more and with the money we put into the club we deserve more. If you don't believe that, there are plenty of other clubs you could go and support who have no other ambition than to just survive in whatever division they are in!