Hillsborough

[Ally 0]

Jon Parkin?

[Tom 14013]

Lovejoy you tit

[Gejon 2]

Jon Parkin?

 

Yeah thats the one.

 

 

Professional sportsman

[The Fish 10963]

Most of them are fat bastards like. Its amazing how many fit footballers pile on the pounds.

 

 

Just imagine what Andy Reid is going to be like in 10-15 years!

 

and that Championship striker whose name completely escapes me at the moment!

Shola?

[wonitfivex 0]

some good posts

 

jutice for the 96

 

mackenzie sun scum

[Craig 6700]

Anyone remember the match against Spurs where we were crammed in? that was dodgy.

 

FA Cup 5th Round at WHL back in 1987.

 

Too many in one pen - those who tried to get into the next 'empty' pen were set upon by the Met's finest.

 

Shocking!

 

Found this in a group on Facebook which shows how how bad it was at WHL.

 

[Tom 14013]

What was the score that day Craig?

[Craig 6700]

What was the score that day Craig?

 

We lost 1-0.

 

Curiousity is getting the better of me here - what's the relevance Tom?

[Tom 14013]

My uncle was telling me how he went down and we lost 5-1 just wondering if it was the same day.

[Craig 6700]

My uncle was telling me how he went down and we lost 5-1 just wondering if it was the same day.

 

Nah that was a couple of years earlier if IIRC. This was a game where Clive Allen got the only goal.

[Tom 14013]

Ah right fair play!

 

I just imagined it would be around the same time there or thereabouts. (© Llambias)

[Craig 6700]

Another one of the same incident - fucking miracle no-one was hurt that day - this one also shows the empty terracing that people who were there reckon they asked to spill over into and the old bill wouldn't permit it....

 

[Craig 6700]

Thatcher was told drunk fans caused Hillsborough, papers say

 

Former PM Margaret Thatcher was told a senior Merseyside police officer blamed "drunken Liverpool fans" for causing the Hillsborough disaster, confidential government documents have revealed.

 

The BBC has seen leaked briefings about Britain's worst sports tragedy.

 

Ninety-six football fans died after a crush on overcrowded terraces at an FA Cup Semi Final in April 1989.

 

The official inquiry said the disaster was caused by the failure in crowd control by South Yorkshire Police.

 

Letters to and from 10 Downing Street and cabinet minutes that show what Mrs, now Lady, Thatcher was discussing and being told behind the scenes have been made public for the first time by BBC Radio 4's The World at One.

 

For years, the families of those who died have been calling for the release of secret government and police papers relating to the disaster.

 

The government has agreed that this will happen.

 

The Hillsborough Independent Panel, set up in 2009, is reviewing hundreds of documents but they are not expected to be made available to the families of those who died or to the wider public until later this year.

 

It is thought there will be thousands of pages to sift through.

 

The most controversial issue in the papers that the BBC has seen relates to what Mrs Thatcher was being told about the views of some senior members of the Merseyside Police Force.

 

'Deeply ashamed'

 

They are contained in a letter sent to the prime minister from a member of her policy unit in Downing Street. Four days after the disaster, the adviser attended a long planned meeting with the Chief Constable of Merseyside Police, the late Sir Kenneth Oxford, and some of his senior colleagues.

 

It is important to bear in mind that this was written just days after the Hillsborough disaster and the views of the chief constable and those of his senior officers may well have changed over the subsequent weeks.

 

According to the letter, the Merseyside chief constable said: "A key factor in causing the disaster was the fact that large numbers of Liverpool fans had turned up without tickets.

 

"This was getting lost sight of in attempts to blame the police, the football authorities, etc."

 

The prime minister was informed that a senior member of the Merseyside Police directly blamed supporters: "One officer, born and bred in Liverpool, said that he was deeply ashamed to say that it was drunken Liverpool fans who had caused this disaster, just as they had caused the deaths at Heysel."

 

This officer is not named.

 

Hundreds were injured and 39 supporters died when rioting Liverpool fans charged Juventus fans before the 1985 European Cup Final at the Heysel stadium on 29 May 1985.

 

Margaret Aspinall, whose teenage son James died in the Hillsborough disaster, described the comments made by the unnamed senior officer as "appalling" and "offensive".

 

"We knew things were going on behind closed doors, we've always known that. It doesn't surprise me in a sense... but I'm surprised by the content," the chairwoman of the Hillsborough Families Support Group said of the briefings.

 

More of the views of the chief constable are also referred to in the files: "He deplored the press's morbid concentration on pictures of bodies. He was also uneasy about the way in which Anfield was being turned into a shrine."

 

Direct to Downing Street

 

There is nothing in the documents the BBC has seen about any briefings from South Yorkshire Police. It is possible more will become known about that when many other confidential papers are officially released in a few months time.

 

Instead, we have learnt about the controversial views of some of Liverpool's own senior police officers and how, just days after the disaster, they were being passed on directly to 10 Downing Street and to Mrs Thatcher.

 

Sheila Coleman, from the Hillsborough Justice Campaign, said: "We are really concerned that the emphasis is totally on Merseyside Police here and not on South Yorkshire Police, and that makes us very suspicious of how this information was leaked.

 

"We find it a strange coincidence that this information was leaked only days after we found out the (Hillsborough Independent) panel are not going to report until the autumn."

 

A spokesman for the panel said it could not comment on leaked documents.

 

Other Downing Street papers seen by the BBC provide an insight into what the prime minister was saying and discussing with her cabinet colleagues in the days after Hillsborough.

 

The main issue of discussion contained in these documents was the effect the disaster was going to have on controversial legislation aimed at controlling the behaviour of football fans.

 

The Football Spectators' Bill was already going through Parliament. The government was determined to continue with it, in order to introduce a national membership scheme for the sport. This would have brought in what were dubbed as identity cards for football fans.

 

According to the conclusions of the first cabinet meeting to take place after the disaster, Mrs Thatcher told her ministers that the situation on crowd safety and hooliganism at football matches "cried out for action".

 

The government wanted the legislation to be passed in time for the following year's World Cup finals in Italy - to reduce the prospect of crowd trouble. The meeting also discussed using it to bring in any interim recommendations from the Hillsborough Inquiry.

 

'Gravest matter'

 

In another meeting with senior cabinet colleagues which took place on the same day, the prime minister said: "To abstain from taking action… would be the gravest possible matter, now that the need for this action had been so conclusively demonstrated."

 

Five days later, Home Secretary Douglas Hurd met the man conducting the official inquiry into Hillsborough, Lord Justice Taylor.

 

A letter written by a civil servant at the Home Office says Mr Hurd told the judge about the government's proposed new timetable to get the football spectators' legislation passed by Parliament.

 

He then asked Lord Justice Taylor what he would say if the government went ahead with this and then asked "…whether he was really quite sure that it was out of the question to form and express a view on the subject of membership cards in the three and a half months… between the start of the inquiry… and the end of August?"

 

According to the letter, Lord Justice Taylor told him that "this was possible, but he was not confident that it could be achieved".

 

He said his priority was establishing the facts of what had happened at Hillsborough and could not promise to come up with any recommendations on membership cards in time to fit in with the government's political schedule.

 

The prime minister was told what had happened in a briefing note from her principal private secretary, who informed her: "Lord Justice Taylor was distinctly unhelpful."

 

In the end, the government did press ahead with its plans and the law was passed. However, the following year, in his report, Lord Justice Taylor said he had "grave doubts" about the feasibility of football membership cards and "serious misgivings" about the scheme's likely impact on safety. As a result of his concerns, the government dropped the scheme and it was never implemented.

 

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17382896

[Howmanheyman 33837]

Anyone who'd ever been on the Leppings Lane end about this time will tell you that a few officers/Stewards standing at the tunnel entrance directing fans to the side terrace which was out of view to anyone unfamiliar with Hillsborough, would've avoided this situation.

 

Sounds like a senior Police Officer telling his superior something they'd want to hear, to be honest.

[Craig 6700]

The sliding wooden door that was often used to close the tunnel when the pens became too full would have avoided it to.

 

Sounds to me that they're trying to detract attention from SYP to me. Placing the onus on Merseyside Police is pyschologically pushing the blame back towards Liverpool.

 

I think it's bad they've named the now deceased Chief Constable of Merseyside Police as a critic of the fans but that the other senior officer (presumably still breathing) is granted anonymity.

 

F*ck's sake, these people just want to know what happened to their relatives and friends. Who wouldn't?

[spongebob toonpants 4132]

Anyone remember the match against Spurs where we were crammed in? that was dodgy.

 

FA Cup 5th Round at WHL back in 1987.

 

Too many in one pen - those who tried to get into the next 'empty' pen were set upon by the Met's finest.

 

Shocking!

 

Found this in a group on Facebook which shows how how bad it was at WHL.

 

 

In a very bizarre turn of events -that's a picture of me front and centre

[Gemmill 46027]

Scousers up in arms about this Alan Davies business. There was a Liverpool fanzine editor on 5 Live earlier furious because "there's no right and wrong way to grieve".

 

We fucking know that man, but life does go on. Comes a point where it stops being grieving and just becomes wallowing in self pity. No one else carries on like this.

 

I have every sympathy with the families of the dead, but Liverpool cannot be allowed to dictate when they will and won't play games any more than any other club can. Move on ffs.

 

I think people are at the end of their tether with this lot after all the racism shit. And their arsehole of a manager.

[ADP 0]

Scousers up in arms about this Alan Davies business. There was a Liverpool fanzine editor on 5 Live earlier furious because "there's no right and wrong way to grieve".

 

We fucking know that man, but life does go on. Comes a point where it stops being grieving and just becomes wallowing in self pity. No one else carries on like this.

 

I have every sympathy with the families of the dead, but Liverpool cannot be allowed to dictate when they will and won't play games any more than any other club can. Move on ffs.

 

I think people are at the end of their tether with this lot after all the racism shit. And their arsehole of a manager.

 

Completely agree.

[Gemmill 46027]

Btw Davies has just announced a tour and plays Liverpool in September.

[SloopJohn 0]

Btw Davies has just announced a tour and plays Liverpool in September.

 

[Sonatine 11542]

Btw Davies has just announced a tour and plays Liverpool in September.

 

Should get it sponsored by the Sun

[Guest CabayeAye]

Fucking sc*use twats. If they want justice for the 96, then that would be provided by banning Liverpool fans from attending away matches for a season.

 

Unbelievable how the murdering cunts can kill their own and other fans on several occasions and still have the audacity to self-pity about it.

 

Wankers should be forced to issue an apology for the behaviour of their board, management, players and fans over the last 110 years.

[Happy Face 29]

Work want me to come in on the anniversary of my Nanna's death.

 

Sorry but Happy Face just doesn't do work on that hallowed anniversary and they'll have to put it in their pipe and smoke it.

 

Now, what date was it my Nanna died....?

[Craig 6700]

Scousers up in arms about this Alan Davies business. There was a Liverpool fanzine editor on 5 Live earlier furious because "there's no right and wrong way to grieve".

 

We f*cking know that man, but life does go on. Comes a point where it stops being grieving and just becomes wallowing in self pity. No one else carries on like this.

 

I have every sympathy with the families of the dead, but Liverpool cannot be allowed to dictate when they will and won't play games any more than any other club can. Move on ffs.

 

I think people are at the end of their tether with this lot after all the racism sh!t. And their ar$ehole of a manager.

 

Aye I've had to ensure a whole heap of "can you believe the FA had the nerve to expect us to play the FA Cup SF on April 15th?, blah, blah, blah".

 

It's a date on the calendar that just happens to co-incide with that disaster. Weren't Liverpool also complaining about having to go all the way to Wembley too? FA should have called their bluff, insisted it was on April 15th and move it to Hillsborough.

[Andrew 4857]

Or just said "fine you're forfeiting the match then"