The Guitar Thread

[Blastronaut 1333]

On 17/12/2021 at 20:18, Tom said:

Honestly if you haven’t bought one of those NUX Steel Singers you need to. This thing is the fucking tits  

 

Cheapest pedal on the board, but offers by FAR the best tones.

 

Turns out it's been traced and isnt anything even close the Dumble-in-a-box it's marketed as. But no surprises why its it so popular.

 

It's a Tubescreamer

Edited December 20, 2021 by Blastronaut

[Andrew 4713]

How much of a tubescreamer is it? 

 

Cause I have one of the Nuxs, as does my mate who has it next to a tubescreamer on his board and I swear they sound quite different. 

 

Wondering how much of that is in my head

 

 

[Tom 14011]

I definitely get Dumble vibes off it like, but I love the sound so overall I’m not fussed what it is for £40  

[Blastronaut 1333]

28 minutes ago, Andrew said:

How much of a tubescreamer is it? 

 

Cause I have one of the Nuxs, as does my mate who has it next to a tubescreamer on his board and I swear they sound quite different. 

 

Wondering how much of that is in my head

 

 

 

Two resistors are slightly different values and the input buffer is a jfet rather than a bjt. On paper it shouldn't sound any different at all, save for the usual difference you'd find due to tolerance going from one Tubescreamer TS9 to another.

 

I'll see if I can find something from a more credible source, but it's even allegedly built on the same PCB NUX use for their OD-3, which is also a Tubescreamer.

[Blastronaut 1333]

I'm not meaning to shit on it, at all for what it's worth. This is just the pedal scene in a nutshell, and £40 for decent TS clone is a no brainer.

 

I'll check over the schematic later to check if it's a TS808 or TS9 and roughly what tonal changes those two resistor values might yield, if any. 

[Blastronaut 1333]

Just for clarity im currently going by the word of a guy called Robert at PedalPCB who traces pedal circuits for a living (no affiliation) and tore one down along side another pedal it was rumoured to be a clone of: 

 

 

[Blastronaut 1333]

1 hour ago, Andrew said:

How much of a tubescreamer is it? 

 

Cause I have one of the Nuxs, as does my mate who has it next to a tubescreamer on his board and I swear they sound quite different. 

 

Wondering how much of that is in my head

 

 

 

Here's yer typical TS808 schematic. I've highlighted the changes in the NUX Steel Stringer:

 

Apologies in advance for this, fully aware I'm about to reveal myself as an absolute wanker if it wasn't already widely accepted.

 

Green bit: input buffer.  A buffer just maintains unity gain of the signal, won't change tonal characteristics whether it's a Jfet, opamp or bjt. I'd imagine newer Tubescreamers use a BJT, the older ones would likely would've been jfets. For whatever reason the NUX seems to use a Jfet.

 

Pink bit sets the high pass filter in distortion stage, Tubescreamers would have a 4.7k resistor here which would give harmonics above 720Hz the full gain of the pedal and anything below that would be affected progressively less. The NUX swaps this for a 3.9k, which just ups that threshold slightly to 868Hz.

 

Yellow bits are just there to bias the circuit. Nominal change from the 510k resistor in the Tubescreamer to 470k. To cut a really long story short, biasing a circuit like this is usually just setting a mid-way point between 9volts and Ground (0v). The one near the output will probably have a small knock-on effect on the pedals output impedance, so it could potentially affect how it behaves with any pedals later in the chain, but I'd be sceptical.

 

Looks like a TS808 to me, just a ballhair of low-end making it through unaffected.

 

[Andrew 4713]

Thats fascinating tbh, like I said I could swear there are some very different sounds in the Nux compared to a TS, dunno if Tom would corroborate that mind but it seems so.

 

@Blastronaut Anything knocking about on the Horizon Precision Drive? That is what lives next to the Nux on my board.

[Blastronaut 1333]

9 hours ago, Andrew said:

Thats fascinating tbh, like I said I could swear there are some very different sounds in the Nux compared to a TS, dunno if Tom would corroborate that mind but it seems so.

 

@Blastronaut Anything knocking about on the Horizon Precision Drive? That is what lives next to the Nux on my board.

 

Precision Drive seems to be yet another TS808 with a few more changes and a rotary switch. The rotary switch changes the value of the capacitor next to the pink bit on the schematic to change the cut off that high pass filter. *

 

If you've ever heard Tubescreamers referred to as having a "mid-hump", it's that ~720hz frequency they're talking about.

 

Worth bearing in mind the capacitors used will probably have a 10% tolerance so it will rarely ever be exactly 720Hz, could really be anywhere between 650Hz and 800Hz. Knowing that and considering how many other capacitors are in the circuit doing similar jobs could go some way to explaining why it sounds different.

 

I'm not sure exactly what value capacitors are on the rotary switch on the Precision Drive but it's easy to guess. They changed the resistor to 1k so a 220nf capacitor would give you close to the stock TS frequency (723Hz). Would imagine the options are somewhere in this ballpark:

 

470nf = 339Hz

330nf = 482Hz

220nf = 723Hz

100nf = 1591Hz

82nf   = 1940Hz

68nf   = 2340Hz

 

I'll need to have another look later for the other changes, doubt they'll be drastic but I did see it mentioned it might have some kind of noise gate tacked on.

[Kevin Carr's Gloves 3790]

I got a bass guitar for my birthday, I aways wanted a guitar but can't be arse learning to play a proper one.

[Monkeys Fist 41931]

Always had you down as a bassist. 

[Blastronaut 1333]

@Kevin Carr's Gloves quick instructional video to get you started:

 

 

 

Back on @Andrew's Precision Drive, I can't find anything on the gate circuit, seems to be on a separate board, stacked on top of the overdrive but yeah if you take away that and the aforementioned rotary control it's 99% identical to a TS808.

 

There's two lower value resistors in the first clipping stage, that will you a hell of a lot more gain available on that "drive" knob than a stock TS808.

 

Then there's two value changes in the tone section so the tone control might function a little bit differently, but to me that change looks like penny pinching rather than a design choice (stock TS808 has a sort of obscure 20k W-taper potentiometer. Probably saved a few quid in costs finding a way to use a more standard linear taper).

 

That's all I've got for now.

[Blastronaut 1333]

Anyone here got any experience with or opinions on the Hudson Broadcast? (Genuine question, I'm promise this isn't a bait and switch where I later reveal it's actually another Tubescreamer)

[Tom 14011]

Seriously considering a Manson with a MIDI screen and a sustainer
 

Help me @Blastronaut

[Blastronaut 1333]

Honestly not my scene at all @Tom. Wouldn't fancy being a guitar tech and having that brought to me.

 

Funny though, I was just talking about Matt Bellamy last night.

[Tom 14011]

https://www.mansonguitarworks.com/ma-evo-midi-and-sustainiac-dry-satin-black-black-hardware
 

this 

[Blastronaut 1333]

Whatever floats your boat man! I'd imagine you'd need to be running loads of midi stuff to get much use out of it, and at that point you'd be aswel just automating all the midi commands. But I guess I can see how this would give more scope for, eh... spontaneity.

 

 

[Andrew 4713]

44 minutes ago, Tom said:

https://www.mansonguitarworks.com/ma-evo-midi-and-sustainiac-dry-satin-black-black-hardware
 

this 

 

That's cool as shit and I say you should buy it cause I always do.

 

But for 2.5 grand they've not even put locking tuners on it as far as I can see in the pictures and for an ultra-modern guitar that square block heel is a bit...lazy? 

[Blastronaut 1333]

Well noticed @Andrew.  Also the marketing doesn't mention what scale length the neck is. Could be smaller than those Paul Gilbert Mikro things. (Gonna assume if I could be arsed digging deeper I'd find it was either Gibson or Fender scale though).

 

I'm with Andrew though, if you want it and have a spare £2.5k, fucking have at it. My only real concern would be finding a tech to sort it out when something inevitably breaks a few years down the line. The majority of good techs I know are really old school and would absolutely shit the bed if you brought them that.

 

Seriously though, if it were me and for some reason I was looking for a midi controller I could use while playing guitar I'd be looking at expression pedals or big tactile buttons I could hit with my feet. There was a guy in a local band here hacked some old organ pedals as a controller for a Korg synth if I mind right, that would be my way to go. 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Blastronaut

[Tom 14011]

I had the poor mans version without all the bits and it was class.

 

I won’t order a stock model though so will probably go for the locking tuners and probably a different colour. For the MIDI stuff I’d stick it through a digitech whammy and a Kaoss pad.

[Andrew 4713]

That Pedal Show have come up good this week, 5 episodes of Johnny Kinkade building Dan a new acoustic completely by hand.

 

I've always found guitar building/factory tour videos really interesting, should try doing one myself some time.

[Blastronaut 1333]

I'll most definitely watch that. I get that you're in NZ (or that neck of the woods at least) but Crimson are the first UK based company that springs to mind offering "build your own guitar" courses.

 

Can't say I've warmed to the guy tbh (forget his name, the founder with the tattooed head) but he seems like he knows and loves his craft and has a fuck ton of insight to pass on. He  could be sound as fuck for all I know but I get massive Gatekeeper vibes from the few Crimson Guitar videos I've watched. 

 

Building acoustic guitars is next level though from a hand-crafting stance. Shaping and carving solid body guitars is fucking hard enough. Trying to bend thin sheets and still keep it in shape and stable under string tension must be a whole different ball game. 

[Andrew 4713]

I think @Gemmill has done one of their building courses?

[Andrew 4713]

So ive listed my Custom Shop tele and a few other things for sale, and Ive never been so spoiled for choice in my life, two different guys have offered me guitar + cash for it already (listed yesterday) 

 

I genuinely dont know what to pick

 

[Gemmill 44174]

The Music Man would be my pick. 

 

And yeah I did go to Crimson on a 2 day maintenance course. I've since moderated my thoughts on it slightly - I came away feeling I'd learned loads but then had quite a bit of bother with my tele. 

 

I turned up and they recommended a full refret on a guitar that was maybe 6 months old (Fender American Original tele). I was there for the final two days of one of their 3 month guitar building courses, so there were about 6-8 lads finishing up guitars who had established relationships with the 2 instructors on hand. 

 

This meant that me getting the help I needed was not great. And a refret isn't a straightforward job, especially when you'd turned up expecting to learn how to do a really good setup. 

 

Things seemed fine for a bit with the guitar but gradually frets became a bit unseated and it became unplayable - buzzing all over the shop. I took it to my main man Dave in North Shields who sorted it and was disgusted that they had told me to refret a basically brand new £1400 guitar, and then not provided minute by minute direction to make sure it got done correctly. 

 

I'm absolutely certain I just had a bad experience cos of the clash with the end of that 3 month course, but it was still bullshit. I remember they were closing up on the Friday and everyone was trying to leave and one of the lads came over to me with his backpack on his back, garbled some instructions at me, and then fucked off.