Michael Jackson

[Kitman 2207]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

 

At least in Lennon's case you can blame the decline in quality on Yoko. In Jacko's case there's no-one to blame but Bubbles

[Happy Face 29]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

 

I know.

 

....and was a right twat to his wife(s) and kids

 

I don't think engaging the legacies of Lennon and Jackson in a moral off is really a good idea, do you?

 

I was refuting the "incredibly special all round" tag.

 

Everyone has flaws.

[Guest alex]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

He did indeed. I think the difference between the two is outlined by Renton though in that you got the feeling there was no way Jackson would ever do anything decent ever again (plenty evidence to back that up as well).

 

He died 10 years earlier than Wacko though...most people would agree that your forties on isn't really going to be peak of anyone's pop powers.

Exactly, but surely that's the point. Although Jacko could have died at 30 and all his best stuff would have been out there

[Gemmill 44896]

I reckon Parky is one of those disturbing adult Jackson diehards the way he's going on.

 

Typing with one glove on no doubt.

[Craig 6682]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

[Kitman 2207]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

He did indeed. I think the difference between the two is outlined by Renton though in that you got the feeling there was no way Jackson would ever do anything decent ever again (plenty evidence to back that up as well).

 

He died 10 years earlier than Wacko though...most people would agree that your forties on isn't really going to be peak of anyone's pop powers.

 

Some artists buck the trend. Van Morrison, Tom Waits to name two.

[Park Life 71]

Yeah Id say Jade Goody was ridiculous, not Michael Jackson.

 

Goody was a media invention, on the other hand Jacko invented the pop video, some legendary work. First black artist to get rotation on daytime MTV iirc.

 

He invented the excessively expensive pop video to prop up a mediocre song maybe. What does 'rotation on daytime MTV ' mean, is that a significant achievement? And what work do you regard as legendary?

 

Well, its been said this morning that him and Quincy Jones pulled together R & B,pop and Rock music in a way that had never been done before. I think that is pretty unarguable. Whether you liked it of course is entirely subjective. In a way he did a sort of reverse Elvis...he was (then) a black man using elements of popular music which were at the time seen as traditionally the preserve of white audiences and mixed them with what he was brought up with (R & B/Motown) to produce in the eighties two of the (and in fact the) biggest selling albums of all time.

 

That was a huge acheivement for someone who had been up till then mostly performing in the hugely ghettoised black music industry.Motown, the home of the Jackson 5, was very successful,but mainly sold to only black kids. MTV was starting up at the time and he and his record company could see the value of huge flashy videos to promote his music to a huge new audience in what could be termed "middle America". In this, him and Quincy Jones changed the face of popular music.

 

Excellent post.

 

It was also a time when MTV was quite keen to keep black and 'white' music apart in the schedules. "Bad" stopped all that shit in its tracks.

[Renton 21627]

Yeah Id say Jade Goody was ridiculous, not Michael Jackson.

 

Goody was a media invention, on the other hand Jacko invented the pop video, some legendary work. First black artist to get rotation on daytime MTV iirc.

 

He invented the excessively expensive pop video to prop up a mediocre song maybe. What does 'rotation on daytime MTV ' mean, is that a significant achievement? And what work do you regard as legendary?

 

Well, its been said this morning that him and Quincy Jones pulled together R & B,pop and Rock music in a way that had never been done before. I think that is pretty unarguable. Whether you liked it of course is entirely subjective. In a way he did a sort of reverse Elvis...he was (then) a black man using elements of popular music which were at the time seen as traditionally the preserve of white audiences and mixed them with what he was brought up with (R & B/Motown) to produce in the eighties two of the (and in fact the) biggest selling albums of all time.

 

That was a huge acheivement for someone who had been up till then mostly performing in the hugely ghettoised black music industry.Motown, the home of the Jackson 5, was very successful,but mainly sold to only black kids. MTV was starting up at the time and he and his record company could see the value of huge flashy videos to promote his music to a huge new audience in what could be termed "middle America". In this, him and Quincy Jones changed the face of popular music.

 

That's fair enough.

 

As you say its all subjective/personal taste at the end of the day, I was just never a fan then or now. I did like his J5 stuff mind.

[Guest alex]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

I assume he had tickets for the 02

[Park Life 71]

I reckon Parky is one of those disturbing adult Jackson diehards the way he's going on.

 

Typing with one glove on no doubt.

 

His music saved me.

[Renton 21627]

I reckon Parky is one of those disturbing adult Jackson diehards the way he's going on.

 

Typing with one glove on no doubt.

 

[Guest alex]

I reckon Parky is one of those disturbing adult Jackson diehards the way he's going on.

 

Typing with one glove on no doubt.

 

His music saved me.

Can't remember you ever mentioning being into him before like.

[Happy Face 29]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

 

 

 

It's Elvis....Hendrix....Lennon

 

It's only happened once before in my lifetime I think, with Cobain.

[Park Life 71]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

 

 

Is there a problem?

[Tom 14011]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

He did indeed. I think the difference between the two is outlined by Renton though in that you got the feeling there was no way Jackson would ever do anything decent ever again (plenty evidence to back that up as well).

 

He died 10 years earlier than Wacko though...most people would agree that your forties on isn't really going to be peak of anyone's pop powers.

 

Some artists buck the trend. Van Morrison, Tom Waits to name two.

 

 

Muddy Waters, John Lee Hooker, Leadbelly, BB.King, Lightnin' Hopkins, Johnny Cash and a few more all peaked very late.

[Tom 14011]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

 

 

 

It's Elvis....Hendrix....Lennon

 

It's only happened once before in my lifetime I think, with Cobain.

 

 

Hendrix - A proper black man.

[Park Life 71]

I reckon Parky is one of those disturbing adult Jackson diehards the way he's going on.

 

Typing with one glove on no doubt.

 

His music saved me.

Can't remember you ever mentioning being into him before like.

 

Nobody on here knows the first thing about me.

[The Fish 10857]

As an aside, I wonder how the O2 will fill those dates now They stand to lose a fair whack of cash unless it's somethng pretty good.

[Kitman 2207]

Yeah Id say Jade Goody was ridiculous, not Michael Jackson.

 

Goody was a media invention, on the other hand Jacko invented the pop video, some legendary work. First black artist to get rotation on daytime MTV iirc.

 

He invented the excessively expensive pop video to prop up a mediocre song maybe. What does 'rotation on daytime MTV ' mean, is that a significant achievement? And what work do you regard as legendary?

 

Well, its been said this morning that him and Quincy Jones pulled together R & B,pop and Rock music in a way that had never been done before. I think that is pretty unarguable. Whether you liked it of course is entirely subjective. In a way he did a sort of reverse Elvis...he was (then) a black man using elements of popular music which were at the time seen as traditionally the preserve of white audiences and mixed them with what he was brought up with (R & B/Motown) to produce in the eighties two of the (and in fact the) biggest selling albums of all time.

 

That was a huge acheivement for someone who had been up till then mostly performing in the hugely ghettoised black music industry.Motown, the home of the Jackson 5, was very successful,but mainly sold to only black kids. MTV was starting up at the time and he and his record company could see the value of huge flashy videos to promote his music to a huge new audience in what could be termed "middle America". In this, him and Quincy Jones changed the face of popular music.

 

Maybe that's right but I don't remember music being ghetto-ised between white and black audiences when Thriller came out. Not in the UK anyway.

[Guest alex]

As an aside, I wonder how the O2 will fill those dates now They stand to lose a fair whack of cash unless it's somethng pretty good.

Logical option would be Craig David.

[Tom 14011]

Now looking like it might be a hereditary condition passed down through his family.

They're calling it "The Billie Gene".

[Guest alex]

Yeah Id say Jade Goody was ridiculous, not Michael Jackson.

 

Goody was a media invention, on the other hand Jacko invented the pop video, some legendary work. First black artist to get rotation on daytime MTV iirc.

 

He invented the excessively expensive pop video to prop up a mediocre song maybe. What does 'rotation on daytime MTV ' mean, is that a significant achievement? And what work do you regard as legendary?

 

Well, its been said this morning that him and Quincy Jones pulled together R & B,pop and Rock music in a way that had never been done before. I think that is pretty unarguable. Whether you liked it of course is entirely subjective. In a way he did a sort of reverse Elvis...he was (then) a black man using elements of popular music which were at the time seen as traditionally the preserve of white audiences and mixed them with what he was brought up with (R & B/Motown) to produce in the eighties two of the (and in fact the) biggest selling albums of all time.

 

That was a huge acheivement for someone who had been up till then mostly performing in the hugely ghettoised black music industry.Motown, the home of the Jackson 5, was very successful,but mainly sold to only black kids. MTV was starting up at the time and he and his record company could see the value of huge flashy videos to promote his music to a huge new audience in what could be termed "middle America". In this, him and Quincy Jones changed the face of popular music.

 

Maybe that's right but I don't remember music being ghetto-ised between white and black audiences when Thriller came out. Not in the UK anyway.

And Motown mainly sold to black kids? That's a new one on me like.

[Park Life 71]

Yeah Id say Jade Goody was ridiculous, not Michael Jackson.

 

Goody was a media invention, on the other hand Jacko invented the pop video, some legendary work. First black artist to get rotation on daytime MTV iirc.

 

He invented the excessively expensive pop video to prop up a mediocre song maybe. What does 'rotation on daytime MTV ' mean, is that a significant achievement? And what work do you regard as legendary?

 

Well, its been said this morning that him and Quincy Jones pulled together R & B,pop and Rock music in a way that had never been done before. I think that is pretty unarguable. Whether you liked it of course is entirely subjective. In a way he did a sort of reverse Elvis...he was (then) a black man using elements of popular music which were at the time seen as traditionally the preserve of white audiences and mixed them with what he was brought up with (R & B/Motown) to produce in the eighties two of the (and in fact the) biggest selling albums of all time.

 

That was a huge acheivement for someone who had been up till then mostly performing in the hugely ghettoised black music industry.Motown, the home of the Jackson 5, was very successful,but mainly sold to only black kids. MTV was starting up at the time and he and his record company could see the value of huge flashy videos to promote his music to a huge new audience in what could be termed "middle America". In this, him and Quincy Jones changed the face of popular music.

 

Maybe that's right but I don't remember music being ghetto-ised between white and black audiences when Thriller came out. Not in the UK anyway.

 

MTV was primarily an American entity at that point. And it was due to Jacko and Quincy and the use of guitars in disco that they couldn't keep it off American MTV.

[Craig 6682]

As a tribute to both his dress sense and as a mark of respect I think we should all wear our trousers at half mast.

 

A rendition of "I'm forever blowing bubbles" on the ipod too?

 

BTW - what the fuck is Parky's problem? Was Jacko blowing him too?

 

 

 

It's Elvis....Hendrix....Lennon

 

It's only happened once before in my lifetime I think, with Cobain.

 

One of my mates at school had tickets to see Nivarna and never shut up about it for weeks - never saw him for days after Cobain munched on the shells!

[Happy Face 29]

Lennon was incredibly special all round and Jackson shouldn't really be mentioned in the same sentence.

 

 

 

John Lennon released some absolute gash like

He did indeed. I think the difference between the two is outlined by Renton though in that you got the feeling there was no way Jackson would ever do anything decent ever again (plenty evidence to back that up as well).

 

He died 10 years earlier than Wacko though...most people would agree that your forties on isn't really going to be peak of anyone's pop powers.

 

Some artists buck the trend. Van Morrison, Tom Waits to name two.

 

 

Muddy Waters, John Lee Hooker, Leadbelly, BB.King, Lightnin' Hopkins, Johnny Cash and a few more all peaked very late.

 

I don't think many of those had an international number one BEFORE they were forty, let alone after.

 

Either way, it's not even about quality which is subjective, it's about transcending music. It might be that you don't like Michael Jackson. But he's been the most prominent pop culture icon for 30 year, whatever his output.